Is Tommen going to have to die before ASoIaF is over?

[Fire Eater]

Cersei is not in a great position to crown anyone, her impending trial and in this scenario grieving for her lost son. I do agree that HG and Cersei would oppose Stannis, I meant on a broader scale outside of KL. Besides Mycella is in Dorne, it would be difficult to actually get her back to KL considering her current condition.

Eta. Spelling

According to Arianne, Myrcella is being brought back to KL with Tyene and Nymeria.

[TalalOfDorne]

According to Arianne, Myrcella is being brought back to KL with Tyene and Nymeria.

This is going to be very interesting IMO.

And unfortunately yes, I think Tommen is doomed.

[blood of the dragoon]

By right of succession, yes. Cersei will take drastic measures to ensure the Tyrells' loyalty.

More like she'll go to drastic measures to screw the Tyrells.

And only targs follow agnatic primogenture. All other non-dornish houses follow male preference primogenture. So Myrcella is absolutely Tommen's heir. Unless politics comes into play.

But... Gold shall be their crowns and gold their shrouds. Myrcella WILL be queen.

[Gnivil]

More like she'll go to drastic measures to screw the Tyrells.

And only targs follow agnatic primogenture. All other non-dornish houses follow male preference primogenture. So Myrcella is absolutely Tommen's heir. Unless politics comes into play.

But... Gold shall be their crowns and gold their shrouds. Myrcella WILL be queen.

Isn't Stannis officially Tommen's heir, or was he disowned?

[jons nissa]

Isn't Stannis officially Tommen's heir, or was he disowned?

i think it would be particularly amusing if (sadly!) tommen dies and stannis is found to be next in line for the throne but is considered an invalid option due to his treason and they move to someone else. talk about grinding one's teeth.

[King Stannis]

Tommen is unfortunatly a sweet kid sitting on the Iron Throne, giving him a double reason to get killed. If Cersei's trial or Aegon's arrival swing Tyrell support fully away from the Lannister's, Randyll Tarly seems like just the type who'd do the deed.

Why would Tyrell support go to Aegon, when they have so much invested in making Margaery Queen?

[Kronz]

She could try to marry Aegon, fourth time's a charm?

[Ser Luke.]

Tommen and Myrcella are both very likely to die before the series' end.

[Mad Monkey]

Isn't Stannis officially Tommen's heir, or was he disowned?

Does the law put Stannis before Myrcella?

Oh here's a thought -- what if the paperwork to declare Stannis a traitor was never officially filed? Wouldn't it be awkward if Cersei had to send a sheepish raven over to Stannis acknowledging his claim to the throne and inviting him and his army to occupy King's Landing as Tommen's rightful heir?

Why would Tyrell support go to Aegon, when they have so much invested in making Margaery Queen?

Mace: "Hey, Marge! Marge! Remember how you married Renly, and he died? And then you married Joffrey, and he died? Well, guess what...?"

Margaery: "Oh gods, don't tell me..

Mace: "Yep, Tommen's snuffed it. Those Baratheons are made of flimsy stuff, amirite? Lucky for you I was down at Griffin's Roost and I picked you out a new one. How would you like to marry Aegon VI Targaryen?? Since he's already dead, he can never die, as the ironmen would say. Ha! But in all seriousness, Meg, you're going to have to be careful with this one. To lose one husband may be regarded as a misfortune; to lose three looks like carelessness."

Margaery: "Thanks, Dad." <_<

[Myvince]

There will be several people who are going to sit on the throne before the end, so Tommen's days are numbered sad to say.

There only two book left, I don't really see it. I think GRRM was talking about the show.

[DavosSeaworthy]

I would love for him to live. I hate the Maggy the Frog prophecy more than anything else in the series.

[Harle The Handsome]

Sorry but can I disagree for a moment about Myrcella being crowned if Tommen dies. IIRC after the dance of the dragons the succession for the throne puts females behind all male family. So Stannis would be next and might gain the support of even some Lannister loyalist. Succession for the throne is different from a lordship or castle.

Daughters come before uncles. It is known.

[blood of the dragoon]

Isn't Stannis officially Tommen's heir, or was he disowned?

Myrcella's claim ABSOLUTELY comes before stannis's, even if he weren't attainted for treason, which he is. This is of course assuming all of cersei's kids are legitimate, as almost all of westeros does.

[Light a wight tonight]

Ser Pounce is no match for Bloodraven Balerion.

Ser Pounce is the younger, more beautiful cat who will take everything Balerion holds dear and cast him down.

[Gnivil]

Daughters come before uncles. It is known.

Really? I always thought uncles came before daughters, basically all men came before women unless said man is only a possible heir through the female line.

[CptSpaulding]

Mcrcella's claim is not ABSOLUTELY before Stannis. The modified agnatic primogeniture that the Targs used would not put her first. No I do agree that the Targ practice may not be used in the current dynasty. The Baratheons were not in power long enough to set a precident. Yes Stannis has been attained and should be out of the line of succession. Cersei and the Tyrells will never support his claim but some might. The high septon still has not blessed king Tommen and we do not know were the Faith will side in succession rights. They will probably not support Stannis either.

I am not claiming to know the answer, just saying when Tommen dies I see a split in the factions on who has the right of succsession.

[House Of Wolves]

I guess im in the minority but i think one of them will live out of Tommen and Myrcella, I think the prophecy "gold shall be there shrouds" means something different for one of them. Shroud can actually just simply mean something that conceals, protects, or screens.

My theory is "gold" represents Jamie. I mean come on the guy has golden hair, golden armor , he even has a golden hand! So the prophecy could mean simply Jaime "gold" will protect and conceal "shroud" one of them.

[blood of the dragoon]

Mcrcella's claim is not ABSOLUTELY before Stannis. The modified agnatic primogeniture that the Targs used would not put her first. No I do agree that the Targ practice may not be used in the current dynasty. The Baratheons were not in power long enough to set a precident. Yes Stannis has been attained and should be out of the line of succession. Cersei and the Tyrells will never support his claim but some might. The high septon still has not blessed king Tommen and we do not know were the Faith will side in succession rights. They will probably not support Stannis either.

I am not claiming to know the answer, just saying when Tommen dies I see a split in the factions on who has the right of succsession.

Fair enough. Under Baratheon and Lannister rules she comes first.

And if course politics will come into play, I'm just speaking from a strictly legalistic stand.

Great name, btw.

And to 'light a wight tonight'

You're alright.

[aWildlingontheIronThrone]

I guess im in the minority but i think one of them will live out of Tommen and Myrcella, I think the prophecy "gold shall be there shrouds" means something different for one of them. Shroud can actually just simply mean something that conceals, protects, or screens.

My theory is "gold" represents Jamie. I mean come on the guy has golden hair, golden armor , he even has a golden hand! So the prophecy could mean simply Jaime "gold" will protect and conceal "shroud" one of them.

:agree: If Tommen is going to survive, he needs to be far away from Cersei!

Maybe if she just believe's he's dead, then the prophesy is still coming true? :dunno:

[BallpointBanana]

Yes, I think Tommen will die.

Like most I assume all prophecies are accurate. They all seem to be anyway.

Anyways, I believe that the one to do the deed will be Arya.

I think this because:

-The Iron Bank of Braavos has no love for Tommen, but is aligned to his heir apparent, Stannis. They need Tommen out of the way. I'm not entirely sure if it's ever stated that their is a link between the Faceless Men and the Iron Bank, but I always assumed the expense of an assassin's contract was a major source of the Iron Bank's wealth. Would they not involve an assassin to help them get their dues?

-Cersei is prophecised to be taken down by someone younger, and more beautiful. The assumption is Margaery, but Arya is said to have the look of Lyanna, who was a legendary beauty. It seems that Arya will grow into a fine specimen herself.

Arya will surely have to assassinate someone aside from a deserter in her story arc. Someone major. I struggle to see other candidates as of now.

(As an aside, this is my first post here! I just finished reading Dance with Dragons recently, and my head is swimming wondering what happens next. I'm sure you all know the feeling.)