Bartimus Stone Posted August 11, 2013 Share Posted August 11, 2013 The very first chapter of the first book, Ned Stark executes a Brother of the Nights Watch for breaking his vows and leaving his post, deserting. I find it interesting that Ned Stark is "not" supposed to send the deserter back to the Nights Watch for them to deal with. Can just anyone cut off the head of someone from the Nights Watch who breaks a vow. You would think they would want to handle that in house to get all the details, a trial in other words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckthorn Posted August 11, 2013 Share Posted August 11, 2013 Because as a "Warden" of the King's regions he is charged with handing out the King's Justice as Warden of the North. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thendel Posted August 11, 2013 Share Posted August 11, 2013 Deserters are fair game for anyone, yes. Given that you pretty much know a deserter when you've got one, there isn't really any need for a trial. That Ned happens to execute a deserter who actually had a story to tell is kind of unfortunate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eggs Posted August 11, 2013 Share Posted August 11, 2013 You would think they would want to handle that in house to get all the details, a trial in other words.why? a deserter is a deserter is a deserter. whats a trial going to do besides waste the Watch's time?Because as a "Warden" of the King's regions he is charged with handing out the King's Justice as Warden of the North.^this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Tippy Wolfsbane Posted August 11, 2013 Share Posted August 11, 2013 The very first chapter of the first book, Ned Stark executes a Brother of the Nights Watch for breaking his vows and leaving his post, deserting. I find it interesting that Ned Stark is "not" supposed to send the deserter back to the Nights Watch for them to deal with. Can just anyone cut off the head of someone from the Nights Watch who breaks a vow. You would think they would want to handle that in house to get all the details, a trial in other words.I guess the way the Night's Watch views it, if you had a problem you should have tried to settle it in house before you decided to run away. If your problem is with the Night's Watch itself, well...you signed up for life, so deal with it or risk being executed for desertion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaarioKnowsBest Posted August 11, 2013 Share Posted August 11, 2013 Also probably too much of a headache. The Lord would have to send a team of his men to escort the guy back to the Wall. Cheaper just to go ahead and deal with ir Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leif Posted August 11, 2013 Share Posted August 11, 2013 Because as a "Warden" of the King's regions he is charged with handing out the King's Justice as Warden of the North.Yup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WightsNatch Posted August 11, 2013 Share Posted August 11, 2013 Yes, he's The Warden, but does The NW fall under the King's jurisdiction in that way? Based on the evidence, probably yes. The laws of Westeros undoubtably apply to the entire country, e.g. Castle Black because it is situated in Westeros etc. But apparently the "internal" rules of the NW apply to Westeros itself as well. So there must be a special decree, law or binding contract between the IT or Winterfell and the NW. Q though: would a bannerman have this power as well? Or would the Umbers or Boltons hand a deserter over to the Warden of the North? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartimus Stone Posted August 11, 2013 Author Share Posted August 11, 2013 It just seems to me that when a person takes the vow of the nights watch, he becomes the property of them as well. I find it hard to believe that they would feel comfortable with someone else handing out a sentence. Ned should keep the deserter until a Yoren passes through and send him back with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twookus Stark Posted August 11, 2013 Share Posted August 11, 2013 Each lord is like the sheriff of his lands while Ned would be like chief of police so depending on who's land the deserter was caught on, maybe certain lords would send him back to the wall or execute him or send him to Ned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Spark of House Spark Posted August 11, 2013 Share Posted August 11, 2013 Yes, he's The Warden, but does The NW fall under the King's jurisdiction in that way? Based on the evidence, probably yes. The laws of Westeros undoubtably apply to the entire country, e.g. Castle Black because it is situated in Westeros etc. But apparently the "internal" rules of the NW apply to Westeros itself as well. So there must be a special decree, law or binding contract between the IT or Winterfell and the NW.Q though: would a bannerman have this power as well? Or would the Umbers or Boltons hand a deserter over to the Warden of the North?When Queen Alysanne visited the wall on her dragon she gave the Watch the lands adjoining the wall - "the Gift", and they in return named the Queen's tower in her honour. Would this not imply that the wall is outside of Westeros? Also, the sins of a man are forgiven and forgotten once he joins the watch, so he starts a new life outside the law of Westeros Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fallen Posted August 11, 2013 Share Posted August 11, 2013 ` A brother who wasn't a deserter would probably carry something on him. The guy Ned killed had already been questioned by Ned's men. Once it's been established that he's a deserter there's nothing left to do except execute him. I think if someone like Yoren never returns then the Night's Watch would probably send someone to inquire. But someone like Gared would be assumed to be a deserter by the Night's Watch. Especially if he's found south of the Wall when his mission was north of the Wall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartimus Stone Posted August 11, 2013 Author Share Posted August 11, 2013 When Queen Alysanne visited the wall on her dragon she gave the Watch the lands adjoining the wall - "the Gift", and they in return named the Queen's tower in her honour. Would this not imply that the wall is outside of Westeros? Also, the sins of a man are forgiven and forgotten once he joins the watch, so he starts a new life outside the law of WesterosAnother thing, the King has no say in who The Lord Commander is. When Tywin sent Janos Slynt to the Wall, they sent word that he is a close friend of the King and it would be nice to see him at that position. It says that the King has no rule of the Wall, if he did he would order them to make Janos The Lord. The Watch rules themselves and wonder if Ned was out of line taking the boys head for deserting. I wonder if Ned informed them of his beheading Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartimus Stone Posted August 11, 2013 Author Share Posted August 11, 2013 Also, could Ned Stark have been covering up what the kid was saying about seeing the Others and took off his head. Did Ned have reason to keep something like this quiet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jory Cassel Posted August 11, 2013 Share Posted August 11, 2013 It just seems to me that when a person takes the vow of the nights watch, he becomes the property of them as well. I find it hard to believe that they would feel comfortable with someone else handing out a sentence. Ned should keep the deserter until a Yoren passes through and send him back with him.This would be quite the impractical course of action, keeping a deserter alive who is going to die eventually is simply illogical, if the man is beheaded by the NW or by a Warden does not matter, not even speaking of the unnecessary effort of sustaining a prisoner who has to be taken to the wall consequently.Another thing, the King has no say in who The Lord Commander is. When Tywin sent Janos Slynt to the Wall, they sent word that he is a close friend of the King and it would be nice to see him at that position. It says that the King has no rule of the Wall, if he did he would order them to make Janos The Lord. The Watch rules themselves and wonder if Ned was out of line taking the boys head for deserting. I wonder if Ned informed them of his beheadingyes, Mormont had gotten word of the beheading and wonders about the desertion of a seasoned man like this, he abides completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fallen Posted August 11, 2013 Share Posted August 11, 2013 Also, could Ned Stark have been covering up what the kid was saying about seeing the Others and took off his head. Did Ned have reason to keep something like this quiet? Ned chalked it up to a deserter wiling to say anything. There was no reason for anyone to believe that the Others had returned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blood of the dragoon Posted August 11, 2013 Share Posted August 11, 2013 Ned is second only to the king on his own land. He can really do just about anything. The wall is a tricky jurisdiction though, but they don't seem to have the same ideas as us about justification anyway. Nobody claimed Cat's arrest of Tyrion was illegal, only unwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartimus Stone Posted August 11, 2013 Author Share Posted August 11, 2013 You would at least think that the Watch would want the kid alive so they know what happened to the other brothers.Also the NW had the authority to give a castle to Stannis. They rule themselves. You would think they would want their own deserter to question and punish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fourth Dragon Head Posted August 11, 2013 Share Posted August 11, 2013 Though there is a super crackpot theory that the Night's King was a Stark, and that all the Starks have the blood of the Others. Not saying I buy it, but there's your answer for why he "silenced" the deserter! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaarioKnowsBest Posted August 11, 2013 Share Posted August 11, 2013 The guy is NW property and NW property trespasses onto the Kings property uninvited. It goes both ways NW has no authority over the Lords and such Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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