Lady Fevre Dream Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 Jesus Christ I said it at least 5 times already. She does need him, but the trust is gone, it not that easy to get over such a major betrayal. Its actually quite understandable why she would have problems in trusting him again.Okay, I think I get your jist. What is it that you do want to discuss? Perhaps exactly how or why Dany should be convinced to trust him and take him back as an advisor? I agree that the original idea of bringing Tyrion to her as a prisoner was a bit lame, but it was also a plan concocted on the spur of the moment while drunk and at a brothel.I guess I would ask.......what is it you want to happen that would make it okay for Dany to accept Jorah back into her services?ETA: Is there anything that you think would make it possible for Dany to accept him back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheZone Posted September 20, 2013 Author Share Posted September 20, 2013 I have to make this explicit once again I understand that she needs him,but he is not a good guy, he's lucky she did not take his life. It will be hard to trust him because he betrayed her. Why is this so hard to grasp ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Bong of Ice and Fire Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 I have to make this explicit once again I understand that she needs him,but he is not a good guy, he's lucky she did not take his life. It will be hard to trust him because he betrayed her. Why is this so hard to grasp ?Do you foresee their expected reunion turning tragic? Will Dany kill Jorah? Or the other way around? :o Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheZone Posted September 20, 2013 Author Share Posted September 20, 2013 Okay, I think I get your jist. What is it that you do want to discuss? Perhaps exactly how or why Dany should be convinced to trust him and take him back as an advisor? I agree that the original idea of bringing Tyrion to her as a prisoner was a bit lame, but it was also a plan concocted on the spur of the moment while drunk and at a brothel.I guess I would ask.......what is it you want to happen that would make it okay for Dany to accept Jorah back into her services?ETA: Is there anything that you think would make it possible for Dany to accept him back?Dany can accept him back at anytime, but he needs to watched by someone like a hawk, it should be made clear that he is not on the same level he was, and he is only there to advise her and perhaps fight for her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Fevre Dream Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 Well, I'm still not sure.....that makes it sound like, in your eyes, Annazon (TERRIFIC NAME, by the way) that Jorah really can never do anything that you find worthy enough for a fresh start at Dany's side? I wouldn't want to put words in your mouth.I'm not sure what response you are looking for. Do you want Dany to execute him, then? Bannish him again? Is there nothing that would make you comfortable with Dany forgiving (but not forgetting), and letting him back into her service in some capacity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheZone Posted September 20, 2013 Author Share Posted September 20, 2013 Do you foresee their expected reunion turning tragic? Will Dany kill Jorah? Or the other way around? :oI don't want Dany to die, but I can not expect her to live especially with GRRM. So I can't tell you, but that would be an interesting twist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheZone Posted September 20, 2013 Author Share Posted September 20, 2013 Well, I'm still not sure.....that makes it sound like, in your eyes, Annazon (TERRIFIC NAME, by the way) that Jorah really can never do anything that you find worthy enough for a fresh start at Dany's side? I wouldn't want to put words in your mouth.I'm not sure what response you are looking for. Do you want Dany to execute him, then? Bannish him again? Is there nothing that would make you comfortable with Dany forgiving (but not forgetting), and letting him back into her service in some capacity?You struck the nail on the head right there. Its about not allowing anything of such magnitude happen again, she can never trust him the way she did before. She had to learn hard lessons for making such mistakes. He can be welcomed, but not with opened arms, and after some time, he can be allowed more and more freedom, but for now, he deserves to be watched.PS: Thank you, I am really tall so my friend came up with Annazon, because the river is so long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Fevre Dream Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 Dany can accept him back at anytime, but he needs to watched by someone like a hawk, it should be made clear that he is not on the same level he was, and he is only there to advise her and perhaps fight for her.I can totally see that, okay that is what I wasn't sure about, how much, how far, how little you were or weren't willing for Dany to trust him. I can see that, trust but verify? Keep an eye on him. If anything, it's the wee chance of......as posted previously, if I can't have her no one can.........that would be the only worry, but I do think Jorah has come through to the other side from his bad bought with darkness. I'm just not sure how shaky his ground is now. The smart thing would be to not give him as much as before, slowly prove himself and earn his way. A conversation with him actually admitting all he did, and a really apology unshaded by fear and anger would be a good start. But his actions should speak the loudest.I can totally get behind that, I don't think she should let him right back at her side. And, thanks for explaining. It should take time, not an insta-repair of their relationship and trust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Fevre Dream Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 You struck the nail on the head right there. Its about not allowing anything of such magnitude happen again, she can never trust him the way she did before. She had to learn hard lessons for making such mistakes. He can be welcomed, but not with opened arms, and after some time, he can be allowed more and more freedom, but for now, he deserves to be watched.PS: Thank you, I am really tall so my friend came up with Annazon, because the river is so long.I have my moments of clarity, LOLI do think even Jorah realizes things can never be the same, or I hope. He will have to accept that if he wants to help her and if he wants to return for his own chances in Westeros, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheZone Posted September 20, 2013 Author Share Posted September 20, 2013 I can totally see that, okay that is what I wasn't sure about, how much, how far, how little you were or weren't willing for Dany to trust him. I can see that, trust but verify? Keep an eye on him. If anything, it's the wee chance of......as posted previously, if I can't have her no one can.........that would be the only worry, but I do think Jorah has come through to the other side from his bad bought with darkness. I'm just not sure how shaky his ground is now.The smart thing would be to not give him as much as before, slowly prove himself and earn his way. A conversation with him actually admitting all he did, and a really apology unshaded by fear and anger would be a good start. But his actions should speak the loudest.I can totally get behind that, I don't think she should let him right back at her side.And, thanks for explaining. It should take time, not an insta-repair of their relationship and trust.Exactly ! :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Pounce FTW Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 I have to make this explicit once again I understand that she needs him,but he is not a good guy, he's lucky she did not take his life. It will be hard to trust him because he betrayed her. Why is this so hard to grasp ?I'm not sure why you feel the need to use such a large font. My eyes aren't that bad.He betrayed her but realized his mistake before she ever found out about it and has been working as her most loyal subject since. Given how often Martin has a character redeem themselves, I suppose I find it hard to understand why you are so focused on his error. He's a slave, for Pete's sake! And all the while, he wasn't trying to save himself or create a comfortable life for himself, but is ACTIVELY trying to redeem himself to Dany! That is huge considering most of these characters are merely trying to redeem themselves to the reader. Dany will most likely not ever understand his change and efforts but the reader can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Selig Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 Jorah is a really pathetic loser and scumbag. Enslaving people so your wife can get more expensive trinkets - that's about as pathetic as it gets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Fevre Dream Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 Exactly ! :lol:By the way, that explaination of your name, makes it even better. :cheers:I don't think things between Dany and Jorah can ever be the same, but I am thinking that there is a possibility that Jorah realizes that. I'm hoping, silly girl that I am. I swear, this thread is not showing off my cynical qualities. Next thing ya know, I'll be predicting that Sansa finds her Prince Charming. I still have a soft spot for the idea of her marrying Willas Tyrell, but that's another thread and another day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Fevre Dream Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 Jorah is a really pathetic loser and scumbag. Enslaving people so your wife can get more expensive trinkets - that's about as pathetic as it gets.I think Jorah thinks that this was one of his more despicable acts, too. I don't think he takes pride in it, that's why the story was so hard for Dany to drag out of him. His shame at this act I think is very transparent.Something about this came up in another thread recently. There was discussion about what was the penalty for those poachers he caught on his land. (Lawd, I hear TvJorah's voice in my head now), and it lead to how we don't seem to be quite sure what the penalty would be. It seems that it might go area by area, Lord by Lord, lose a limb, go to the wall, I'm not really certain. I'm sure some real nutjob like Bolton might have executed them, if they interrupted his own hunt with their poaching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearlthegirl Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 I think Jorah thinks that this was one of his more despicable acts, too. I don't think he takes pride in it, that's why the story was so hard for Dany to drag out of him. His shame at this act I think is very transparent.Yes but....he's still real pissed at the Ned, for CATCHING him! And he got busted and acted too proud for forgiveness with Dany, too, getting him banned a second time! His pride seems to get in his own way when he's guilty of something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheZone Posted September 20, 2013 Author Share Posted September 20, 2013 Jorah is a really pathetic loser and scumbag. Enslaving people so your wife can get more expensive trinkets - that's about as pathetic as it gets. Yes I even forgot about that ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheZone Posted September 20, 2013 Author Share Posted September 20, 2013 By the way, that explaination of your name, makes it even better. :cheers:I don't think things between Dany and Jorah can ever be the same, but I am thinking that there is a possibility that Jorah realizes that. I'm hoping, silly girl that I am. I swear, this thread is not showing off my cynical qualities. Next thing ya know, I'll be predicting that Sansa finds her Prince Charming. I still have a soft spot for the idea of her marrying Willas Tyrell, but that's another thread and another day.Being cynical is overrated ! and yes 6'1 women unite ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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