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MakeThemBurn

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  1. Strange. I had a post about the Ice Queen 2 years ago and it's been "archived". Not showing under search result.

  2. MakeThemBurn

    Protagonist suddenly goes crazy in last chapter of epic

    At this point I truly believe the show will end in a different manner than the books. Nothing on the show makes any sense. No mention of the valonqar and instead we get tacky fan services like cleganebowl and silly scenes of the twins Cersei and Jaime dying in each others arms. The show has never understood Daenerys' character, what they did with Mereen is a clear example of that. Even some directors said they don't understand the character. Now I don't doubt that GRRM's Dany might seem crazy in the eyes of the Westerosi, that much I actually believe in. The entire point of Dany's Mereen arc was to point out the differences between Essos and Westeros. The former is a much, much crueler and barbaric place. In Essosi eyes (slavemasters) Westerosi behaviour (Barristan Selmy) is perceived weakness, whereas in Westerosi eyes Essosi behaviour is considered mad. Now Dany has no choice but to be a dragon aka become violent in order to manage with the slavemasters, sellswords and the dohtraki. But her dilemma is that in order for her to do that she will be perceived mad by the Westerosi. I don't think for a second that GRRM is planning Dany to go mad like on the show but the subtleties do point out that she will be perceived as one. Also, even during last season I thought FAeagon was too big a character to cut. Dany was OP without FAegon to fight against and they had to come up with all sorts of silly plotlines to make it seem like she has a hard time. That choice also threw Varys under the bus. This season they've pasted elements ftom the FAegon plot threads on Cersei and Jon - and now I believe - also on Dany. The show has always awkwardly bent it's characters to suit certain plot points. They needed a sacked King's Landing but without a possible dance of dragons they were forced to have Dany do it.
  3. MakeThemBurn

    Season 8: News, Spoilers And Leaks

    The child is The prince that was promised. And I whole-heartedly disagree with the "fan-based" notion. Fan-based ideas revolve around putting Jon on the Iron Throne and Tyrion on the back of a dragon, none of which are backed by the themes and characterizations in the story. Jon's entire story arc has been about the Night King and his bastardhood. Daenerys has been all about motherhood and raising armies and titles referencing the Night King. (The Dothraki are described very much like wildlings and the Unsullied are practically zombies who are told not to have any fear or pain all the while chanting "valar morghulis"). Her army will make the future army of the dead. Both had relationships with characters that served as plot tools to foreshadow their future relationship. But most importantly the Night King has been mentioned in the books very briefly but the few mentions we have all say that he has a wife. Are you familiar with how Yi Ti explains the Long Night? It's basically talking about Daenerys. According to their story the Night Queen's (maiden made of light) son ruled over mortals but one day he was killed. The NQ was so enraged about this that she and her husband attacked the world and thus started the Long Night. Once Dany is the Night Queen no one will dare to hurt her child or the slaves who she calls her children out of fear of her. This is how she stabilizes her rule. And it's completely plot driven. Even Dany's titles refer to the Night King. The Others are said to arrive in a storm (stormborn). The Night King is unaffected by fire (unburnt). Khaleesi = queen. The rest of the titles reference her status as the Mother which tie her to the seven gods of the Faith and the Yi Ti story. Even the show's version of the House of the Undying had her cross the Wall and walk to the north where she met Khal Drogo and her son. Khal Drogo is a plot tool foreshadowing Jon Snow just like Ygritte was a plot tool foreshadowing Daenerys.
  4. MakeThemBurn

    Season 8: News, Spoilers And Leaks

    Actually it's "to go forward, I must go back. But if I look back I'm lost". She won't understand the meaning of it until she accepts her destiny as the Night Queen and lets Jon convert her.
  5. MakeThemBurn

    Season 8: News, Spoilers And Leaks

    All of the main characters have their tag lines they keep repeating in the books. Jon: "You know nothing Jon Snow" Dany: "To go forward, I must go back" Tyrion: "Where do whores go?" All of these are hinting at the end game. Jon is wrong about the motivations of the Night King and also, he is most likely never gonna find out about his real parents. At this point he is sailing towards Winterfell and The Wall has come down. They will most likely confront the army of the dead before making it to Winterfell where Bran and Samwell know about his parents. Jon has already been resurrected by fire and he will be resurrected by ice and become the new Night King. But before that happens, Dany has lost her men. So there will be a battle with the current Night King at some point. But as leaks from season 8 and Dany's House of the Undying vision (show version) and Bran's vision prove, the Night King will make it to King's Landing and take it down with his dragon. Dany will become the Night Queen. That is where her tag line refers to. Her story literally started with her marrying a scary barbarian - Khal Drogo. He worked as a plot tool to foreshadow her "marriage" to the Night King. Important notion here is - and one the show understandably changed - that Daenerys wanted to sleep with Khal Drogo in their wedding night. It was a rape on the show but in the books she gets turned on by Khal Drogo and pulls him closer. This is a hint that her conversion happens voluntarily. And that is a nod to the Nissa Nissa story aswell. NN voluntarily sacrificed herself to give birth to Lightbringer. As we now know the original Night King was created with a knife stabbed to his heart. The Nissa Nissa story itself is a hint about the cyclical timeline. Nissa Nissa comes from the words Mhysa Mhysa but as time has passed, the words have changed. That is a reoccurring incident in this story. Things that refer to current phenomena have changed due to the time loop. Lightbringer isn't a sword, it's her baby: The prince that was promised. Tyrion's story is rather tragic since he becomes the man he hates the most - his father. One point the books make so much clearer is that Tyrion is despised by everyone and this starts to eat him inside. Most importantly, he is despised and betrayed by women. His first love was a whore - or that is what he has been told, his second love Shae betrayed him and slept with his father and Cersei hates her like no other. By book 5, when he has landed in Essos he keeps repeating the words "where do whores go". He is referring to his first love that he has lost. Unlike with Jon and Dany, we know what Tyrion's tag line seemingly refers to. The important part here is where he says it. He keeps uttering these words on his way to meet the most beautiful woman in Essos - Daenerys Targaryen. This ties Tyrion to Dany's three betrayals, the last being a betrayal for love. In other words, Tyrion is going to fall in love with Daenerys and it's gonna end bad since no one loves Tyrion back. That's the tragedy of Tyrion. He dreams of finding love, ruling his House and riding dragons but he will never accomplish any of those. Also, in the first drafts of the story GRRM had a very similar love triangle between Jon, Tyrion and Arya. It seems he kept it by switching Arya with Dany. It is this plot twist the show was hintint at with the weird boat scene where Tyrion looms in the shadows watching Jon enter Dany's cabin. How is Tyrion going to betray Daenerys? He will take away her power source - Drogon. Dany's three treasons will all happen with poison. Mirri Maz Duur poisoned Khal Drogo (betrayal for blood), someone in Mereen tried to poison her (betrayal for gold) and Tyrion will poison Drogon (betrayal for love). This also ties to Dany's "to go forward, I must go back" by Tyrion taking the role of Mirri Maz Duur and taking away her source of power. Tyrion is the only main character who is interested in the dragons and he is the only one who has talked about how to kill them in the books. The show has also made it very clear that he is not a fan of them in season 7. Tyrion was seen protesting the use of dragons every single time Dany either proposed it or actually did it. In the end he will be the last villain of ice and fire and in that end become just like his father Tywin by inheriting this "balance disturbing" role House Lannister has. When Dany loses Drogon she will have nothing left to protect her son with. This is why she voluntarily converts to ice. This is also talked about in the book version of House of the Undying where she is referred to as the bride of fire and told to drink from both the cup of fire and cup of ice. I believe Arya will be the one to kill Tyrion. We have seen in the last season that she will take down anyone who threatens Jon and when Tyrion puts Dany and Jon's baby that she carries in danger, she will hit back. Also, Cersei is sure that Tyrion is the one who kills her. In the end she will be wrong again thinking that she is right. It's Tyrion's face that will look at her but it's actually Arya wearing his face. Jaime on the other hand will get a nice redemption arc. He is haunted by the fact he's a kingslayer and by becoming the Hand for Dany's and Jon's baby, he gets to redeem himself. He will also rebuild his own House with the woman she loves and respects - Brienne. The same goes with Sansa. Ghost will remain with baby Targ, I believe that is what his name is hinting at. Ghost will be Jon's eyes to watch over his son. Jon always woved never to father a bastard so I think it will be very important for Jon to somehow be part of his son's life. So in the end Sansa too goes a full circle and becomes a queen like she wanted in book/season 1 albeit only temporarily. She will also be the last Stark with a direwolf by her side which symbolises her character growth. Gendry is bit of an oddball and that is due to the author. The story was originally supposed to be a trilogy but as it kept ballooning, Gendry's departure from the storyline kept getting longer aswell. I feel like him ruling Westeros with Sansa is something most people will have an issue with due to his absence. But thematically it makes perfect sense - the 3 Houses that joined forces to destroy House Targ are now joining forces to rebuild it.
  6. MakeThemBurn

    Season 8: News, Spoilers And Leaks

    It's quite obvious how the story will end imo. One important notion to make is that the story has a cyclical perception of time. The same things keep happening over and over again, only slightly changed. Therefore the story will end the way it started. Another important point to make is the balance of ice and fire. These two themes reveal the ending. The Targaryen symbol is a big hint itself. No one knows where it came from and what's the story behind the three headed dragon. The reality is that the three headed dragon refers to the three Targaryens who keep saving their House from extinction time and time again. We know of Doom of Valyria that killed all Targs - except Aegon and his 2 sisters who united the warring kingdoms of Westeros and rebuild their House. Now, yet again, the same thing has happened. Doom in this case is Robert's Rebellion and the three Targs who unite the yet again warring kingdoms and rebuild their House are Dany, Jon and their son. The balance of ice and fire is important aswell. All the dragonlords are dead and the Targaryens are the only ones left with fire magig running in their veins. Their blood affects everything. When Dany gave birth to the dragons, magical elements became stronger throughout the world. However, it needs to be pointed out that ice magic has simultaneously been growing in power. Ice and fire aren't at odd with one another, they are faces of the same coin, feeding one another. And the only family with ice magic in their veins is House Stark. Night King is a Stark. He controls the dead by warging and it's a skill we know only the Stark children have. The current Night King is not interested in fighting ice and fire. Jon is wrong on this ("You know nothing Jon Snow"). He is only interested in bringing back the magical balance and this is where House Lannister comes in. They are the biggest threat to both Targs and Starks. The Night King will not fly his ice dragon to Winterfell, he will fly it to King's Landing. Daenerys is very obviously becoming the Night Queen. Everything points at this. All of her dragons and men will die ("Valar Morghulis") and she will be betrayed by Tyrion ("betrayal for love"). So in the end she will be in charge of her own dead men and dragons. This will give her the leverage to install her baby boy at the head of Westeros. But she is not a Stark. She can not warg. So the role of the new Night King falls upon Jon Snow. This is where his Targ/Stark -role is goinh for. He can give Dany a full-blown Targ baby AND he can warg the dead. So in the end Jon and Dany become the new Night King and Queen and their baby son (The prince that was pomised) rebuilds his House with the help of Sansa (the younger, more beautiful queen), Gendry ("there is power in King's blood") and Jaime who works as his Hand. This way all the great Houses that joined forces to attack House Targaryen in Robert's Rebellion, join forces to rebuild it. Arya kills Cersei since she is the only character who can fulfill the double-gender in the valonqar prophecy AND she spent the first season running around the dungeons of King's Landing. In other words, she knows her way in. The face she will be wearing is Tyrions. More clues to this outcome are the 7 gods of The Faith. As I've said, the story is in a time loop and the 7 gods are actually referring to the 7 heroes of this story: Dany (mother), Jon (father), Gendry (smith), Jaime (warrior), Melisandre (crone), Sansa (maiden) and the Night King (stranger). Yes, the NK is listed as one of the heroes for a reason. Once the threat for ice and fire is gone the balance is restored again. Until centuries later people have forgotten about their history and try to kill the Targs again. Then Daenerys the Night Queen will return and do what she said she would do at the end of season 1: "I swear to you, those who would harm you will die screaming!" And the people at the time will treat her and Jon as monsters. Just like they are treating the current Night King. Samwell Tarly will write this story down, hoping people will remember what happened. But it will be in vain. As a matter of fact, the story has already been written in some form because Rhaegar Targaryen knew about the three headed dragon after he read about it in Oldtown.
  7. MakeThemBurn

    [Poll] How would you rate episode 510?

    I give it a 5 simply because it didn't make me feel anything. It was a collection of cliffhangers at the expense of storylines and closure. Seriously, every single character ended up on a cliffhanger. Every single one! Even Stannis got himself killed off-screen which will leave fans wondering whether Brienne actually did it. The episode was basically an hour long promo for season 6. Not a proper episode.
  8. MakeThemBurn

    [Poll] How would you rate episode 505

    I give it a seven. This is the first season where I've actually cared for Jon Snow. Oath-citing Jon from seasons 1 to 4 has fitted ill in a show that's supposed to be all about ruling. Really nice to see him take command. Having said that, the episode was a bit too heavy on the Wall and included a lot of scenes that were there just to give the actors something to do. Samwell Tarly has been irrelevant the entire season so they've decided to hook him up with the wildling woman. I find it ironic that people are complaining about the romance between Grey Worm and Missandei when the writers are doing the same thing with these two characters on the Wall. Loving Boltons at the Winterfell and the reveal of Reek. However, from a character progression point of view, Sansa's begaviour makes no sense. She's supposed to be a calculating person who manipulates people with her virtue and good manners. Yet she's behaving like the stroppy cow she was in season 2. Ramsay is like Joffrey 2.0 and this would have been the perfect place to show how Sansa has learned to deal with monsters. But instead she's going "this is my home, not yours" on them. I like Mereen but I feel like the writers are just coming up ways to show dragons. Drogon's return would have made a much bigger impact without the scene in the dungeon. It's obvious the show Dany has nothing to do with the book Dany but I wonder how they are going to explain her gaining control of her dragons. Her weakness was the reason she lost the control and her strength was the reason she gained it back. But here we have dragons gone wild without any reason. Are they relly just going to bring in Tyrion to make all things right? Valyria. LOVED it. Felt so sorry for Jorah but that's Game of thrones for you. No happy endings.
  9. MakeThemBurn

    How would you rate episode 504?

    It was ok. I always hate it how American shows have everyone speak English, yet throw in some odd accents just because it's exotic. That's what I remember the most about sand snakes. Why were they speaking with Spanish accents? If English isn't their language then why don't they just use their own like everyone does in Essos? Really starting to like Jaime. Mereen was well done. It was nice to have Selmy speak to Dany about Rhaegar. The thing that always puzzled me in the books was how little information Dany extracts from Selmy regarding her family and King's Landing in general. The slaughter was beautifully directed. I have only praise for the directors of this season. The slaughter itself only amused me. It's an open secret that Dany will unite the Dothrakis and cross the poison water with them so the tv show needs the Unsullied only for this season. Might aswell kill them all, I guess. However, what I find interesting is that some of the slaves have been working with the Sons of the Harpy in both of the attacks we've seen. This would suggest that Dany is doomed to fail since even the slaves work against her. King's Landing: Was Cersei really this dumb in the books? I watched this episode with a friend who hasn't read the books and he didn't understand why the Queen decides to arm religious fanatics because of a petty fight with Margaery. Neither did I. IIRC Cersei had some sound financial reasons to arm them in AFFC. As for the nutjobs: scarring their faces went a little overboard. Winterfell: Nothing makes sense to me here. Petyr doesn't trust Bolton, yet gives him his biggest asset. Sansa has suffered enough. If they make her suffer more in the hands of those psychopaths, I honestly can't say whether I can stomach all the evil on this show. The Wall: This is the first season where I enjoy Jon Snow. Finally this boring character is using his own brains and doing independent decisions! Melisandre is as corny as ever. What the hell was the scene with him and Jon about? Stannis shows his soft side which hints that either him or Shireen will die this season. They need to make the viewers like Stannis before his death or heartbreak can move us.
  10. I'm glad they wrote it like they did because TV is a more stupid media than books. That was pretty much what GRRM wrote in the books aswell, but he was more subtle with it. Book Selmy tries to tell Dany about her father but Dany cuts him short because she's already afraid of being daddy's girl. This is why Dany behaves the way she behaves and by the looks on the posts on this forum, it's a plot point missed by many. Glad the tv writers decided to make the point across with this scene so that even the simple ones understand Dany's motivations. What I didn't like about the scene where Dany delivered justice was the fact it was so out of character. Jon Snow is an honorable character, citing vows and following the rules. Dany is a moral character, who creates her own principles and defines what is right and what is wrong all by herself. Dany would never deliver death penalty because it was right in the light of justice system. That's what Jon would do. Dany would kill someone for being "bad", but that was not the case here. She clearly struggled with the decision. But again, TV is not literature, so I can understand the decision. Justice system holds great legitimacy so contrasting her actions with justice (and therefore what is generally viewed as right) instead of her own morals makes the point across more sharply.
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