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Sielk

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  1. Sielk

    The Great Debate: Should Jon Have Lied?

    Apart from all the valid points you two made I don't think that it really mattered what Jon said in this moment. In my opinion Cersei never planned for a single minute to help Jon and Dany fighting the Others. As soon as she recovered from the discovery that such a thing as wights really exists she probably began to develop the plan she later told to Jaime. It would be exactly like Cersei to underestimate a threat and instead try to let her enemies finish each other and I assumed even before the episode that this would be her reaction. The only difference made by Jon's words was that she didn't pretend to work with them. Probably she decided to go back to her original plan when Tyrion gave her the chance but I just don't believe that Cersei would really consider working together with an enemy to fight another one.
  2. I agree. I have also read the books even if I am not one of those who read it countless times. Of course not everything in the show is well done and some criticism is justified but what some of the users are doing here is not serious criticism, it's blatant hate. It's one thing to complain about plot holes when wights who can't cross a small gap in the ice suddenly pull a giant dragon out of the water but when people rant about every single episode and every detail in it that's not constructive anymore. If you know beforehand that you will never like anything that's not written in the books stop watching the show. But don't start ranting here after every new episode because yes, we have understood that there are people who can't stand the show and reading the whole hate posts over and over is just annoying.
  3. I gave it a 9. It was definitely my favourite episode of the season. As I generally dislike episodes which only concentrate on battle and neglect the story and the characters I was positively surprised by this one. In contrary to many other moments in this season, especially last week's episode with the giant plot holes, the plot seemed rather good to me this time and the characters behaved like they should. The meeting in the dragon pit: I really liked how they did the meeting. Beforehand I was afraid that they wound show the wight moving a bit and everyone in Cersei's party would say something like "Oh, doesn't seem so very dangerous..." but it was rather convincing. I already thought that Cersei would not recognise the threat and see it as an opportunity to get rid of her enemies as well but I don't understand the people lamenting that there are no surprises. Yes, Cersei's reaction was predictable but if you were surprised by every action she does she wouldn't have a character anymore. And Jon wouldn't be Jon anymore if he wasn't as honest as Ned. Jaime/Cersei parting: Very convincing as well how Jaime was torn between the loyalty to his sister and his honour. Littlefinger's trial: The show managed to surprise me. When Arya was brought in I really thought Sansa had gone back to trusting people she shouldn't trust. Awesome. Sam + Bran talking: Generally I liked the scene but Jon's name being Aegon is just stupid. And I didn't like that Rhaegar looked like an older version of Viserys. But on the other hand I always had a very clear picture of Rhaegar in my head and probably there is no actor that would have been satisfying. Jon/Dany: Well, we could see it coming. But I liked that they didn't make such a big deal of it. Wall falling: While I still grieve for Viserion the scene was well done and the cliffhanger annoyed me to no end (that is no criticism, cliffhangers should annoy) especially because it will be such a long wait.
  4. Of course you're right, what I said was speculation and more on the basis of the books. But I think you can't do much more than speculation when you talk about Elia and even more so when you just rely on the show as source. The only real show source (correct me if I am wrong!) about Elia's relationship to Rhaegar was what Oberyn said when he visited King's Landing. But to begin, he was not present during the three years Rhaegar and Elia where married so he can have an indirect impression of their marriage at best. And he was full of anger and a desire to get revenge for Elia and also grief when he said that. Combined with his character I strongly assume he didn't really care how his sister's marriage was in truth but just searched for a scapegoat he could hate for his sister's death. And Rhaegar was perfect for this role. So I would call Oberyn everything but a reliable source regarding this matter and thus, in my opinion, deprives us of every opportunity to give any real arguments on this which are not speculation.
  5. I agree with falcotron that we can defintely not draw the conclusion that the children were automatically made bastards when the marriage of their parents was annulled. While it is true that annullment means that the marriage wasn't valid from the start I can show you at least one historical example where the children weren't made bastards after the annulment and I am sure there are more. When the marriage of the french king Louis VII and his wife Eleanor of Aquitaine was annulled in 1152 their two daughters were declared legitimate. It is stated in this Wikipedia article and probably other sources so feel free to look it up. Of course we don't know if the laws for annulment are the same in Westeros but unless we know something that points in this direction it seems overhasty to be dead certain that Aegon and Rhaenys were made bastards. On grounds for the annulment we can only speculate. But when nobles in the middle ages wanted an annulment they usually found some reason and if not a "generous donation" to the church probably solved the problem. Henry VIII being the exception, of course. After all what we have heard about Rhaegar's personality I don't think he would have annulled the marriage without asking Elia. But I could imagine that Elia was not very happy in King's Landing because she didn't want the marriage from the start and was opposed by the whole court which thought her to be too frail and not worthy of the crown prince. So maybe she saw the annulment as a chance to return home.
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