Bud RR Martin

4

The episode was 'edge of the seat' while watching, but it fell apart when I turned my brain back on.  Killing what should have been the primary antagonist in a single episode was a tremendous let down.   Cersei and the elephant-less Golden Company don't appeal to me.

There is too much uproar about this Stannis stuff. I was not shocked at all. I am not upset about the act, but the flimsy reason for the sacrifice. We all knew it was coming. I am confident GRRM will make it more necessary and interesting than the show runners.

I've always believed one family in the story will be the Reynes of Castamere. The Starks were on their way, and the Lannisters seem likely at times, but I believe the killing of Shireen means the Baratheons will be eliminated by the story's end.

Wait... are you trusting D&D's interpretation of whatever Martin told them? Lol, honey, you're better than that!

I tell you. I'm 99.999999% the conversation was like this:

GRRM: So, Shireen gets burned in name of Stannis' cause.

DD: Awesome. Stannis burns Shireen.

GRRM: No, no... I said she gets burned on his name...

DD: So, he orders to burn her.

GRRM: Yes... :rolleyes: he burns her. :dunno:

DD: Cool.

You complain of the show's characterization of women, yet use the word "honey"?

What about if you all stop worrying whether I watch or not the show and try to use better defences than "if you don't like it, don't see it!".

Again, GoT is a very popular show that has a terrible portrayal of women. It deserves criticism and hard. If I see an offensive billboard on the street, I'm suppose to simply shut my eyes? No. Believe me. I live in a place with shows that are 1000% more offensives than GoT. For years, people has been saying "if you don't like it, don't watch it, then!". And guess what? We have even more offensive shows that portray racism and homophobia in a positive light and people still says "if you don't like it, don't see it!".

A citizen of the United States of the Offended.

Shocking? I thought her fate was spelled out a few episodes back, and I'm surprised how many people were surprised.

My thought exactly. Members of this forum have been discussing the scene since the season began. I don't understand why anyone would be "shocked".

Really? Did Sansa seem willing to have sex to you?

I can't even... did you miss Ramsay's sick, mocking smile? Sansa obvious reluctance to undress and the way she braced herself when Ramsay tore her dress and pushed her down, the desperate expression on her face? Her disstressed screams of pain? A crying, horrified Theon?

She obviously didn't want to marry Ramsay and she obviously hoped there will be no consumnation, but (unfortunately too late) realized that he's a dangerous psychopath who doesn't care for her consent at all and would take pleasure in hurting her, so it's better to comply or he'll hurt her even worse.

Anyway, pretty much everybody called this rape, including the people who are part of the show and the scene. If you're looking for definition of rape, try an explanatory dictionary. It is indeed true that it has changed through the times.

I wasn't a member of the forum during season 1-3. Were the reactions to the most recent scene similar to the reactions of Drogo/Daeny, or Edmure/Roslin?

Even if Olyvar wasn't his squire, it's not like a birthmark is some kind of top secret info. Hell, as the manager of a brothel he could easily have got it from a female whore... Not to mention servants, maesters, nurses, or casual conversations between family members.

And that abyss of utter retardation is where the bar is set for every plot point in the show right now. Nothing is even trying to make any sense anymore except Arya, and that's hardly a coincidence.

I've also tried to figure out why Olyvar would confess guilt for the same "crime". Wouldn't he be in a cell next to Loras?

Am I missing something? Why have people voted the episode at a 1?

I'm not sure. I think you may find the answer in the 31 pages of comments though.

He was not on duty at the time of the attack.

Or do you think he walks round in full armor for the fun of it?

Off duty? Selmy doesn't work at the Gap. He a knight, a queen's guard. Knights wear armor. Try all you like to explain it away, but a Queensguard out for a stroll, unarmored, in a city in turmoil doesn't make sense to me. He had a sword didn't he?

Actually the books say that they are not much cop as security guards, they tend to get fat and lazy out of formation.

And the odds were at least ten to one,

Have you ever worn armor? Even chain mail is a serious weight. That plate armor can only be worn for long periods on horseback.

On top of which, armor slows you down.

That's right. Armor is very heavy. Only a man that stood for hours a day protecting a king for several decades could be used to the weight, not Old feeble Selmy!

They're supposed to be soldiers, not warriors, big difference. The circumstances in which they were killed are highly disadvantageous for soldiers.

Yes, highly trained, shielded, and spear armed soldiers will always lose to dagger yielding former slave masters.

The Sand Snakes couldn't act themselves into a community theatre production of "Our Town".

I miss Tyrion talking to Varys in a box. Tyrion talking to Jorah in a boat wasn't as good. Varys is now off to join The Blackfish, The Brotherhood, and Gendry.

Unsullied aren't the warriors they've been advertised to be.

My initial reaction after the episode was "What did I just watch?" Therefore, the rating can't be higher than a 4. I'm considering now whether it was better or worse than episode 2.

Well, considering that 80% of users have rated the episode with a 7-10 score, you are in the minority here, my friend. Maybe it's hard to understand that some people have different tastes than yours...

"Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that." -- George Carlin

On par with the first two episodes, with this one slightly better than "bad".

Even my unsullied wife doesn't understand why Littlefinger is showing off Sansa "The Suspected King Slayer" to the world. Cersei would have LF, Sansa, AND probably the Boltons after removing them as Wardens of the North.

Furthermore, anyone with half a brain would now see Tyrion probably wasn't the guilty party.

We're all stuck in a gapping plot hole.

I'm also bothered that every character seems to know everything else. Arya easily removes the dead from her list, Davos can recite TKW vows, and the entire world seems to know Tywin Lannister is dead.

Since everyone seems to know everything, how long until word gets back to KL that Sansa is in the north with LF and will marry a Bolton? Has she been forgiven already?

I did a re-watch yesterday. Does anyone remember where Pod was during the Purple Wedding? He was the one that identified Sansa and Littlefinger in the Westeros Applebees.

Possible explanations:

1. he drowned on the way to Dorne

2. he's in a pub

3. he's in bed with Arianne

4. he's been eaten by a Sand Snake

5. he's training to be a maester in Oldtown

6. Cersei sent him with a Rosencrantz-Guildenstern letter which explains why she's forgotten him

7. He fell into a massive plot hole

Having read the books, I am aware of the many plot deviations, especially regarding Brienne, Sansa, and Jamie. However, the show has also condensed or omitted the many mundane and tedious characters and plots of book 5, which is quite welcome. I do applaud the HBO directors for moving this story along in a more fluid manner than Martin has recently. Tyrion's arc in book five was such arduous reading, and it was sad to see his character devolve into so many ludicrous situations. Pigs? Really?

I thought Tyrion's travels were the most interesting in book 5. Stonemen, time travel, slavers!

I'm hoping that Brienne and Pod will try to rescue Sansa Mance Rayder-style. Sansa and Theon escape Winterfell, but Brienne is captured. Once Ramsay finds out that Jaime was the one who sent Brienne, he'll threaten to kill Pod if she doesn't write a letter to Jaime saying she's found Sansa but needs his help.

A question: Why would Ramsay turn on the crown? The crown is the reason he his Bolton now and his father is Warden of the North.

This is the worst episode of 4.2 seasons. I fear it will be the first of many on the wrong side of the bell curve. Episode 2 was rushed, even to the point of being senseless. The show is clearly missing GRRM's input.

Brienne's portion was almost comical.