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Kal-L

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About Kal-L

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  1. Not sure what you mean but I have definitely seen a lot of Northerners fans claiming that Southreners weren't as tough as them, depicting them as some flowery knights. There was a time when some of these fans were fixated on the idea tha Jon would "destoyed" Loras in a "real fight". As for Greatjon Umber I definitely have him among the best warrior of realm, however putting him as superior to Robert seems really stretch to me. We are talking about a man who alongside Barristan hold the best war recording of the past 50 years. A man depicted by Ned (a veteran who fought several battle and met several great knights) as a peerless warrior, the demon of Trident a battle which Greatjon took part in. Here is what GRRM said on Robert's : Anyway I don't see what implied that Greatjon had such a level of skills, he was physically immensely strong for sure but there is nothing to put him beyond Robert, to put him at the same level is already reaching in my opinion.
  2. Not so sure about that, I personally stopped growing around 15. I suspect that Robb and Jon should have mostly reached their final height by the time of ASOS, keep in mind that those two were never meant to be particularly tall. In AGOT, Joffrey who was barely 12 was taller than both Robb and Jon who were almost 15.
  3. Well that's what I said, Jorah is one of the persons (meaning everyone bar Robert) who didn't badmouth him. About the Martells, GRRM mentioned they were displeased with the way Elia had been treated and prince Lewynn had to be threaten by the mad king. I suppose we may learn on their part in the next book.
  4. Sure that's why he never ever mentioned Rhaegar among his the references as a warrior after that (meaning when he doesn't talk to Daenerys), I mean he compared Tumco Lho to Jaime a person he particularly despised when talking about the best natural swordsman he has ever seen. The same goes for Jaime who never mentioned Rhaegar among the best warrior he's seen, he mentioned Barristan, Arthur Dayne, Robert and several others men but he never referred to Rhaegar's prodigious skills. The same goes for Ned who talked about Robert and Arthur Dayne with finest words but never anything about Rhaegar. By the way Barristan certainly agreed with it he would have said it without any problem. Rhaegar the peerless warrior who almost win. I see. At the end it's matter of point of view, some see Rhaegar as the magnificent who almost succeed others see Rhaegar as the prince who failed all. He gambled and he failed badly losing everything in the process. Rhaegar was the only choice. Aerys was mad and Vyseris and Aegon were too young. The reason are literally written in your quote, no matter how great Rhaegar might have been he was the only Targaryen choice. Sure, he was a young handsome knight. Why wouldn't he be, Loras is very popular among the folk so was Robert who was literally helped when he rebelled (which could have been seen as treason) against Rhaegar's family. A good, particularly handsome knight of royal born (highest than her). What is there of surprising here ? I thought Sansa would have been a good example of how such teenage girl would react to that kind of man. You brought every person who didn't badmouth about him, not the same. Jorah mentioned Rhaegar's skills as a warrior and compared Viserys to Rhaegar stating Viserys a disrespected king without crown who begged at every corner wasn't a true dragon (out of memory). Where are the praises here ?
  5. Kal-L

    About the Trident

    We don't know this, there is nothing to say that the fight prolonged long after Rhaegar wounded Robert, you keep insisting on the fact Rhaegar wounded Robert and so was winning their duel but if like you're implying Rhaegar was the best warrior, he wouldn't have lost against a wounded Robert. All we know is that during the fight Robert took a wound, nothing about the length is inferred, aside of the fact they clashed several times. The Dany visions showed Rhaegar on his knees if I remember it well. Did it show Robert on foot ? If not, nothing prevent Rhaegar from being smashed from his horse trying to get up and fall. What quote are you talking about ? I never seen Ned implying that Rhaegar had dismounted to fight Robert. He merely talked about a wound. I heard about the theory build on Jorah's statement which I don't subscribe, I know Rhaegar's fan have a hard time imagine him being bested fair and square but I don't buy it, not in a battle which would certainly cost the loser the end of his family. If Robert was dismounted which isn't impossible considering Rhaegar's horseman skills, there wouldn't be anything suprising in him making the prince fall from his horse while at foot. Not saying it was a desperate gamble, but that quote doesn't discard anything. The battle would still be raging even though it was a desperate act from the royalist. All it confirmed is that their fight happened while the battle had already going on for awhile.
  6. Kal-L

    About the Trident

    No, nothing about that Rhaegar is implied here. The only thing we can affirm is that Robert was among the first to fight at the battle, the rest is you trying to enforce your headcanon due to a quote which doesn't say anything. Except you still have nothing to affirm Rhaegar met at the beginning of the battle, the battle had begun for awhile when they met. You can attempt arguing the duel lasted hours but no one ever mentioned this, it was never compared to the duel opposing Daemon Blackfyre and Gwayne Corbray. I'm arguing against your affirmation that Robert and Rhaegar's fight happened at the beginning of the battle. So bring a quote from the book if you have it.
  7. Whitebeard bowed his head. "It is not my place to question the words of Prince Viserys." This is Barristan's mindset when talking about Rhaegar to Daenerys. Didn't know him and only speak of him as comparision to Viserys. What did he say about that Rhaegar which make the paragon of virtue you're trying to enforce. I don't remember what they said but I'm sure you can enlighten me, especially as neither Tyron nor the commonfolk knew the Prince personally. Certainly not a biased source. On top of that it's true that she has shown to be reliable source at judging character. By the way as I already mentioned contrary to your belief none of what those characters might have said or might have thought prevent Rhaegar from being flawed individual like basically the rest of us. The closest person you have mentioned here was mere obedient subordonate who wasn't even particularly closed to him.
  8. Kal-L

    About the Trident

    That abbreviated clearly states that Robert and Rhaegar didn't meet at the beginning of the battle, you can attempt circumventing it but nowhere I have seen stated that they met at the beginning of the battle, the quote actually showed the contrary. The quote seems to follow the events of the Trident chronologically and from what we can see Robert and Rhaegar met after Barristan was grievously wounded, taking him from Rhaegar’s side. The prince was already alone when Robert found him on the battlefield and the battle had already been going out for awhile then. I don't see why you talk about the fight in itself, I think it outwarldy acknowledged that Robert crushing Rhaegar's armour is what cemented the rebels win.
  9. "Fit together better" according to what ? The romanticized depiction of a long dead character by people who loved him to his only remaining relative that you chose to take as gospel ? You go so far that you can't even accept his failures even when they are glaring at you, be it on the battlefield or on the political field. Don't mistaken, there is no need to believe Robert's words on Rhaegar to see him as flawed individual. Contrary to what you might think Rhaegar being "highly intelligent, dutiful, and popular" doesn't prevent him from being flawed like every character from those books (or anyone actually). He certainly showed a high amount of arrogance when he thought he could insult three of the most powerful men of the realm and get away with it, that same arrogance that convinced him that he would crush Robert and the rebels at the Trident (except Robert's warhammer brought him back on earth). The way he was convinced that the prophecy had to revolve around him, that it had to be he or his progeny (an extansion of him) that was destined to save the world or whatever he believed makes me think that he was particularly egocentric. In a way I believe he was narcissistic which I dare say wouldn't be so surprising for a Targaryen. Anyway I don't see how it prevents Rhaegar from being intelligent, dutiful, handsome, popular...
  10. Kal-L

    About the Trident

    Well, GRRM has a different timeline : That comes from his blog, the royalists were already losing when Robert met Rhaegar.
  11. You conveniently missed the part were it said that he was no more pleased than Brandon, he was just able to control himself better. If it hadn't been for Brandon, Robert would have likely done something that would jeopardize his life. He isn't compared to Lyonel Baratheon the laughing storm for nothing. I had already expressed the idea that Elia might have had an affair with Dayne but I feel you're willfully bias here. There is no evidence of an affair from Elia's part yet the only people insisting on that theory (based on nothing) here are R&L die hard fan or simply Jon fans like Free Northman reborn, both with an obvious agenda that you can keep pretending not understanding.
  12. Kal-L

    R+L=J v.165

    And I think you're overrating the consequences of this act. Whether the Tully would approved it or not is a thing, whether Brandon's act would be enough to irrevocably broke ties is another thing and I disagree with that notion. As I already mentioned in my previous post Lord Rickard would have to deal with Hoster if the man was so "offended" and could convince him that Brandon's act was to be put on the account of youth. After all would it be so surprising that a young "knight" such as Brandon got briefly smitten by a beautiful maiden at a Tourney and decided during the euphory of his victor to crown her ? Especially a northern who isn't used to that kind of events (full of beautiful young maiden) and so could easily be charmed (or rather influenced) by the romantic mood ? By the way how many times did Brandon and Cat see each others throughout the years they were betrothed ? They barely know each other at that point (year 281), and on top of that she isn't even present at the Great Tourney organized by her vassal and mother's House (as many pointed out) who happened to gathers the most important figures of the realm. Which led to the question all must have wondered, why ? How is that even possible when even her northern betrothed is there ?
  13. Kal-L

    R+L=J v.165

    No I don't think so, I do think that Lord Rickard might have to insist with him on putting Brandon's act on the account of the youth, a young gallant fool who's just won the first -southern- tourney he's taken part in (something that is important) who also happened to be the biggest one the 7 kingdoms have seen for decades. On his side Brandon could give Cat some sweet talk if needed, otherwise I can't see it turning into something that can't be dealt between the two families. That's an interesting theory that definitely deserved some thoughts. Personally I don't approve it, I mean from what we heard from Barbrey, Brandon was never shy in taking what he wanted meaning had he been attracted by Ashara Dayne he would surely have make a move. That's why I feel him going at Ashara after his loss to get back at Rhaegar would be a bit out of character. Also Ashara was Ashara was a lady-in-waiting to Princess Elia was had been the one shamed by Rhaegar's move the most. It wouldn't be Rhaegar but Elia he attacked even though Arthur was closed to Rhaegar, unless he had something against Arthur Dayne it would be rather stupid. I think Brandon and Ashara had an affair at some point at Harrenhall which turned bad when it was revealed she was pregnant. Now I wonder if she was mourning him at his death and if she killed herserf because of that and all the death she suffered (Arthur, Elia...).
  14. Kal-L

    R+L=J v.165

    But whether it's better to crown his sister rather than Ashara is not the point, I don't even think he would have crowned Arthur's sister as I don't think he was particularly attached to her (anymore than Barbrey for example). However if he did, people would speak of it as the Stark heir getting momentarily smitten by some beautiful maiden, nothing else since there would offically be nothing else to say. Now after her pregnant state would be revealed, yeah there would obviously be a scandal but that's another story. I admit I laughed at the bolded, what else ? Should Brandon "the Gallant fool" be burned alive in front of Cat so the Tully who weren't even present could be satisfied ? Don't know what kind of scenario you pulled but if Brandon had crowned Ashara it would mean that he won the tourney and then there would be no reason to assume Rhaegar was the one "kidnapping" Lyanna if it still happens by the way...
  15. Kal-L

    R+L=J v.165

    Who said so ? Still doesn't see your scandal. Brandon crowning Ashara wouldn't be taken at offense by anyone, just a young man (not even married) rewarding a young maiden for her "oustanding" beauty, nothing unusual, especially at a tourney.
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