The Fattest Leech

HAhahahaaha, That was HILARIOUS when we had four-limbed dragons plus wings in season 8.

I am extremely skeptical about any new ASOIAF making it to screen. This Targ war was all devastation all the time. From the smallfolk to each other- total mindf*cks the whole time. Murder, incest, betrayal, repeat gets a little iffy after a while in a show. And a lot of animal-dragons die.

This has been an odd last few days.... The story that is described as the beginning of the end of House Targaryen is still on... https://ew.com/tv/2019/10/29/game-of-thrones-targaryen-prequel-ordered-hbo/ Adding: As one Game of Thrones prequel dies, another rises from the ashes. HBO announced Tuesday that its GoT prequel project about the Targaryen civil war has officially received a full series order. The title: House of the Dragon. Ten episodes have been ordered. Also announced: Emmy-winning GoT director Miguel Sapochnik will serve as co-showrunner and direct the pilot. Sapochnik directed acclaimed episodes such as “Battle of the Bastards,” “Hardhome” and “The Long Night.” The announcement comes just hours after news broke that the network’s first GoT prequel project from showrunner Jane Goldman starring Naomi Watts was not moving forward. The new prequel was co-created by author George R.R. Martin and Ryan Condal (Colony) — who will also be a showrunner on the series. A poster was also released with the tagline “Fire Will Reign”:

Say wuuut now? I’m sure someone out there owes me a dollar https://deadline.com/2019/10/game-of-thrones-prequel-pilot-dead-hbo-jane-goldman-naomi-watts-1202771609/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

You are a little ahead of me then in the audio, but so far it seems just as reported in that main/first thread. There was an article out by a fan site that tried to claim the poster was bias/possibly not reporting correctly, but so far it all seems accurate as described.

Right! THIS is how you tell a story

Agree. That’s what I want to check is the tone of the whole event and those there.

There is audio for those who want to listen. I am only partway through at the moment. Where I found it: https://twitter.com/brooklynmarie/status/1188946973501427712?s=21 The link within goes to Soundcloud: https://soundcloud.com/aboynamedart/got-panel-at-austin-film-festival

Since this thread is about the "behind the scenes" stuff, I wanted to share this here. So, Dave and Dan spoke at a writers festival recently (today depending on when you are reading this). A fan on Twitter live tweeted the talk with the showrunners. Gems. Absolute gems in this discussion. One of my faves right here: Dan wanted to remove as many fantasy elements as possible bc “we didn’t just want to appeal to that type of fan.” They wanted to expand the fan base to people beyond the fantasy fan base to “mothers, NFL players”... So, so many interesting tidbits here, so I am giving you a link to check them out for yourselves... thread link here. A few more good ones: The moderator is asking them about their comments acknowledging they didn’t understand the characters, and the extra minutes helped them understand the characters better. Dan is saying that he let the actors redefined the roles, esp Maisie and they began writing for the actors, it is like the actor moved into the “house” and redecorated. He said he learned about the characters from the actors. What are some of your faves from this talk?

I noticed that comment about golden flames a while ago. Paired with Dany’s multiple connections to Maegor and Aerion, GRRM has been building something up for her since book 1

I’ve been meaning to watch it again, this time on a larger screen for a better experience. I might just do that tonight as it’s the first time in days I can actually just sit and relax in the evening. I’ve gabbled about it to so many people in real world already.

What I said earlier is very true of the story... and if you don't think Martin isn't pulling from communism to develop the Targs and Dany (as he did with a few past stories), then you are missing the deeper analysis of the story and Martin's inspirations. Danaerys is the Pale Child Bakkalon, what do you think that means? Sure, it was about the level of magic and fantasy, but to add a direwolf, something that exists no matter what, is not an issue. You don't need to amp up the type of fantasy the story stylings are to include a direwolf. The Targs were going to get fire-kenisis magic, other people were getting skinchanging/warging/greenseeing. So no, I do not assume that there would not have been direwolves just because of no dragons. They serve similar, yet very different purposes and the author will use them as his story requires. Pah! Are you claiming you know more about this story and its foundational ideas than the actual author does? Martin has said so more than once, and most recently about 10-11 months ago. This is also based on his past works where the different dragon-vessels are also described as nuclear (among many other war machine terms)... by actual description. Sorry, but I am going with the author on this. Consider it foreshadowing. ADDING: Dany's dragons are also not conventional dragons. They are "neverborn" undead dragons, born in blood and fire rituals that Dany performed. So much so that Dany gave them "dead" names as she notes in Clash-Dany 1. This is the intent GRRM had in mind when he started the series before adding tons of back material. Disagree. That is the point! Just because you may or may not have an advantage over a people, doesn't mean you should wield absolute power, or use that power to subjugate others if you do. That is corruption whether on a person-person level, or governmental/ruling level. That is ABSOLUTELY a theme he has written into ASOIAF as he did with his past stories, most clearly those like For A Single Yesterday, Fevre Dream, Skin Trade, Dark Dark Were the Tunnels, Override, Nightshift, etc, etc... Self control. Cup of ice/cup of fire type of decisions.

The message that Animal Farm tells is that utopia cannot exist because there is always someone/some class that wants to rewrite the laws/stories to make themselves seem true/godlike because they want (absolute) power. That's what the Targs did and bless GRRM for publishing Fire & Blood to show the reader this. The dragons weren't even supposed to be part of the story in the beginning (I do know that you know that ), the fire was a pyrokinesis talent not unlike warging (more evenly matched), but by adding the dragons, something GRRM has called (more than once) nuclear weapons, he gave the Targs/Valyrians a major external temptation... and they succumbed. They are no better than anyone else that has an unstoppable power at their command (see: Tywin or Cersei). I agree with others that, again, especially after Fire & Blood, the Targ are grandstanding themselves for selfish reasons. Aside from the rare few Targ/Valyrians, they failed at using their powers (dragons) wisely. And they have just consumed themselves (as fire does). Other than controlling/bonding with dragons, they are born, live, and die as everyone else does, as seen more drastically when the dragons do die off. Chances are other families have a mixed-in magic blood as well, most likely because of very different means and methods, but we have yet to see any other family rewrite the books to make themselves as above gods and men. Not 100% sure what you mean by your last statement that I highlighted. Which books are "those books"? Animal Farm is one book/story. Do you mean the ASOIAF series as published now? I do agree that incest brats/hierarchy/human ownership is laughable, and I will add deplorable, as in every single darn story where GRRM uses incest (actual or implied) and it is a major, major failure each and every time. Martin is not setting up a "nobility is right" story and having any one family return to rule from the iron throne. He is casting that whole system to the wind.

I see this earlier today. Amazing work, and wow the scale!

I only have time for a few quotes at the moment, finishing work and have a show to attend soon, but here are a few... “Abner,” York continued, “I know what the Fevre Dream means to you. I want you to know that she means much to me, as well. This day is the start of a grand new life for me. You and I, together, we made her what she is, and we shall go on to make her a legend. I have always admired beauty, Abner, but this is the first time in a long life that I have created it, or helped in its creation. It is a good feeling, to bring something new and fine into the world. Particularly for me. And I have you to thank for it.” He lifted his goblet. “Let us drink for the Fevre Dream and all she represents, my friend—beauty, freedom, hope. To our boat and a better world!” [Joshua introducing his green drink to the other vampires in order to convince them they can coexist (not kill, at minimum) humans] “We are together at last,” Joshua said, in a quiet voice, “and this is a new beginning for us, for the people of the night. Those who live by day might call it a new dawning.” He smiled. “For us, a new sunset might be a more appropriate metaphor. Listen, all of you. Let me tell you of my plans.” Then Joshua rose, and began to speak in earnest. [and then later regarding the drink...] Cynthia has been using my drink for years. She became … sexually receptive … even without the blood, the fever. I responded. It was powerful, Abner. As strong as the thirst, but different, cleaner. A thirst for life instead of death. She will die when her time comes, unless your people can help. Julian would never permit that. And there is the child to think of. I do not want it corrupted, enslaved by Damon Julian. I want this birth to be a new beginning for my race. I had to take action.” A goddamned vampire baby, Abner Marsh thought. He was going to go in and face Damon Julian for a child that might grow up to be just like Julian was. But maybe not. Maybe it’d grow into Joshua instead. “If you want to do somethin’,” Marsh said, “then why the hell ain’t we in there, instead of yapping out here?” He jerked his shotgun in the direction of the huge ruined steamer. And then there is the homage that is made to Abner in the end-end (gets straight to my gullet every darn time). This homage is paid because there is more than one way that the humans and vampires united, and that was to take down Damon Julian, and it could only happen when they worked together (and actually human and vampire both drank the green drink at one point when needed). Kinda goes back to what you were (rightly) saying about needing to slake the red thirst, but also advancement only comes when two sides work together somehow. Some of the graves have large monuments. One has a statue on top of it, of a tall man dressed like a steamer pilot, holding a portion of a wheel and gazing out into the distance. Several have colorful accounts of life and death on the river inscribed on their tombstones, telling how they died in a boiler explosion, or the war, or by drowning. But the visitors come to none of these. The grave they seek out is relatively plain. The stone has seen a hundred years of weathering, but it has held up well. The words chiseled into it are plainly readable: a name, some dates, and two lines of poetry