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Posts posted by madhikun

  1. On 6/2/2019 at 12:29 PM, Uilliam said:

    Jon is much more sympathetic in the books. The show doesn't do a good job of conveying the stigma of illegitimacy, but the books really do. He also comes across as considerably more intelligent than his show counterpart.

    But honestly, Jon and Sansa are the only living members of the Stark clan I care about. Arya is a loathsome archetype in both versions of the story, and Bran the Broken is tiresome. Whenever I read one of his chapters I wonder why the princely mystic hasn't been killed off yet. Sadly, he never will get the chop.

    Ahaha I had read all the books before starting the show, so I was already not a Snow fan. I thought ADWD was to show how both Dany and Jon weren't great at ruling, but Dany's instinct helped her triumph/survive whereas Jon Snow is murdered. Suuuuuper upset when Jon Snow was resurrected. "No one is safe." my butt!

  2. On 6/1/2019 at 12:33 AM, Tyrion1991 said:


    First impressions matter enormously to me.

    When I first saw the show it was on the recommendation that “it’s got girl dovahkiin in with dragons”. So when you are first introduced to the prolific Stark clan I was not really keen on them. They push them as being the good guys you’re meant to root for too much. They pretty much start in the shire. They all start as naive children which I don’t like in stories. So that completely writes off Bran and Rickon. 

    The only Stark I immediately liked was Rob Stark. Particularly because he played off Theon so well. Once he died it really damaged what investment I had in the cause. Which is odd because of course the show really pushes Jon to Rob 2.0 in later seasons but I was never convinced.

    Ned works because he plays off Robert Baratheon. Plus Sean Bean. I watched all the Sharpe episodes growing up so I was sold on him as the indomitable Northern Lord who’s out of his depth. Plus in retrospect I liked that Ned wasn’t this crazy nationalist who buys into independence and who wants to peg a tree. He wants to stay part of the 7 Kingdoms and that should be an enormous source of strength. The break between House Stark and Baratheon is a massive reason for their houses downfall. Which is why I never sympathised with Northern Independence.

    Sansa was alright as it’s the right kind of naive and it compliments the rest of the series exploration of chivalry and love so well. Plus making her clearly a young wide eyed Disney princess in a grim dark world is a great premise and everything just follows from that. However I disagreed with the shows take on her in later seasons. I wasn’t sold on her as the new schemer and her sudden interest in the Northern cause. Indeed I really do believe they only had her become Queen of the North to save face. In the books I think she’s going to be a much, much darker character. I don’t see her being Elizabeth the First and on her own. Never mind that in the show there’s so little to work with that it was never going to be satisfying.

    You can immediately tell what Arya is going to be the moment she’s introduced. This is a Dungeons and Dragons rogue. I despise that archtype. It’s the most edgy and hipster kind of character imaginable. Which the show and George keep playing into all the time. For me that increasingly became cringe worthy. The only saving grace for Arya is when she witnesses the Red Wedding and Neds death. But then, a plank might have went through that situation and it would have been sad.

    Rickon isn’t a person.

    Jon simply isn’t likeable. He is an arrogant self absorbed brat who feels he’s been hard done by because people called him names. I was not convinced and Tyrion pretty much confirms that view. However having done that they then abruptly try to swap him to “oh he’s the man of the people who protects little Sam who’s just like you, see, see”. This was an unearned realisation and set the tone for the rest of his story. No I was not sold on this. Also, him being budget Aragon was annoying. Joins the rangers on the eve of the world and is blatantly King. This undercut all the efforts to make him Rob 2.0 and then Danys lover later on.

    Bran. Oh my god where to begin. You would be hard pressed to come up with a more irritating character. Not just an annoying kid character, but needy, gets himself into trouble and he goes out the window too quick for you to care. Then, they push all of the cryptic spirit magic stuff at you which I am not a fan of. Again, trying to be edgy. I am pretty told “you must care about this kid”.






    Funny how you get my feelings about the Starks spot-on. 


    Unless someone tells me the books do end differently, then I am fine not reading them and forgetting about this series altogether. Sansa hasn't been spoiled yet so I am rooting for her in the books at least. 

  3. 12 minutes ago, Hodor's Dragon said:

    I always marvel when people criticize Daenerys for being "entitled" or thinking she's "special" or has a destiny. If you can live her Season 1 story and stand there in front of the kneeling Dothraki at the end with your baby dragons lovin' on you under the brand-new blood-red comet and NOT think you're "special," you're not thinking straight.

    clap clap clap THIS! Ugh I love Dany. She is amazing.

  4. 5 minutes ago, Kajjo said:

    Not at all. Some people understood the hints, some didn't. What does it prove in your eyes? That there were no hints? Really? Get logical now. 

    Some understood the hints and explained them well, in dozens of videos, a long time ago. So there were hints. More than enough. No discussion needed at all. There were hints. Otherwise all the videos were empty.

    Some didn't unterstand the hints, that's true. Some adored Daenerys, to a significant degree due to the very beautiful and charismatic actress. That doesn't mean that we need to discuss whether there were hints. There were. Tyrions explains this in E6 and that is how the show confirms these were hints.


    You could say there were hints about every person then, the only difference is that Daenerys had the "mad targ" plot device. If Targaryens were just rulers and did not have this "mad targ" gene, would Dany be any different than any other character? What she does throughout the show is exactly what we cheer other characters for, but we never call that going mad. 


    Look at the Lannisters, all of them are crazy mad but we never think of them as so because it was said they were cunning. Arya and Sansa have killed brutally but they are righteous, not mad. The mad targ was a plot device for D&D and GRRM to shoot in case they wanted to. They could have EASILY gone the other way and it would have made even more sense. I don't think anyone would be going "but it doesn't make sense, she HAS to be evil!" because she never was. Up until this point Dany had never targeted innocents. GRRM and D&D decided to pull the trigger. THAT is what makes horrid storytelling. In any other case this was a horrible retcon of her character. 


    So go on with your whole "we told you so" bullshit, you're okay with a poor ending since everyone else got rainbows and sunshine. 

  5. 2 minutes ago, sifth said:

    That's so true. Dany needs a Raye Penber. A person who is 100% innocent, but she still has a logical reason from her POV to kill him anyway, just to show us her warped form of a justice and how it doesn't work with anyone who isn't a slaver or overly evil like many of the characters she killed in Essos.

    I hope GRRM gives to us.

    One of my favorite parts of Death Note was when Light had amnesia - and then regained his memories so the audience truly sees how warped he is by his face going from puppy-dog innocent to manipulative-evil. He changed into Kira over time, not with one simple blow out decision. Again, lazy writing and the directors needing a shock factor. 


    What would have been cool was Dany to end like Kira did. 

  6. 3 hours ago, sifth said:

    That was the moment it just dawned on me that Dany is basically Light Yamagi. People have been looking away for so long because "Dany only kills bad people", which is fun logic to justify cold blooded murder, which she did pretty often; the nobles of Meereen being the worst case of this, but what she did to Astapor wasn't much better. Naturally going back on your word is fine "when the person your dealing with is evil", by her logic and the supporters of Dany. It's even worse knowing that many of the people she killed aren't even ones who are openly trying to kill her. The slavers in Astapor she basically kills, simply because "they're evil" and for no other reason. The nobles in Meereen she also kills "because they're evil" and no other reason; I wonder if she did any real investigation into which ones were hurting those kids and which weren't. Tyrion's right, there's only so long, before our real world views of what evil is and her warped one can match.

    It's funny because I also thought she was Light Yagami, but the way he descended actually made sense. They showed him killing detectives off that were following him. He knew they were innocent, but to him their deaths were necessary. There was a logical and long series of events that led to his descent into madness. 


    Death Note is a perfect example of this idea working, but again he didn't have the lame mad targ excuse. This show/series was just lazy. 

  7. 1 hour ago, AlaerysTargaryen said:

    I never wouldve imagined that I would end up hating the Starks. Never. Im glad Jon left them all behind, they all pushed him in the direction of how badly things turn out. 

    Same. I've never been a huge Arya fan due to her blind love for her family, but I never hated her. Sansa and Arya were the most self-centered characters and they still got a happy ending. 

  8. 12 hours ago, AlaerysTargaryen said:

    I hated that speech that Tyrion gave about how she was really always evil because she killed her enemies in Essos. We just cheered for her and didn't see the truth in the face. She killed them with fire, dragons and with other means. Just because she didn't wield a sword, didnt do it herself and wasn't a man, it doesnt make her a crazy villain. What she did in KL is another story. But trying to make us feel COMPLICIT because we cheered when she crucified child murderers and killed slavers is fucking insane. Why all of the sudden they are aplying modern sensitivities to the story?  In the recent EW interview even Kit agrees, Dany was never a good person we never believed the signs. FFS! Emilia Clarke seems to be heartbroken and very conflicted about the morality of her character even 2 years later. Whatever her undoing in Westeros was and her fast descent into madness/villainy it does not negate her past actions. Daenerys Targaryen was a GOOD PERSON and made the world across the sea a better place despite the doom she caused in her homeland.

    This is perfect. 


    As much as I love these books, the one thing that I find annoying is this whole "mad targ" gun. So god flips a coin, but it doesn't pan out until...whenever? Then what is the use of Viserys who is so obviously supposed to be a crazy targ? Why are there no crazy Lannisters? Cersei is crazy, Tywin is the one who taught her, Jamie pushed a child out a window, Tyrion strangled his prostitute, but noooooo it's the targs that are crazy. 


    GRRM put the mad queen plot device in there to choose if he wanted to shoot the gun later. He's stated he's a gardener who lets his characters grow, but he always had Dany's end in mind. If this is how she ends in the books then GRRM is purposefully misdirecting the audience just so he can shoot the gun and call it clever. 


    I rooted for Dany, I still stand by her. That last 8.5 - 8.6 was NOT Daenerys Targaryen. That was the original destination GRRM had in mind. Two very different things. The creators of How I Met Your Mother learned this hard lesson as well, as their once-great ongoing series ended in disappointment (so much that no one mentions it when talking about LOST and Dexter) and everyone forgot about it. 


    I'm not looking forward to the books if this is how it plays out. I will forget this, but I will always remember Daenerys Targaryen as how she is, not what she originally was meant to be. 

  9. I am definitely mourning Dany. They killed her in 8.5. They replaced her with Hitler. Worse, everyone else receives a happy ending because I guess she was the true villain this whole time.


    Sad that now knowing what is to come, I won't be rushing to pre order GRRM's next book. I loved that series and I loved her. She became an icon for female empowerment and they trashed her reputation. 

  10. 11 minutes ago, SeanF said:


    I would have been happier if someone could at least have said something good of Dany at the end.

    We'll never get anyone saying of Dany (in show canon) that "the evil that men do lives after them so that the good is oft interred in their bones"

    She will be branded as a complete monster through the centuries, and her role in smashing the slave trade and saving the world will be ignored.

    If I hear another idiot saying that slavery was "culture" that she interfered with my head might explode. 

  11. 6 hours ago, tallTale said:

    Daeny targeting innocent civilians was garbage because of how they established her character through the 7 and a half seasons.

    I was just thinking how even when Jamie showed up and Daenerys clearly wanted to execute him, she listened to everyone's pleas for him and she kept him alive and free. He then immediately betrays her to save Cersei. AND THEN HE GETS A NICE MEMOIR FROM BRIENNE. 


    At any time during Season 7 or 8 they could have had Dany do SOMETHING to warrant her 8.5 actions but no, she just flipped a switch. You can't defend this trash.

  12. 52 minutes ago, snow is the man said:

    Wait what happened with her? I still like that actress though it was clear in season 7 and eight that she was having a really hard time with it. You could see her trying but they made her character go from smart and trying to do the right thing to automatically a tyrant who had "crazy" eyes within the second episode of this season.


    Emilia clark is a great actor and you saw this especially in season two through six. She was still figuring things out in season one but so were alot of characters. Then they made her act like a psychotic spoiled child at the end.

    Nothing actually done to her, but can you imagine for 7 - 8 years being the most popular icon for women empowerment to then become crazed and show how women's emotions get the best of them? Because even though we can call it the targ way, she wasn't like that until just now. && Jon is a targ but he doesn't let that change him. 


    The fact we had two queens - both die because of their emotions make this a really crap ending. Yeah we get Sansa but she already thanked her abusers. 

  13. They made her into Hitler. Why? So they could justify killing her. They had Tyrion paint all her triumphs into atrocities so Dany fans were laughed at. 


    Really Jon is a horrible boyfriend. He killed both of his lady loves because "it was the right thing to do". 


    Really, how is that supposed to be who we're rooting for? Screw this show. I am glad it's over and I'll likely not read the books if this is the ending. 

  14. 5 hours ago, Nami said:

    Is this really the ending we're going to get? Are you ok with that?
    I look at the books on my shelf now and think: Dany is my favorite character. I relate to her in a sense. I've rooted for her and cried with her. Is this really where all her struggles and pain are gonna lead her to? Turning mad and being killed by her boyfriend? What was the point of it all?

    I legit cried when she died - and started bawling when Drogon pushed her corpse trying to wake her up. 


    I wanted Drogon to blow Jon Snow to smithereens. But no, bitter is fuck you to all Dany fans, and sweet is for literally everyone else. 

  15. 4 hours ago, AlaerysTargaryen said:

    I agree 100%. It was bizarre watching what it felt complete different character. And that speech about oh she was really always evil because she killed her enemiesin Essos.She killed them with fire and with other means, just because she didn't wield a sword, didnt do it herself and wasn't a man it doesnt make her a crazy villain. What she did in KL is another story. But trying to make us feel COMPLICIT because we cheered when she crucified child murderers is f*cking insane. Why all of the sudden they are aplying modern sensitivities to the story?  

    In another topic, did you read the Ew interview? Poor Emilia , 2 years later and she still heartbroken. And Kit saying Dany was never good person. Ffs! As Emilia puts it in the end"I still stand with Daenerys".

    I did, I felt a lot of it was her trying to be nice to HBO. They completely butchered her character but she not only had to act it, she had to convincingly act it and support the show. It really disgusts me what she has been put through. 

  16. It was comical how ooc Dany was. Let's go rule the world? From the girl who left Mereen because she knew that she was meant to rule the Iron Throne, not other kingdoms? I choose what good is? Says the girl who constantly had advisors because she cared about others opinions? 


    Dany got a worse ending than Cersei. WORSE THAN CERSEI!!!! So Dany's whole quest of empowerment and kindness and struggles were all so she could die a villain? This was the writers' huge "fuck you" to all Dany fans. We shouldn't have cheered her on when she killed the slavers? Varys was right on his no-reason suspicions? 


    That ending was not Daenerys Targaryen. I feel sorry for Emilia for having to act that horrid script. 

  17. On 5/17/2019 at 8:50 AM, MinscS2 said:

    Haven't read the books (was considering to before S8 aired...F that), but given that Anakins decent from Good Jedi into darkness and Darth Vader was better paced, nuanced and written (over the course of less than two full movies) than Daenerys decent from Beloved Mhysa, protector of the downtrodden, into Psychopathic killer who kills the downtrodden for shits and giggles, then I'm sure that books-characters are better seeded indeed.

    If GRRM ends up finishing the books, I recommend reading them. If he never does, don't bother.


    && omg I was wondering why people kept comparing her to Anakin, and it is so sad/funny how the Star Wars prequels are considered to be one of the most hated parts of a story in cinematic history, and GoT somehow gets it worse than they did. 

  18. Here for this. Ready for Jon (or Arya disguised as Jon) to kill Daenerys and for Jon's punishment to be going beyond the wall to live with Ghost. The ending is bitter because Jon who "never wanted" the throne now never gets to have it boo hoo, but sweet because at least Daenerys is dead. 


    The sad thing is is that we may never even get the books to fix this mess. GRRM is his own person and these are his books, he really doesn't owe us anything. But oh how do I want them. 

  19. 5 hours ago, MinscS2 said:

    As for the ending as a whole, I too am firmly of the belief that we're past bittersweet at this point.
    Unless there's some amazing final twist, then we're heading towards a full-blown nihilistic tragedy.

    Ultimately this is fiction made for us, so how the audience reacts to the ending is way more important than how the faceless masses in Westeros reacts to the ending. We care about the characters in the story, not about the peasants having a happy ever after. 

    Considering how Season 8 as gone out of it's way to make more or less all of the characters (including those who died last episode) either dislikable, totally void of character (including the personality that once made us care about them) or having their personality do a 180 so they become someone else entirely, it's hard for me to feel anything for these characters at this point:

    - Jon? Mr Wood. Totally void of character and feelings. He has barely behaved like a human being this entire season. I re watched some of his scenes from the earlier seasons, and except for looking the same, it might has well been an entirely different character. I genuinely cared about Jon and his plights at one point. What happened?

    - Sansa? Littlefinger 2.0 aka whiny bitchface. The last two seasons managed to make me go from pitying Sansa for everything she's been trough and ultimately want her a happy ending, to outright dislike her. I'm gonna be genuinely annoyed if she get's a happy ever after where she will just smirk and tell everyone "ToLD YoU sO". 

    - Arya? It's a fine line between being a badass and being an ass, and Arya has been on the ass-side more than not lately. I don't mind her killing the NK that much (even if it takes away a huge part of Jon's story arc), but I do mind her having plot armor thicker than Balerions skull. Her character is also all over the place, she continuously switches between "family matters the most" to "I'm gonna kill people" in 5 minute-intervals. Make up your mind already! I felt nothing for her plights in KL last episode because I "knew" she would survive, and even if she hadn't, my reaction would've been a mere "...eh?".

    - Bran? :| 

    - Tyrion? Was my favorite character from S1-S5. Now you can throw him in the same "Not the same person as the one I once liked"-bin together with so many other characters. Seriously, when did Tyrion became a idiotic foolish pacifist and why? Once upon a time the prospect of him dying would've upset me. Now I couldn't care less. After Daenerys forced change in character, this guy is the second biggest reason we're heading towards a shit ending.

    - Davos? I've always liked Davos. Now in S8 he's been nothing more than glorified extra that went from being Jon's right hand man (without a title) to serving soup to peasants. Seriously, has he said anything clever this whole season that ultimately lead to some sort of payoff? The writers clearly don't know what to do with him, and it shows. He should've died defending Winterfell.

    - Jamie? Went from being one of my favorites for several seasons right back to being the guy I disliked in S1-S2 in less than one episode. His redemption-arc intrigued me, I rooted for him, he was interesting. Then when he died I felt absolutely nothing for the character. What was the moral of his story? "We are who we are and nothing can change that"? Talk about depressing...

    - Varys? Also been a long standing favorite of mine, but in his last moments (last 2-3 seasons in general) he became a glorified extra. Ultimately he also died an idiot. Seriously, Varys was considered to be the Spider, one of the smartest men in Westeros and he... openly talks about betraying Daenerys and Jon being the rightful king while still being on her island, and tries to have Daenerys killed before the war against Cersei is even won? How did he expect Jon and the northerners to win without the Dothraki, Unsullied and Drogon? Tyrion and Varys clearly should've avoided each other because apparently they suffer intelligence-drain when they are alone with each other.

    - Bronn? "Bronn finally snaps and is tired of empty promises from the Lannister-brothers, so he punches Tyrion in the face, threatens to kill them both, and then leaves, satisfied with ...another empty promise". Bronn is also one of those characters I enjoyed and who's death once would upset me. Now I no longer care. Fuck the guy. His arc should've ended with Lolys(?). 

    - Sam? Never really cared much for him nor his relation with Gilly. He was annoying in the first seasons (I did pity him however) and then he became an exposition machine alongside Bran. Only Arya has thicker plot armor than him. I don't actively dislike the guy however, so I don't mind him surviving with Gilly - I just don't really care. 

    - Sandor? One of the few characters on the show who died being true to his character from the earlier seasons. His death was ultimately pointless since the Mountain would've died anyway. I liked the character up to the point he died, but ultimately I felt more or less nothing. Throw him in the depressing "We are who we are and no agency can ever change that"-bin alongside Jamie and Daenerys. 

    - Daenerys? Still one of the few character in the show I actually care about, but instead of feeling "Fuck yes Khaleesi!", I now mostly feel a sad, hollow, pitiful "Oh Daenerys...not like this". Character assassination 101, worse than Jamie. I'm not gonna go into much depth about how I consider her turn from "Good Mhysa" to "Evil Psychopath" to be laughably rushed, forced, contrived, and completely unjustified (foreshadowing is not character development) because I've written so much on that topic already. Needless to say, that having Daenerys purposefully killing thousands of innocents civilians and throwing her entire 7 season long Mhysa-arc in the flames is the biggest (and also the stupidest) gut punch this show has ever delivered. 

    So yeah, ultimately I feel very little or nothing for more or less all of the "good" characters that remained in the show at the start of episode 5. They are more or less all so very far from the people they once where, and neither has changed for the better, so of course I care less, because I feel like I barely know these characters anymore, despite having spent 8 seasons with some of them.

    I imagine it will be hard for me to get a satisfying ending when I no longer care about what's going on, because the immersion broke way before the credits will start to roll anyway.

    Full-blown tragic, nihilistic ending without a satisfying payoff it is...

    This is such a perfect summary of each character. I feel the same way! 

  20. Rewatched the episode and I am still shocked with how this all played out. We start with Tyrion going to Dany and she says "Someone has betrayed me." And we're supposed to take this as her being paranoid, but she's right. Then she says it's Jon Snow and Tyrion is all "This lady cray cray, let me coo at her." but then Dany goes into exact detail how it was Varys <-- Tyrion <-- Sansa (manipulative) <-- Jon Snow which is totally true. But she's paranoid? 


    Also I keep finding it interesting that Jon Snow keeps repeating "I don't want it." He never says (correct me if I'm wrong) that he wouldn't take it if it was up for grabs. Varys straight up tells him that he wants Jon to be king and Jon is just cool with him trying to overthrow Dany? He doesn't tell Varys to shut his trap, he just warns him that he's speaking treachery. He doesn't even tell Dany that one of her closest advisers plans to take her from the throne. Dany up until her "snap" was completely aware of all the politics being played around her. Varys tries to overthrow her before she did anything wrong. Jon also later goes in and professes that he loves her (don't try to tell me that wasn't a romantic confession because it was!) and then he does nothing to comfort her and just rejects her. They don't even have the "you're my aunt and I'm uncomfortable with it" talk, for Dany this is status quo so she really has no clue why he rejects her for this. Did anyone think of that? 


    I could understand her snapping, I mean she grew her army starting with Dothraki who kill and obliterate all the cities they plunder. She mainly just knows slave masters who have no value of human life. She's not even that crazy when you think of it from that perspective. Yes she may have hated those methods, but they are not new methods. Killing innocents is not a new thing at all to her. Only difference between her and anyone else she's encountered is that she has a dragon. So you can play that angle, but she doesn't even go after Cersei and the Mountain. That makes NO SENSE. Why go after the innocents first? I'm so sad because they have ruined all the other characters for me and nothing will be a happy ending for me if Dany dies. 


    Also did anyone else go "wtf?" when they started playing sad music when Cersei and Jamie died together? Lol I have no sympathy for them. 

  21. 4 hours ago, tallTale said:

    Let's see..

    Sansa was trained by Cersei to be ruthless, and by Littlefinger to be conniving. Ok, fine..

    So does she uses either of those behind the scenes skills to take down Ramsay while he's abusing her? Nope. 

    Sansa uses her skills to lie to Jon about her Vale army, even though she begged him to come and save Rickon. Whatever.

    She nearly has Arya killed because she let Littefinger get in her head, and may have end up doing something awful if not for Bran's insider trader knowledge.

    Sansa immediately disliked Daeny, even though Daeny was there to save her ungrateful ass from the NK, which she did. WF would have been immediately overrun and destroyed. So she...

    I can't even do this anymore. You would think Sansa fans would be upset at the character assassination, but they aren't so why bother. 


    It's because she's winning.


    I am a huge Sansa fan - at least in the books. I liked that she learned from Littlefinger and Cersei how to play the game of thrones, but to me she is no longer a Stark. Ned and Cat are probably rolling over in their graves on how she has no honor. They completely assassinate her character but no one cares because she's a Stark so she must win. 


    Side note - I had a friend who loves Arya and told me "I was so worried she was going to die a lot of times when Danerys started burning the city but I was so happy she got out of it alive!" * facepalm *. 

  22. 51 minutes ago, Nightwish said:

    John shouldn't have told to Sansa and Arya the secret. Dany had a battle in front of her. He could have shared after Dany had the throne so he could also reject his claim officially, because now neither of them had a throne.

    So it only served to create a circle of betrayals that contributed in Dany feeling alone, betrayed and alienated. 

    Trusting Sansa was a big mistake. Dany knows better his relatives than him? WTF? 


    This. A hundred times this. Why was it necessary for him to tell Dany and his sisters about his parentage at this point? He could have waited and then broken the news to her. 

  23. 5 hours ago, the red god said:

    lolwut?!! it's quite the opposite. sansa has a very long track record of being betrayed and abused by people who were supposed to protect her. she's played the game for a long time now and thus honed the skill of spotting a bullshitter when she sees one, which is exactly what she saw in dany from day one. if anything, sansa's character developed immensely from the stupid little girl she once was by breaking her toxic cycle of trusting awful people who promised her an elevated social status. this is only further grounded by her bonding with arya and jon. two people that she couldn't stand as a child due to her posh viewpoint on the world.

    And you're not going to say Dany had a similar, even more powerful journey? 


    Sansa was an oathbreaker since day 1. She gave Jon Snow the King in the North title and he bent the knee, she already committed treason by not accepting Dany as queen. But did Dany blast her? No. She did everything she could to please Sansa who was being unreasonable. 


    Even after Dany sacrificed her armies for the WW Sansa was still being manipulative. Sansa has no honor and capes for her rapists. I'm hoping the books go another way with her because she was one of my favorites in the books.