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Vernon Roche

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  • Birthday 09/15/1986

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    Leeds, U.K.

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    Vernan Roche

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  1. Vernon Roche

    This is all Jon’s fault

    I think what most frustrates me is even with the material they've used there are so many more effective means of utilising it. For instance, Jon rejecting Dany's romantic overtures and that being her last forlorn hope to cling to before a descent into "fear it is then" would have been significantly more impactful if repositioned. It'd have carried more weight if they'd used more scenes to show her slowly withdrawing emotionally, not eating etc to open the episode (not just a throw away line) and then had her reach out to Jon for that reassurance as they stood atop some rubble/ruin staring over Kings Landing as the bells rang, perhaps throw in a few moments of grateful peasants thanking Jon for liberating them as he speaks with her (of course this would coincide with showing Cersei as more of a despotic ruler who harms the people in earlier episodes). His rejection, their adoration and coupled with her paranoia leading to her then snapping despite the battle having been won and mercy granted would have been a much better way to go, at least for me. For me, this season has all the big building blocks and none of the cement that helps keep the wall you're building structurally sound. Just little additions, extra character driven scenes. Dany going mad has been given context and groundwork earlier, but the execution of the "snap" has been so rushed that what should be a massive moment is... oh ok, that's where we are going then?
  2. Vernon Roche

    The underlying logic of the GoT TV show: surprise

    I think there's a balance, I think places like here can sometimes be massively overly critical and at times conspiratorial regarding the reasons for writing decisions etc, I think the middle ground is that they've struggled to replicate the depth post-books for script help, equally I get the impression the showrunners fatigue with the show and the studios budget concerns have caused the show to be condensed and rushed through a little more which always has an impact on the depth but equally they've also managed to keep giving the overall audience what they want successfully, but it's come at the expense of the more observant fans enjoyment and the comparative quality of the show. They have also made some strange choices, but as you and others have said, perhaps they are strange not because they're not what George plans to happen but because the shows running time and condensation has removed the important plot depth.
  3. Vernon Roche

    The underlying logic of the GoT TV show: surprise

    I'd agree with that, generally, the earlier season were of greater quality and I feel like it's been a huge mistake to begin condensing the seasons (again they did it to Rome too, season one was outstanding, then season two was three seasons in one due to the budget being so high making it for HBO which has unfortunate parallels with GOT too). The pacing this season has been off, too much is missed and there has been a difference, none of this I disagree with, I just don't think the wider audience they cater to care anywhere near as much, so I don't think they're necessarily failing to provide what the overall audience wants and can enjoy. I wish they had more seasons, more episodes and more exploration of characters and arcs, I just don't think the general audience cares quite as much and overall are much happier with the show than the more observant fans are.
  4. Vernon Roche

    The underlying logic of the GoT TV show: surprise

    I think that's a little unfair, I don't think they underestimated the intelligence of their overall audience at all. Their audience isn't just the hyper alert book readers who understand the "lore" in great depth and are combing over episodes with a fine tooth comb (which there's nothing inherently wrong with doing), it's millions and millions of casual television fans who do not care quite as much for depth and "logic" so to speak. They're here for the odd twist and the spectacle, which the show gives them. Sometimes its easy to forget that we're not a majority all the time, they're catering fairly successfully to that audience even if it comes at the expense of the overall enjoyment of some of the more observant fans. I think they've rushed the show (ironically enough they did the same to Rome on HBO too) and it's lost the deeper arcs and plots of the very good earlier seasons, but it's still wildly popular and watched by millions of people who don't care enough to tear apart these details, they're I'd argue the biggest chunk of the audience and they're catered to perfectly well.
  5. Vernon Roche

    [Spoilers] E801 Discussion

    Maybe its because I had to stay up late to watch it here but it came across to me that it wasn't necessarily the news of his father dying that caused him the greatest upset, he composed himself somewhat to say at least his brother was in charge now and it was news that his brother, who from what I recall in the show was somebody he had demonstrable affection for, that ultimately upset him and caused him to request his leave.
  6. Whilst I obviously stated what I did above, I agree, elements of this episode did pull you out and felt rushed like in my second paragraph, it was a flawed episode in some respects that meant you couldn't completely enjoy it.
  7. I'm essentially the same, I'm a pro wrestling fan and I learned a while back that to really enjoy it I have to stop overthinking it and lower my expectations, whenever I go online it's just forum after forum of how the product is terrible and it is absolutely abysmal and how every small little thing is a massive travesty that completely cripples the show, Vince McMahon is an old timer out of touch out to ruin the product etc. Do I wish GOT was longer seasons with much more time to cover nuances and avoid holes which you have to fill for yourself or simply overlook? Absolutely, but the show isn't akin to a Tommy Wiseau movie in quality. Was the travel times in this episode poor? Yes. Honestly they'd have been better to have half of this week's episode and last weeks combined with the climax being when they were trapped on the rock, so you have the build from the plan to capture the wight, to them travelling, forming their group, capturing it and being trapped. Next show open with them on the rock, because there's a gap between episodes it wouldn't feel like zero time has elapsed in quite the stark manner it does when contained in one episode, bit of time of them using some throw away dialogue like "We've been here for x days, we won't last much longer", some suspense for did Gendry make it and then boom, Dany to the rescue and finish the episode with more buildup to this meeting. This episode felt like they took the final episode and the 5th episode and slammed bits of them together that meant it didn't flow very well. Yet I enjoyed seeing the dragons as always, it was interesting to have the NK basically get his hands on his own dragon, seeing Tormund and the Hound interact was fun, the talk between Jon and Jorah etc. The "logic leaps" were not enough to ruin the episode to the point of it being unwatchable trash.
  8. Vernon Roche

    [Poll] How would you rate episode 607?

    6/10, it was a pretty average episode for me. I enjoyed elements of it, but there's definitely been better episodes with a bit more punch and progression.