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Einheri

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  1. Einheri

    Dany the Mad Queen was a terrible idea

    I’m not so certain that George intended for this to be a surprise. If Dany’s transformation is going to be believable, I think it has to be more of a gradual process where we see her getting more and more desensitised to violence and the horrors of war, which causes her to break boundary after boundary until she eventually reaches the point of no return. George’s Dany embraced the words of her house at the end of aDwD, and unlike the show, there won’t be many goody two shoes advisors around her to keep her worst impulses in check (on the contrary, I think that characters like Tyrion will only push her towards more war). I also don’t expect that the conclusion to her adventures in Essos is going to be anywhere near as clean of an affair as it ended up being on the show, and once she eventually does make it to Westeros, she probably won’t find a hated Lannister queen on the Iron Throne either, but a “Targaryen” king who will be popular among the people of Westeros. And if bringing Dothraki to the continent hasn’t made her super unpopular already, it certainly won’t get any better after the second dance is over. So, I for one am still looking forward to seeing how this plays out in the next books because Dany’s arc has the potential to be really interesting, even if we now know that it’s most likely going to be a tragic one. The journey is as important as the destination after all, and here George will be able to deliver unlike the show.
  2. I think he probably told them about this during one of the meetings they had about 4-5 (?) years ago, when it became clear that the show would overtake the books. But even if we assume that he could have given it away earlier than that, it seems unlikely that D&D wouldn’t have asked him to reaffirm such an important plot point at a later date (i.e. “you’re still certain about King Bran?”). For sure. It might not be my cup of tea (i.e. if Bran just ends up being a benevolent God-King, then I’m probably going to find that kind of meh), but it will make sense within George's story. It just goes to show how utterly incompetent they are as writers. Even if George gave them pretty much nothing aside from the plot point itself, they still had years to come up with something that would have been less stupid than the Bran-9000 being voted in as king because he has the bestest story evah. It would not surprise me one bit.
  3. If IHW speaks the truth, and I have no reason to doubt that he does, that means that D&D have known about this plot point for years now. Yes, they actually had years to come up with a somewhat plausible route... Nah, let's just turn Bran into useless robotperson who is made king after St. Tyrion makes a terrible speech at the Dragonpit. D&D are just the worst writers. Bwahahahaha
  4. Einheri

    Master thread on what the Show means for the book plot

    So, according to Isaac Hempstead Wright, King Bran is actually a plotpoint from GRRM: "[Creators] David [Benioff] and Dan [Weiss] told me there were two things [author] George R.R. Martin had planned for Bran, and that was the Hodor revelation, and that he would be king. So that’s pretty special to be directly involved in something that is part of George’s vision. It was a really nice way to wrap it up." http://www.makinggameofthrones.com/production-diary/season-8-episode-6-finale-isaac-hempstead-wright-bran-interview
  5. Einheri

    Dany the Mad Queen was a terrible idea

    Yep. The St. Tyrion character has been a monumental moron for several seasons now, and while he has that in common with several other characters on the show, I find him to be the most annoying of them all because he keeps insisting that he only makes mistakes because he is underestimating "less intelligent" people (no, show!Jorah, St. Tyrion has never owned his mistakes). Well, that and because The Dragon Demands has made a good case for why he might actually be Benioff's self insert character at this point.
  6. Einheri

    Dany the Mad Queen was a terrible idea

    Except I don't believe they actually showed us that any northerner not named Arya or Sansa Stark were still distrustful of her after they had defeated the WWs, which is actually one of the more realistic aspects of this season since very few people are going to be ungrateful towards the person who came to their aid against a frickin' army of ice zombies. In fact, I actually got the opposite impression, as there was a scene with a room full of Westerosi happily toasting the Dragon Queen, and then later we also hear that two Westerosi houses are reaffirming their loyalty to House Targaryen. Relationship issues aside, things seemed to be going upwards for Dany up until the diabolus ex machina incident with Euron happened. But Dany claims that no one loves her, and for some reason she is mad about Jon being popular among northmen and free folk, Theon showing more affection towards a member of his foster family, and that the civilian population of KL, who know pretty much nothing about her, are more worried about finding a safe place to hide during a battle... makes little sense to me tbh.
  7. Einheri

    Dany the Mad Queen was a terrible idea

    Well, I'm a Norwegian guy living in the 21st Century, and not exactly the biggest fan of the death penalty, but if I try to set all of that aside and see things from the perspective of the characters who exist in Planetos, my answer would be that beheading seems like a better method of execution than dragonfire.
  8. Einheri

    Dany the Mad Queen was a terrible idea

    Yes, for some odd reason the Tarlys decided to be suicidally loyal to the woman who should be the most hated person in Westeros (yes, even more so than Dany after she burned down the rest of KL). The St. Tyrion character on the show is an idiot. Dany was about as lenient with the Tarlys as she she possibly could have been without appearing as a complete pushover. When the Tarlys decided to spit in her face after she offered them a full pardon or a trip to the Wall, they pretty much doomed themselves.
  9. Einheri

    Dany the Mad Queen was a terrible idea

    She probably should have gone with a more conventional style of execution, if only because it would probably be better for her image ("I'm not like my father who burned men alive"). That said, being burned at the stake seemed to be a much more drawn out process than being exposed to a constant stream of dragonfire.
  10. Einheri

    Dany the Mad Queen was a terrible idea

    I very much doubt that the thematic can possibly be respected by a pair of knuckleheads who think that themes are for 8th grade book reports. They were a joke since a teenage assassin's school dropout was able to take down their entire army. It was literally the most boring and anticlimactic way they could possibly have resolved this conflict, and it also lessened the impact of seeing all of the humans go back to their old habits after the threat had been dealt with since the threat ended up being a joke. Dany would have been better off if she had simply laughed in Jonno's stupid face, before flying off to burn down the Red Keep. It wasn't only the viewers. The show itself was caught in her Messiah complex until they decided to turn her into the devil in the second to last episode. Westeros is pretty much the same it's always been except now the hereditary rulers of the various kingdoms get to decide which among them should be king. Birthright still decides your social standing and polical influence. There is no real change, and the potential for future conflicts is perhaps even greater than before. Yet Tyrion sees no problems with this, I guess, because he's still the dumbass he's been for several seasons now. So, while in Essos, Dany realized that she had to put in the effort to make her people love her, but now that she's in Westeros she just goes "f*ck it.... burn them all to there's no one left to love me". Again, that makes little sense, and we needed more setup to make this change believable... time D&D weren't willing to give themselves, so they should have avoided it altogether.
  11. Einheri

    Dany the Mad Queen was a terrible idea

    Oh, they've definitely changed George’s story to the point the core thematic has gone out the window and the characters no even resembles their book counterparts, and that's why George’s ending (i.e. I actually believe that Bran's ascension to king and Dany’s fall are actual plot point from him) no longer works, so they should have come up with something else that would’ve made more sense within their story. ?????????? The White Walkers ended up being a huge joke, so as far as the show is concerned Cersei actually made the right call by simply going back on her word and waiting out the storm. Heck the WWs might not even have been able to cross the Wall in the first place if Jon&Dany hadn't decided that they needed to convince her to join them. You can write about humans dealing with apocalyptic threat, while also including some human drama. No one is saying that ASOIAF/GOT is ultimately about the Others/White Walkers, but they represent the overarching antagonistic force within the story, just as the Empire was for Star Wars or Sauron and his armies were for LotR, and should have been dealt with in a satisfying manner instead of simply being reduced to an anticlimactic failure. Setting aside ones differences to fight a greater threat was a theme until D&D suddenly throw it out the window, but who cares about themes anyway. They’re just for 8th grade book reports according to D&D. Well, you're certainly acting hysterical... But anyway, I don’t agree with the premise that ambition is something inherently negative. That is just a stupid Hollywood trope. Also, for a show that is supposedly all about showing us that “birth right and ambition are the worst reasons to want to rule” (according to you), they sure decided to have it end on a strange note, considering that the North is still a hereditary monarchy and the monarch of the 6 kingdom is still elected by noblemen - and women who have ascended to this position for hereditary reasons. And how does that make any sense to you. Wouldn’t the show’s version of Dany be more concerned with improving the lives of the small folk of Westeros who are practically slaves in all but name instead of… you know… burning them all to a crisp?
  12. Einheri

    Dany the Mad Queen was a terrible idea

    The show may be called Game of Thrones, but it’s based on a book series called A Song of Ice and Fire, and as in the books, the threat of the White Walkers have been built up since the very start, and for several seasons now we’ve seen Kit Harrington and others try to make people understand that the petty squabbles of humans mean nothing when you have an apocalyptic threat breathing down your neck. To then have the White Walkers lose the first major battle after they’ve finally got past the Wall, so that we can go back to focusing on the petty human squabbles is not only extremely anticlimactic but also ruins what could have been an important message for the viewer. Another reason why it was a mistake is that D&D are terrible writers who haven’t been able to deal with the political aspects of the show after they ran out of material from Martin/chose not to adopt most of his last two books. Nothing I've seen on here have convinced that there didn't need to be more build up to explain why Dany would end up destroying an entire city and massacre thousands if not tens of thousands of innocent civilians. I can actually think of several worse reasons for wanting to be a ruler. Also, I don't see why having Dany succeed or die a hero would contradict "the message of the story". I mean what is even "the message of the story"? If you use military might to force through societal changes you will succeed in Essos but fail in Westeros? Executing the Tarly’s for refusing to bend the knee or take the black would not be seen as a big deal in Planetos. That Tyrion and Varys are concerned over this is just another case of terrible writing.
  13. Einheri

    Dany the Mad Queen was a terrible idea

    The George can probably make Dany’s fall work in the books, but yeah, as far as the show is concerned, it’s pretty baffling that they chose to have Dany become a villain in the second to last episode when there has been so little build up leading to this moment, and the show would have been better off if they had simply cut this plotline (and scaled down the game of thrones stuff), so that they could focus more on the White Walkers instead.
  14. There is a key difference, though. These countries had not yet surrendered when their cities were being bombed. Burning down the capitol you wish to reclaim, as well as thousands of innocent civilians after Cersei’s forces had surrendered and you had been able to sufficiently demonstrate the might of your dragon by wiping out the Iron Fleet and the scorpions on the walls, sounds pretty insane if you ask me.
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