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Everything posted by dsjj251

  1. dsjj251

    How is Daenerys’ army being supplied?

    Dany only briefly lost control of the Reach, she retook it in Eastwatch when everyone bent the knee. She likely named a new lord Paramount of the Reach. And it is never truly stated that she lost Dorne. She says it, but what are they going to do, side with Cersei ????
  2. dsjj251

    Casterly Rock Why?

    Book + Show logic. Jon controls The Vale, The North, and possibly the Riverlands. Dany controls Dorne, The Reach and the islands off the Crownlands and what ever land area on the mainland of the Crownlands where she landed her Dothraki. The Stormlands are not governed or governed by an off screen entity. That means Cersei only has true control over the Westerlands and nominal control of the Crownlands. Taking Casterly Rock pretty much means Cersei has been completely defeated other than holding Kings landing itself. In fact, Tyrion succeeds in doing this by the next episode after Dany destroys the Lannister host on its way to Kings Landing and all of the survivors bend the knee to her.
  3. dsjj251

    True Heir to the Throne

    Dany is the true heir because Aerys already picked Viserys as his successor, and he then picked Dany. Rhaegar 's line has already been usurped.
  4. dsjj251


    Fire and Blood makes it seem like the Iron Born were busy fighting themselves with multiple people claiming lordship over it . There were at least 2 rebellions in the Vale, both actually threatened The North as Torrhen's daughter was lady of the Vale and presumably killed by the rebels as well as the Sistermen rebelling and raiding the North. Westermen were married off to Rivermen and vice versa. The Tyrell's status as Lords Paramount rested entirely on the Targaryen's support , as well as House Hightower belief in the faith and them being right about Aegon. Basically, anyone who wanted to rebel was either already fighting a rebellion in their own ranks or had a family member as a hostage a kingdom or 2 away. You also have to remember the timeline here. Aegon didnt start his conquest of Dorne till 4 AC, Rheanys didnt die till 10 AC. That means Aegon wasnt truly seen as vulnerable until 14 years after he landed. the Riverlands, part of the Reach, Stormlands, and crownlands owed their status to the Targaryens. So even if you forget all the other things, Aegon may have had the largest Army and largest fleet in all of Westeros.
  5. dsjj251

    Season 8: News, Spoilers And Leaks

    That may be where you saw the Season 7 leak, its not where I saw it. Regardless, you didnt answer the question.
  6. dsjj251

    The third twist

    1.The Night King is "The First King" 2. The Night King has been feeding visions to Bran and the Red Priest/Priestesses 3. R+ L = Jon /Gendry = L+R(obert) ,Jon and Gendry are brothers, one being born of Robert and Lyanna, the other of Rheagar and Lyanna exactly 9 months apart.
  7. dsjj251

    Season 8: News, Spoilers And Leaks

    so what exactly is ok to post here? because the guy who leaked season 7 has also leaked the season 8 outline .......
  8. He had to forgive them. They represent half of the Kingdom. Sending any of them to the wall would provoke them, and possibly create a Southron alliance.
  9. dsjj251

    Robert's Rebellion: The River Lords

    I would think the Blackwoods are loyal to the Tullys and therefore to Robert in the rebellion. They are one of the last Stark-Tully holdouts after Robb is killed.
  10. dsjj251

    Southron Ambitions question/observation

    It would indeed be great to know more. Its one of 2 theories My guess is that once a line has been re-established(marriage changes succession), it cant be re-re established And/OR "a son comes before a daughter, but a daughter comes before an uncle" only applies when the father is Lord/King, if the father is an heir, then the new heir is the next male in line. Sansa married Jonnel, while Serena married Jon Umber(assuming he was her first husband) and Considering Cregan's possible death year being 157 or later, his daughters were likely already married when he died. That made Jonnel the next in line rather than Serena or Sansa. Before marriages the line was Serena> Sansa> Jonnel> Edric After marriages Jonnel> Edric > Barthogan > Brandon That however, does not explain how Edric was skipped over for Barthogan. It is possible Edric could have already died, making Barthogan the heir which puts into play the second theory meaning Edric-Serena's children where never heirs because their father was never lord. And since the line doesnt revert back, those children can not make a claim through Serena either.
  11. dsjj251

    Southron Ambitions question/observation

    As for the bold, I never made such a claim. I responded to your absolute that there had been no female rulers on the indivifual kingdoms before and after the conquest. You were wrong. As for the Shewolves of winterfell, it seems that has more to do with those women marrying their uncles and cousins or even more, Martin making a mistake he didnt catch. There is also the argument outside of the crown itself, a women marrying a man turns over lands and titles to him or loses claims based on marriage. We see this in other instances like the iron throne itself where the heir to Dorne actually loses their claim to it when becoming the prince or princess consort to the crown.
  12. dsjj251

    Southron Ambitions question/observation

    Dorne has had multiple female rules, The Stormlands had a at least one queen(however short it was), Vale has had atleast 2 female rulers. Cerelle Lannister also was Lady of Casterly Rock.
  13. Why not ? The claim is through their mother's Targaryen linage , not who their fathers were.
  14. dsjj251

    Unowned lands and keeps

    We dont actually know if Little Finger grants him a "lordship" , as Keeper, he already had the title of Lord. This is one of those questions where no one actually has a concrete answer, all of the examples given are vague(Nestor Royce) or are the result of war and treason(Brightwater Keep/Harrenhal). The only thing we can safely say based on rebellions is that the crown and great lords can take away lands without asking for consent from the other(Harrenhal, Castamere, Tarbeck). We dont actually have an example of being told who can grant lordship and who cant. If a knight can make a knight, it seems logical that a lord can make a lord. Stannis and Davos seems to be the best example of this, but then again, that is vague as well.
  15. dsjj251

    War of five kings riverlands

    Again, quick highlights "A third more "( what I actually typed) =/= 3x's the population A 3rd is 1/3. so if the Westerlands has 2 million residents , then the Riverlands has 2.6 million , not 6 million Frey Lands - Cats ataement is invalidated by the fact that the other details in the book contradict it to an extent . In short, we are told Frey lands are fertile, but we never see these lands . We only see bogs and ubfarmable land. Saltpans certainly does not belong to the Freys or a Frey vassell, that we know for a fact, so them riding there proves nothing at all. And if the North controls all of the neck, that means the border is less than a days ride from the twins . Proving there are no fertile lands north of the twins and no proof their lands extend south of the blue fork. Are you not getting my point ? Also, you understand " bogs and green pools" are swamps right ? Again, that's from quote you pulled. Westerlands - look at the quatermeadtrr map of the Vale and then look back at the west, geographically, they are similar. My argument isn't that they aren't 3rd place, but simply that they shouldn't be as close as we are told. Rewrites- well since it was originally a trilogy and And Robb was supposed to die in battle , it's easy to see there were some rewrites. As for the Riverlands defense quote. It's AGOT Catelyn's 8th chapter and it is indeed mentioned that Tywin in marching towards Harrenhal. Bolton and Glover are the ones who specifically mentions that Tywin is to smart to try and march the Neck because the crannogmen will bleed him and that he will instead take the Riverlands castle by castle until Riverrun stands alone. These are huge books , no one remembers them word for word, but you are making some " I don't remember it, so it doesn't exist arguments " even though it doesn't actually change anything.im literally reading a PDF of the book now. Your Robb quote is from page 550 , Harrenhal is mentioned on 549, " Tywin has closed off the Kings road, it's said, and now he is marching north towards Harrenhal, burning as he goes" Renly discussion with catelyn - the point was that you claimed the riverland never had that many soldiers( not simply that they didn't have them in the moment) . You were wrong or at least didn't have enough information to come down on either side . West coast of Westeros - it's simple . There are no major trading posts in the sunset sea. Where as there are 6 free cities on the coasts in the East, the first men came across on the arm of Dorne . It doesn't make sense for the west coast to have developed first especially with with Andals also having landed from the East .
  16. dsjj251

    War of five kings riverlands

    You are being obtuse at this point. Quartermaester has the most detailed map,I suggest you look at it . As for the land, again your own quote says Hag's mire and Sevenstreams are both bogs and green pools. That's not my opinion, it was your own quote. The King's Road is on the Eastern side of the Trident, land that we are never told belongs to the Twins And to be clear, your quote isn't saying the borders have fertile lands, that is clear by the fact that the reliverlands border is the neck, and that land sure isn't fertile. Cat Quotes - I could be wrong but one of your quotes about Frey Lands was from AGOT, where Cat meets Robb at either Greywater Watch or Moat Cailin ( can't remember which), either way at the war council, Robb tells Cat about the war in the Riverlands. And he makes a decision about either joining and defending Riverrun with Edmure and his forces, or marching South to aid castles like Harrenhal which tywin will soon March on, or to wait and make a stand at Moat Cailin when Tywin marches north. This is where they make the plan to use the Twins in the first place and she describes Frey lands. (This is exactly why Cat mentally answers Renly the way she does when he asks her their forces.) As for population. if you fully understand that the Vale isn't populous simply because it had fertile land and one large city , then you can understand why that is a flawed argument to make in favor of the Westerlands as well. There is also the next half of your Westerlands quote that says they have green boys and fishermans sons holding Lance's. So their army isn't actually as big as it sounds . Charters - you get one to become a town, and another to become a city, there is no in between. While they could have been denied charters for being to small, the context of your quotes doesn't make it seem like that was the reason . Long story short, my original point is right. One line in the books say the Freys have great lands, but there is no actual evidence to support that . The neck is a swamp, as is Hags Mire and the area around the Head waters of the blue fork. you have no evidence to support the claim that the Freys control the land on the western bank of the Green Fork which would be the only fertile land they could own. Like i said, our author likely did a rewrite , well we know he did,bites of the original version of the story has long been out there for a while. The Freys shouldnt be as powerful as they are ( just like there should be a much more populous east coast Westeros instead of west coast ).
  17. dsjj251

    War of five kings riverlands

    We are going to disagree so I will hit the high notes. 1. Hag's Mire is at the head waters of the blue fork on the semi Canon and canon maps and is directly east of seaguard, meaning it is all most directly south of the Twins . That is the furthest south we are ever told the Frey's lands go. As your own quote says , that area is nothing but bogs and green pools , not fertile farm lands. 2. When population is mentioned in A Song of Ice and Fire and it's companion novels, The Reach,Riverlands and Westerlands are always mentioned in that order . It's because the riverlands are more populous , we simply disagree on how big the Gap is. Saying the West had rich lands which equal a larger population is just as flawed an argument as saying it of the Vale, who also has rich lands, and even a chartered city. As for the large towns of the Riverlands. We are 5 books and 2 atlases and About 7 prequals in and we have heard of no other large towns denied , requesting, or even being large enough to be considered for charters. It does not mean there are none, but it does mean we haven't been told of them. If you can make the argument that the Westerlands are close in population just because of a passage saying they have fertile land, the obviously I can flip that argue for the mention of multiple large town being a decisive factor. 3. Cat's estimation of forces are based on lines being broken, harvest and fighting a multi front war. Not the full strength of the Riverlands . Again, your own quote says that. 4. Circling back to Frey lands. Unless there are towns north of Hag's Mire, east of Seaguard and South of the Twins , the only reason to cross the twins is to go to Seaguard, which again doesn't make sense as to making the Frey's. Rich. If you are coming down from the North , you can go around the head waters of the Green Fork. If you are in the Vale , you simply cross the Trident at the The place where the River Road, Kings Road and High Road meet. In the west, you travel the River Road and cross at the first crossing and go north to Seaguard ( or you know, boat travel) The Tullys are overloads if the Riverlands, before them the Hoares, before them the Durrandon, before them the Freys didn't exist. We have no mention of Fairmarket changing hands or even The 3 bamed family's granting them new lands. It's hard to see a hated house gaining that much power. Yea, you nor anyone else can't justify the Frey's wealth and power without creating some "head canon" . I think the Freys position of power was left over from rewrites and the author needing a villain.
  18. dsjj251

    War of five kings riverlands

    What you are saying is possible , but not likely. We are told the area north of the greenfork directly joining The North is swamp ( Southern Marshes ) not much farming or building to be done there . Southwest of the twins, less than 3 days ride is Seaguard, Mallister territory. House Blackwood controls all the area west of Fairmarket.Brakens all the area south, and Darry all to the east. Last but not least, everyone refers to the Freys as upstarts and toll collectors. Fairmarket has been around for at least 700 years . And the Freys only 600, but seeing as Fairmarket was a large town even back when Arlen Durrandon won the Riverlands , it's hard to believe he just gave it to them , or the Hoares after them. My point being , The Freys don't have great land, they have a bridge, alough it being profitable to the point of the Freys being rich doesn't make sense. The major cities of the Riverlands are more easily accessable on the Kings road and then getting on to the River Road or continuing South. Meaning no one from the North or Vale would ever really need The Twins or vice versa with the Westerlands needing to go east or North. As for population and defense of the Riverlands; We are told multiple times in the books of how prosperous the Riverlands are and high in population and the fact that it has at least 4 towns(Fairmarket, Saltpans, Maidenpool, Lord Harroway's town) just shy of being chartered as cities . No other kingdom even has one. All of this points to the Riverlands being far more populous than the Westerlands and while. And the only reason the Riverlands have ever fallen before is because they were divided, not because they were outnumbered, and in this case, they certainly had a common cause and should have been able to easily surround Tywin and his mad dog.
  19. dsjj251

    War of five kings riverlands

    It doesn't actually make sense for the Freys to be the most powerful bannermen. The riverlands have multiple large towns just short of city status . There is no way the Freys have more men. That is also why it makes no sense that the riverlands can't defend itself from the westerlands which it should have at least a 3rd more in population.