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Aemon Darkbrother

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  1. Robert may have given Renly Storms End out of love rather than political sense. I read a theory somewhere that Renly may have been his first bastard via that Estermont cousin.
  2. I'll admit there are alot of nonsensical secret identity theories out there but the theme of the blood of the dragon people serving as the foundation of the asoiaf world is completely different than the Euron memes lol. Also PJ is very insightful and definitely on track with the "Sci fi" stuff but I think that in an effort to differentiate himself from other youtubers actually does himself a disservice. His anti-R+L=J interpretation of the Brandon ashara stuff is needlessly convoluted. Storms end is not an f-ing spaceship in fact there are no spaceships because even if they had existed on planetos spaceships are metal and would be long eroded. I do think however that dragonbreath was used to make the castle, kind of like cement. Think the walls of volantis, the base of the Hightower or even maybe even the five forts. Yeah I agree no vampires and yeah swords are swords. However I'd argue that the closet thing to gods in asoiaf are the greenseers and the hive minded weirwood net. I'd even say that those types of organisms are "alien" to planetos just like dragons are. Dragons are described as wormlike and are often described as bat like. Sounds like genetical engineering to me. During the DotD Sunfyre is described as having been wounded and unable to fly, only to mysteriously disappear. The implication here I believe is that sunfyre resorted to its pre-dragon Worm (or Wyrm) instincts and burrowed underground....like in In The House of the Worm. Dragons are basically a cooler version of the worms Georges other stories. Creatures that burrow beneath the earth that are imbued with telekinetic abilities and bond with others who share their blood (Skin changers/targs). The myth of Qarth in which the moon explodes and brings down meteors is imo the story of how alien organisms came to planetos. Dragons themselves are GRRMs moon Martians. She didn't even understand what was going on. Her blood did all the work. Her dragons are at the root of all her power, its how she was able to amass all the strength she has now. A better example of character outshining lineage would be Jon. I don't think he'll ever be acknowledged as a Targaryen until after his death, say for instance if Samwell were to write a book. "He was who he was; Jon Snow, bastard and oathbreaker, motherless, friendless, and damned. For the rest of his life—however long that might be—he would be condemned to be an outsider, the silent man standing in the shadows who dares not speak his true name. Wherever he might go throughout the Seven Kingdoms, he would need to live a lie, lest every man's hand be raised against him." Jon will live his life beyond the wall as the king of the freefolk and as an outlaw in the eyes of the 7 kingdoms. I imagine similar outcomes for other targs. Like I said before, just because these people are blood of the dragon doesn't mean can make their own choices with the power that blood affords them. Blood is only half the equation in defining who you are, we this time and time again with most characters. Tywin's predisposition to aggression is teased at his birth but he's also defined by the trauma of what his family went through in his youth. Rhaegar is said to be a gifted fighter while also being clever, likewise Jon is a skilled fighter and was even a gifted student ( to Catelyn's shagrin) but his personality and actions are deeply influenced by Eddard as well.
  3. Have given any of his sci fi stories a try? Read In The House of the Worm or Bitterblooms. They are basically precursors to a lot of ideas that formed ASOIAF imo. The descendents of an Aryan race spread across the galaxy, modern day cities reduced to ruin because of nuclear war and have regressed into medieval societies, Worm people (COTF) waring with aryans etc. Initially I was in a state of incredulity reading the stuff. I almost felt as if I'd done something wrong reading those books before grrm had a chance at finishing asoiaf. Your right the furniture rules are definitely a better way of illustrating my point thought i'm sure already know: "The answer is simple. Motor cars or horses, tricorns or togas, ray-guns or six-shooters, none of it matters, so long as the people remain. Sometimes we get so busy drawing boundaries and making labels that we lose track of that truth." We can make up all the definitions of science fiction and fantasy and horror that we want. We can draw our boundaries and make our labels, but in the end it’s still the same old story, the one about the human heart in conflict with itself. The House of Fantasy is built of stone and wood and furnished in High Medieval. Its people travel by horse and galley, fight with sword and spell and battleaxe, communicate by palantir or raven, and break bread with elves and dragons. The House of Science Fiction is built of duralloy and plastic and furnished in Faux Future. Its people travel by starship and aircar, fight with nukes and tailored germs, communicate by ansible and laser, and break protein bars with aliens. The Furniture Rule, I call it.Forget the definitions. Furniture Rules.Ask Phyllis Eisenstein, who has written a series of fine stories about a minstrel named Alaric, traveling through a medieval realm she never names.. . but if you corner her at a con she may whisper the name of this far kingdom. ‘Germany.’ The only fantastic element in the Alaric stories is teleportation, a psi ability generally classed as a trope of SF. Ah, but Alaric carries a lute, and sleeps in castles, and around him are lords with swords, so ninety-nine readers out of every hundred, and most publishers as well, see the scries as fantasy. The Furniture Rules.Ask Walter Jon Williams. In Metropolitan and City on Fire he gives us a secondary world as fully imagined as Tolkien’s Middle Earth, a world powered entirely by magic, which Walter calls ‘plasm.’ But because the world is a single huge decaying city, rife with corrupt politics and racial tensions, and the plasm is piped and metered by the plasm authority, and the sorcerers live in high rises instead of castles, critics and reviewers and readers alike keep calling the books science fiction. The Furniture Rules."Peter Nicholls writes, ‘... SF and fantasy, if genres at all, are impure genres . . . their fruit may be SF, but the roots are fantasy, and the flowers and leaves perhaps something else again.’ If anything, Nicholls does not go far enough, for westerns and mysteries and romances and historicals and all the rest are impure as well. What we really have, when we get right down to the nitty gritty, are stories. Just stories.Fantasy? Science fiction? Horror?I say it’s a story, and I say the hell with it."
  4. Eh vagueness for the sake of vagueness doesn't really do much for me . Thats more in line with stuff like Harry potter where one can turn a goblet into a rat because...magic. But just because George has a system in place to explain how things work doesn't mean those things aren't a mystery in it of themselves. I sure as hell wouldn't have come to see ASOIAF the way I do now if it wasn't for the collective work of the fandom. Hell, something as simple as R+L=J went completely over my head when I first read through the series and damn if it wasn't an awesome feeling when finally understood it. As far as earning ones place in the story...well thats a tricky thing to ask because this entire story focuses on nobility. Dany didn't hatch dragons because she earned it, she hatched dragons because she was Aerys's daughter and blood of Aegon. I guess this just circles back to my original point that this fictional Sci-fantasy story about noble bloodlines at war can only be so spontaneous. Its kind of doomed to be a little contrived and i'm OK with that. Whats great is that even if you or anyone else shared my interpretation of the mythos you wouldn't really have to pay attention to any of it to enjoy the story, at its core ASOIAF is about the human heart in conflict. George's masterful skill at storytelling is probably why ASOIAF has such worldwide appeal and why GOT made such a good show for mainstream audiences.
  5. I think it really is that easy. I think George's attempt with asoiaf is to mask what would be considered a traditional sci-fi story as a traditional fantasy. "Magic" thus has to be a little more sensible in his world than simply being the power of unnamed faceless "gods" in the traditional sense. "Magical" power thus must be born though the passing or manipulating of genes which George loves to write about anyways. Grrm has woven this system into the political landscape via "Royal blood" and the nobility as a whole, though I won't claim to be an expert at this stuff, i'm just kind of calling as I see it. Mind you a lot of this stuff is hidden under the surface and most likely will never be wholly understood or acknowledged by those involved. Are the Lannisters descended from the Gemstone emperors? probably....is westeros littered with the children of Aerys? probably , though I doubt many of these characters would ever understand or outwardly acknowledge these things. Not everyone who's blood of the dragon is necessary destined for greatness . Is it a bit contrived? yeah, similar thoughts have crossed my mind but ultimately I'm not bothered by it, its fiction after all and frankly its just so obvious to me that I find it hard to ignore.
  6. Bloodline is at centre of this entire series, I think. Which is fine as people are still individuals with their own free will. You can tell the story of a giant blood line while still exploring the heart in conflict.
  7. Spot on, until this. Aemon steelsong and baby monster are the legacy of Maester Aemon . Craster is not Bloodravens child. Craster's AEMONS child. One of Aemons three tests was to abandon Crasters mother in Whitetree. Kings blood= Blood of the dragon COTF= Blood of the dragon Others= Blood of the Dragon House Stark= Blood of the dragon Blood of the dragon= Blood of the great empire of the Dawn Blood of the great empire of the Dawn = Blood of Valayria Blood of Valayria= Blood of house Targaryan Jon's baby swap was futile from the start. He swapped one Targ for another. Baby Sam will be saved at the last minute however and sadly Shereen (Aegon the 5th's Great Great Granddaughter) will be sacrificed in his place. Dala (granddaughter of Aemon) ran away from home to save the life of her child just as Gilly did, only her child was born a girl aka Val. Also, Mance is Rhaegar. Jon is going to kill Mance in parallel to Lord Brandon and Bael the bard. There's an interesting pattern established in the Targaryan Dynasty: Aemon One Eye (Younger brother of King Aegon 2nd) Aemon Dragonknight (Younger brother of King Aegon 4th) Aemon Blackfyre (Younger brother to Aegon Blackfyre Heir to Daemon) Aemon Maester (Brother to King Aegon 5th) Imo, Aemon Steelsong = Brother to King Aegon 7th (Jon) Aemon steelsong is Craster's grandson and Jon's younger brother. Gilly thought about that. "Dalla brought him forth during battle, as the swords sang all around her. That should be his name. Aemon Battleborn. Aemon Steelsong." A name even my lord father might like. A warrior's name. The boy was Mance Rayder's son and Craster's grandson, after all. He had none of Sam's craven blood. "Yes. Call him that."
  8. Im thinking Ashara is both Danys older sister and mother. Aerys raped his daughter. Lyanna was also a bastard of Aerys and thats where Jon gets his connection to the mad king, not through his father Rhaegar.
  9. I mean Harry is literally Robin Arryn's heir. George doesn't need to add an Arryn suitor because house Hardyngs claim is an Arryn claim. Im not saying the theory is bullet-proof but the argument that house Arryns match to Sansa isn't represented in the Ashford champions just isn't true. Currently in the books Joff is a baratheon in name and should Robin die Sansas ties with house Arryn aren't broken, they just shift to the next Arryn in line....who happens to be a Hardyng in name.
  10. Im not so sure if Jon will remain a northern lord by the end of the story. Im thinking he's going to make some kind of pack with the Others. Essentially I think they will want him to be their new king. In return they will let him live the rest of his natural life amongst mankind. If Bran ends up sending Jon to the wall and Jon becomes a wildling, he may spend the rest of his life as KBTW, helping to build a true kingdom for the freefolk. 'Other' tinfoil aside, Val and Jon's union may not be so political (Jon's already rejected that) as it would be more of a natural union of simply being in proximity of one another. Plus that whole "they belong together" dialogue in reference to Ghost and Val really strike me as some kind of foreshadowing. My bad if this has already been discussed, too tired to read the whole thread.
  11. lol, if by abomination you mean the show then I feel you. Though there's stuff there to be gleaned I think, like Sansa being queen of the North for instance. Vals not in the show but I'm convinced she's the one Jon going end up with, his wilding queen that is .
  12. The war of the roses ended with a son of Lancaster wedded to a daughter of house York so I agree that Tyrion makes a lot of sense. Sansas hope of giving birth to a king as noble as the wolf and as proud as the lion would still apply, assuming westeros adopts an electoral system of choosing kings like in the show. Tyrion may end up as Brans hand for most if not the remainder of his life similarly to Viserys the 2nd, as Tyrion himself spoke of. If Tyrion proves himself an effective hand, maybe its Brans Lannister nephew who's chosen as king after him? I don't think it'd be a loveless union ethier just the opposite really. Catalyn idolized Brandon Stark and felt no passion for Eddard only to grow to love him after getting to know him on an emotional level. Swap out Cat, Brandon and Ned for Sansa, Joffrey and Tyrion....I could see it. Remember, Harold would wed Sansa after being named the new lord of house Arryn. In fact it would have been less suspicious if George had written in an Arryn as one of the suitors and yet he chose a Hardyng. Why is that? Maybe because he wanted to clue us in.... Im of the mind that Tyrion is the result of chimera syndrome, making him both Aerys and Tywins son. He's "the half man" son of the lion and of the dragon. The Targ suitor could apply to Tyrion just as much as Faegon.
  13. Sorry I was on the phone typing, I should have been clearer. What I meant to say was that I suspected George was/is purposefully conflating these ideas. Kingsblood = Magic blood Magic blood= Dragon Blood and Dragon blood/Cotf Blood= Same thing. The real world/in world medieval concept serving as a cover for such truths. It's true that the history is too unclear at the moment to find any more clues of substance on the matter. The tale of Jace's trip up north does seem to add weight behind Eddard's words to Robert. Words that frankly I wouldn't take lightly considering Robert's own ties to the dragon. If one found that line of dialogue to be taken literally, if not by Ned, then by our author, this union would be an excellent place to point as the parallel to Jon's possible conception are definitely there. We can only glean so much from a story told from the perspective of southern gossip and the only real places we can hope to learn anymore would be through a future Bran POV or, as you say, Dunk n Egg.
  14. House Strong comes to mind. George tells us a tale of a son of Rhaenyra who forges a strong bond with Eddard's ancestors. While we know the prince ultimately losses his life, the whole forbidden union angle between him and Sara Snow is so very reminiscent of Jon's possible origin that you can't help but wonder. Did a descendant of Sara find they're way back into the main branch of house Stark? Yeah you can see how it would be such an easy thing for GRRM to conflate the two, king's blood and magic blood. Yes Mance is an interesting one to tackle. Pure speculation here but I often wonder if magic in Asoiaf really is just one thing with many names. More specifically if we're talking magic blood could we really be talking blood of valaryia or even something similar but even older? The children with their arguably reptilian features masked in mammalian language and their pale hair and wild beauty, is it possible that to have the blood of the first men is no different than to have the blood of our Targaryen/ Baratheon kings? Dala and Val who are supposedly strong with the blood of the fist men, where does their beauty really come from? Or even if one looks to Craster, with his pale hair , sheepskin clothing and incestuous lifestyle could the blood of the dragon flow through him? Is "Kings blood" strong in the north? Belief is a funny thing when it comes to magic. How many people have to believe your king before the magic sets in? Is it really Mances kingship that gives Aemon Steelsong his power? Did jon really remove "Kingsblood" from the equation by placing baby Monster in Mel's hands?
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