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Elegant Woes

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About Elegant Woes

  • Birthday 09/06/1992

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  1. It's Sansa Stark for me. I love it how songs are such a huge theme in her narrative and the way Sansa is forced to differentiate the truth from the lies is, in my opinion, the most compelling storyline. It's quite obvious that the truth she will learn near the end of ASOIAF will be one of the biggest messages that GRRM is trying to convey with his series. Her character is by far the most beautiful and compelling to me and in my opinion the rest of the cast can't compare to Sansa Stark.
  2. So many people in here seem to believe that Sansa will betray her family at some point. It makes me wonder, is it something that you have evidence for or is this what you guys just want to happen?
  3. It's Sansa. She is the only one who makes the prophecy about being a queen and ruling. Also Sansa took several things away from Cersei - her child, Jaime and her power, and she did this by being kind and merciful - qualities that Cersei abhors. There's something cathartic about Cersei being brought down by traits she looks down upon.
  4. Yes she is capable of playing the meek submissive simpleton. That doesn't mean she's genuinely like that. While Sansa is overall a kind, polite, and gentle girl who is not quick to get angry, she still has a temper, and that temper resurfaces a couple of times throughout the series (i.e when Arya throws a blood orange in her face and ruins her betrothal gift, when Joffrey taunts her about how he will kill Robb, when little Robert destroys her snow replica of Winterfell). Sansa not kneeling is just another example of that she has a threshold. Sansa not kneeling is not a sign she's mean. It just mean she's human. By denying her of this you are saying you have an issue with Sansa being a multifaceted character.
  5. So what if Sansa was a mean girl to Tyrion? Don't you think her response was valid? If not then, pray tell, what is the appropriate way to respond to a man twice your age who is forcibly marrying you? To be clear I am not attacking you. I am just curious about what you think is the right course of action that Sansa should take.
  6. I think when we talk about the not kneeling part we do not take the situation in consideration. This is what happened before the changing of the cloaks began: Everyone at the wedding chose to ignore the fact that Sansa was pitifully crying - including Tyrion. He alongside everyone else never took her feelings into consideration. This is why she thinks this a couple lines later: Sansa makes a valid point here. Why on earth should she care about Tyrion's feelings when he cannot extent the same courtesy to her. He didn't care about how she stood there crying therefore she's not obligated to care about his humiliation. It's all about reciprocity. Giving back what was given to you. Tyrion chose to be insensitive to her so Sansa was insensitive back. If anyone thinks that Sansa didn't have to fight fire with fire then I have to ask you. Why are we expecting a twelve year old child to be the bigger person to twenty-six year old man who is forcibly marrying her? Is her anger not valid? Doesn't she also have her dignity?
  7. I am 100% sure that Aegon will marry Arianne. The biggest problem Aegon will face is people, particularly his enemies, questioning his identity as the real Aegon Targaryen and therefore his right to rule Westeros. The best way to combat that is to gain the approval and the backing of the Martell family.
  8. He will live and stay the Lord of the Vale for a very long time. Harry is the more likely person to die.
  9. I don't see Jon and Dany happening. If this story was your typical medieval fantasy story written by someone else then sure, but this isn't your typical medieval fantasy book, and nor is GRRM your typical writer. GRRM deconstructs the medieval fantasy archetypes and story lines and reconstructs them into something you wouldn't expect. Based on that Jon and Dany is highly impossible. If anything they are more likely to end up as enemies than lovers.
  10. I don't see why Dany is the highest contender to be Jon's lover, because ADWD highlights how incompatible these two would be. Also incest is incest. You can't make exception just because Dany and Jon are tropey enough to end up together in the typical fantasy novel. If anything that is a slight against them. GRRM isn't writing your typical story. He likes to give a twist to cliché story lines and archetypes. Dany and Jon are more likely to be enemies who hate each other's guts than lovers and allies. ADWD proves just that.
  11. I never implied that them looking like each other was the only reason why their dynamic is so inherently twisted. Just that it plays a decent part of it. I would like to appreciate it if you didn't straw man me. Secondly the reason why Jon and Arya won't happen is because the age gap is way too wide between them. Arya will be, at most, 13-14 years old near the end of ADOS whereas Jon will be 18/19. At least with Jon and Sansa the age difference is only 2.5/3 years.
  12. No I don't see Jon and Arya ending up together. GRRM wouldn't slowly draw out a giant theme of how narcissistic and toxic the relationships between the Lannisters twins or the same looking Targaryens are only to make Jon and Arya end up together. That's just hypocritical on his part. If, and that is a big if, GRRM is going for a half-siblings/cousin romance then he has to go for one that is a foil to Jaime/Cersei and the Targaryens, not a parallel. They have to look so different from each other that no one would believe they are related and weren't close to each other growing up. If the Stark cousin romance is still on deal, and that is a huge IF because we can't know what's GRRM intention, then it can only be Jon and Sansa.
  13. @winter daughter I was specifically talking about Sansa's possible attraction towards Jon not the other way around. However now that you bring that up I would like to remind you that what attracted Jon to Val and Ygritte in the first place is their softer traits (Ygritte singing and romanticizing songs while being moved to tears by them, Val's maternal side). These are traits that Sansa also exhibits. Secondly when Jon thinks of them in romantic lens he also tries to change them into something that they aren't. Thirdly there is nothing suggest he can't fall for a more traditionally feminine woman. In fact I would argue that the warrior princess sounds like an ironic hint he might fall exactly for a woman like that. Sure Sansa's taste in men can change, however I would like to see evidence of that before I can agree that it has changed. Sansa's crush on Waymar Royce is significant because of how she describes her feelings for him. She wildly fell in love with him. GRRM never described her romantic feelings towards Joffrey and Loras this way. You seem to forget that Waymar Royce himself looks a lot like Ned and Jon. He has the Stark look: long face, dark brown hair and grey eyes. In fact the description that was used for Waymar is also used for Jon. Not only that Jon already has a special connection with Waymar on a narrative level. The mini arc of Waymar in the Prologue foreshadows a lot of things about Jon. Waymar starts off arrogant and thinks he is better than anyone else but learns to accept he's a man of the night's watch (Jon's AGOT arc), confrontation with the Others (Jon from AGOT and onward), dying and rising from the death (Jon's TWOW arc). Perhaps to you it might not be meaningful, but the fact that GRRM chose to make Sansa have romantic feelings for this character is very significant to me.
  14. Except there is enough evidence to support Sansa could fall in love with Jon. Sansa taste in men is very specific. She is into heroic, gallant and courteous men. Jon is the one person who comes close to the heroes from the songs she loves so much while stil being a complex and gray character. He doesn't interact with women much but when he does he is courteous and gallant with them (the Gilly incident doesn't count). Secondly Sansa's wild crush on Waymar Royce shows she is very much into the Stark look. All of this shows to me that Sansa could very well be attracted to Jon once they meet. @Alyn Oakenfist Jon doesn't want to be King in the North. He wants to be a Stark and Lord of Winterfell. To have a lady wife and legitimate children. He wants to belong and be validated. His dreams are very specific. In fact it's so specific it would be a cop out if he doesn't end up getting what he wants in the end. And this is why I am in favor of Sansa and Jon ending up together. They validate each other's very specific dreams. In terms of symbolism (association with the Bael the Bard tale, key to the North, rebuilding Winterfell, Lady being buried in Winterfell) Sansa is the most likely Stark to be the ruler of Winterfell. And if she is and marries Jon in the end she gives exactly what he wanted from day one. And Jon in return gives what she wanted from day one. In my opinion this is a logical conclusion to their respective arc.
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