Mourning Star

There are a bunch of problems with the comment above but it’s not worth nitpicking everything too much. Your measurements of time seems pretty off to me, the battle of the bells was about a year after Lyanna’s disappearance (very early 282-283). So I have no idea how you get only 8-12 months with Rhaegar, at least a year would seem closer to the text, and that’s still ending early 283, mid war. Both pregnancies wouldn’t be during that time obviously, only one, and a conception. Rhaegar still has to raise a new army, fight bravely and die before the Sack. You also seem to try and use Rhaella’s child’s birthday to refute a theory about Dany not being that child, which makes no sense at all. The events of the ToJ are probably near the end of 283, given all that happens between the battle of the bells and then. Two pregnancies in two years isn’t problematic. At a very basic level, Lyanna disappearing a few months after the Tourney of Harrenhall, where she was “crowned the queen of love and beauty” by Rhaegar, where all the smiles died, is almost certainly due to pregnancy. That said there is a lot we don’t know and plenty of room for speculation.

Bloodraven himself says he was once a crow (as in the Night’s Watch). He isn’t any longer. "A … crow?" The pale lord's voice was dry. His lips moved slowly, as if they had forgotten how to form words. "Once, aye. Black of garb and black of blood." The clothes he wore were rotten and faded, spotted with moss and eaten through with worms, but once they had been black. "I have been many things, Bran. Now I am as you see me, and now you will understand why I could not come to you … except in dreams. A crow is not a raven, the two kinds of birds don’t get along in the series. GRRM even uses some version of the “crow calling the raven black” in every book. Even more obviously in relation to the three eyed crow, Bloodraven doesn’t even know what Bran is talking about and wrongly assumes he means the Night’s Watch, while the crow and Bran discussed wings and flying in his falling dream. The quote above should be proof to anyone that Bloodraven is not the three eyed crow. Hell, Bran even tells us that at some level he knows this. He liked it better when the torcheswere put out. In the dark he could pretend that it was the three-eyed crow who whispered to him and not some grisly talking corpse. Bran only calls Bloodraven the three eyed crow when he is “in the dark”.

I legitimately can’t tell if this is some sort of meme/troll/inside joke or if you are actually asking honest questions here. This makes no sense. He notes specifically some things are as they were in life, and some things are not. This doesn’t imply anything about the parts he doesn’t note specifically one way or the other. What are you trying to say? Is this some reference to another conversation or something, because without context I have no idea what you are talking about. It’s a story where the mystery, known to Ned as a POV, is very clearly kept from the reader. What you are saying does not make sense, but so much so that I really have to assume this is just like a partial thought or joke or something. It’s more that lots of details are clearly missing right? There is clearly “dream stuff” that isn’t realistic like wraith men and storms of rose petals. It’s a dream, and there frankly aren’t many details. Like is the dialogue exactly what was said? Close enough. Maybe Ned didn’t hear Lyanna screaming at him during a sword fight, but he associates her with it. If you are trying to make a point you need to be a lot more specific. Use quotes. What does the dream being correct even mean? smh

This is unclear. We see on Dragonstone that a young maester can be sent to assist (and presumably be ready to replace) an old one. We don't know when Kym died, he's only mentioned once. It's possible Luwin was in Riverrun and accompanied Cat to Winterfell, to help care for her and the child, as well as to replace Master Walys (whose whereabouts and/or fate are unknown). Perhaps he was a younger maester serving at Riverrun at the time, and Vyman arrived only after the rebellion. Maybe both Luwin and Vyman were there. There was also a war on when Luwin delivered Cat's baby, with a large gathering of lords (and presumably some maesters along side them) at Riverrun for the double wedding where Robb was conceived. Long story short we don't know Luwins history or origin, but it does sound like he served house Tully when Cat gave birth to Cat.

It's still unclear to me if the app is reliable for information that can't be sourced to the text. But, it's not unreasonable to suppose that Jeffory Mallister could have been Jason's brother. It's really hard to be sure of anything here. He does seem pretty alive post Aerys. "When he was young, His Grace rode brilliantly in a tourney at Storm's End, defeating Lord Steffon Baratheon, Lord Jason Mallister, the Red Viper of Dorne, and a mystery knight who proved to be the infamous Simon Toyne, chief of the kingswood outlaws. He broke twelve lances against Ser Arthur Dayne that day." Barristan said Rhaegar defeated both Steffon Baratheon and Jason Mallister in the same tournament. Steffon died before the rebellion. Barristan might be wrong/misremembering? Maybe Jason's dad's name was Jason? But, I don't have any additional reason to suspect the answer to either of those being yes, and in general I don't think dismissing accounts as incorrect, or inventing hypothetical characters with the same name as an existing character, without any corroborating evidence, is very productive. So, not sure, but it sure looks like it. Unless you have another explanation?

In those centuries of trial and tumult, the Reach produced many a fearless warrior. From that day to this, the singers have celebrated the deeds of knights like Serwyn of the Mirror Shield, Davos the Dragonslayer, Roland of the Horn, and the Knight Without Armor—and the legendary kings who led them, among them Garth V (Hammer of the Dornish), Gwayne I (the Gallant), Gyles I (the Woe), Gareth II (the Grim), Garth VI (the Morningstar), and Gordan I (Grey-Eyes).

Aerys is clearly a messed up dude, he'd have a man burned alive then go rape his sister wife. You can't explain that one away in my opinion. But riddle me this? Jaime poured the last half cup of wine. "He rode into the Red Keep with a few companions, shouting for Prince Rhaegar to come out and die. But Rhaegar wasn't there. Aerys sent his guards to arrest them all for plotting his son's murder. The others were lords' sons too, it seems to me." "Ethan Glover was Brandon's squire," Catelyn said. "He was the only one to survive. The others were Jeffory Mallister, Kyle Royce, and Elbert Arryn, Jon Arryn's nephew and heir." It was queer how she still remembered the names, after so many years. "Aerys accused them of treason and summoned their fathers to court to answer the charge, with the sons as hostages. When they came, he had them murdered without trial. Fathers and sons both." "There were trials. Of a sort. Lord Rickard demanded trial by combat, and the king granted the request. Stark armored himself as for battle, thinking to duel one of the Kingsguard. Me, perhaps. Instead they took him to the throne room and suspended him from the rafters while two of Aerys's pyromancers kindled a blaze beneath him. The king told him that fire was the champion of House Targaryen. So all Lord Rickard needed to do to prove himself innocent of treason was . . . well, not burn. Ethan Glover survived, only to be one of Ned's companions at the Tower of Joy. We don't know who his father was. Why was he spared? Galbart Glover is seemingly trusted by Ned, and Robb, but has no wife. He is sent with Jason Mallister to the Neck, and so was spared being at the Red Wedding. Jeffory Mallister's relation to Jason Mallister is unknown. However, Barristan names Jason lord during his account of the Tourney at Storm's End, which occurred before the rebellion. The Mallisters are sworn to Riverrun . Kyle Royce is mentioned one time only, above, in the series. His relation to the other members of House Royce is unknown, but we know of two Lords Royce, Nestor and Yohn (who was a lord before the rebellion, judging by Tywin having offered Tyrion's hand to his daughter, which was rejected). Elbert Arryn was the son of Ronnel Arryn, who we are told by Littlefinger died when he was born, of a bad belly. So while Jaime says there were trials, of a sort, it's extremely unclear to me who Aerys had killed, besides the Starks and the sons listed above. Elbert's father was dead, and I see no mention of Aerys summoning Jon Arryn in his place, Jason Mallister was Lord of Seaguard then and is still alive, and I don't even know who Kyle is. Madness!

Love it... and I would add that this analogy might well be applied to the Onion Knight himself: Lord Stannis had rewarded Davos with choice lands on Cape Wrath, a small keep, and a knight's honors . . . but he had also decreed that he lose a joint of each finger on his left hand, to pay for all his years of smuggling. Davos had submitted, on the condition that Stannis wield the knife himself; he would accept no punishment from lesser hands. The lord had used a butcher's cleaver, the better to cut clean and true. Afterward, Davos had chosen the name Seaworth for his new-made house, and he took for his banner a black ship on a pale grey field—with an onion on its sails. The onetime smuggler was fond of saying that Lord Stannis had done him a boon, by giving him four less fingernails to clean and trim.

And yet, we have stories from long before the Andals came to Westeros, supposedly bringing iron, of knights riding around, of the Others hating iron, there is the tradition of iron swords being left on Stark crypts, and of course there is Dawn. I think it's a mistake to try and view the world of A Song of Ice and Fire purely through a historical lens. This is a fantasy world and in fantasy there is a long tradition of technology decaying rather than progressing (probably a relic in the Western world from the classical perception of the fall of Rome and "dark ages"). Valyria makes for a nice parallel here, along with the secrets of forging Valyrian Steel being lost. The fact that the oldest keep in Winterfell is round (with gargoyles), despite the building of round towers supposedly being a bit of technological wisdom that came with the Andals, according to Jaime, and the fantastical constructions of Brandon the builder, including the hot water filled walls of Winterfell, drum tower of Storm's End, and the stone High Tower, may point to a historic group in Westeros with more advancement than the First Men are generally credited. Not to mention the "Iron Born".

I'm not sure we can place they grey eyes in a specific geographic place, while there are a bunch of characters in the North with them, including wildlings, there are also people like Homeless Harry Strickland, Bronze Yohn Royce and even a Gardener King. That said, a First Man connection might be there, for whatever it's worth. As for the name, I like the idea that its a play on "Lewin", meaning beloved friend, and "Lupus" meaning wolf, making Luwin a wolf friend. I've always been intrigued by Luwin's comment here, but I don't have any real insight to share regarding his origins: "There are men who call themselves mages and warlocks," Maester Luwin said. "I had a friend at the Citadel who could pull a rose out of your ear, but he was no more magical than I was. Oh, to be sure, there is much we do not understand. The years pass in their hundreds and their thousands, and what does any man see of life but a few summers, a few winters? We look at mountains and call them eternal, and so they seem . . . but in the course of time, mountains rise and fall, rivers change their courses, stars fall from the sky, and great cities sink beneath the sea. Even gods die, we think. Everything changes.

Cat was impressed: "It's good to know my son's life was not sold cheaply," Catelyn said bitterly. I have to say this is one of the funnier objections I've heard. On this I agree, and for the simple reason that would be true of any suspect, nobody could have planned for Bran to fall. Whoever sent the catspaw was improvising, but seemingly in a rather rational way. Why do you think this? He's about to gather the Wildlings and attack the realm. Ned had already left Winterfell. Again, the assassin was sent after the king's party had left. The Catspaw had been waiting in the stables, which as Hallis Mollen tells us, is no great trick. If it worked for one man, why not two? Again, I think Mance was interested in finding something in the WInterfell Library, and what he found led him to gathering the Wildlings in the Frostfangs, where they were digging for something, including seemingly digging up ancient graves of giants. Climbing over the Wall, no problem. Sneaking into Winterfell, piece of cake. Getting into a Library? Preposterous! I'm just going to trust that Mance is a capable sneakthief given what we know of him and his exploits. Clearly I disagree. It seems more like people are searching for reasons it can't be true because they know Joff is a bad answer but they don't want to change their preconceived notions. Varys didn't know about Lysa's letter either. Nor is that the origin of Ned's dislike of the Lannisters, it certainly has nothing to do with the Lannisters' feelings as they don't know about it either. It would take no great observer to see the animosity between the Lannisters and the Starks, and Mance was a self described observer. I betook of your lord father's meat and mead, had a look at Kingslayer and Imp In fact, at the feast where Mance admits to being, they were hostile enough for it to be obvious to a child: Jon had noticed that too. A bastard had to learn to notice things, to read the truth that people hid behind their eyes. His father was observing all the courtesies, but there was tightness in him that Jon had seldom seen before. He said little, looking out over the hall with hooded eyes, seeing nothing. Two seats away, the king had been drinking heavily all night. His broad face was flushed behind his great black beard. He made many a toast, laughed loudly at every jest, and attacked each dish like a starving man, but beside him the queen seemed as cold as an ice sculpture. "The queen is angry too," Jon told his uncle in a low, quiet voice. "Father took the king down to the crypts this afternoon. The queen didn't want him to go." Benjen gave Jon a careful, measuring look. "You don't miss much, do you, Jon? We could use a man like you on the Wall."

It would have been a stretch to predict that Mance was in Winterfell during Robert's visit, but that he was involved in the catspaw? Someone might surmise it. Seems a lot more likely than the child who can't count and doesn't care about Bran, even in A Game of Thrones. That said, I first read the books when Storm of Swords released, so I can't really have a personal opinion on what I'd have thought before that. But, once you learn Mance was there... with a bag of silver and a cat's paw slashed cloak? Seems like a dunk. The man had been taken outside a small holdfast in the hills. Robb thought he was a wildling, his sword sworn to Mance Rayder, the King-beyond-the-Wall. It made Bran's skin prickle to think of it. A Game of Thrones - Bran I "You're as stupid as you are ugly, Hali," said the tall woman. "The boy's worth nothing dead, but alive … gods be damned, think what Mance would give to have Benjen Stark's own blood to hostage!" A Game of Thrones - Bran V Mance thinks he'll fight, the brave sweet stubborn man, like the white walkers were no more than rangers, but what does he know? He can call himself King-beyond-the-Wall all he likes, but he's still just another old black crow who flew down from the Shadow Tower. He's never tasted winter. A Game of Thrones - Bran VI

I agree that Varys is not omniscient and is only surmising that the Lannister's are behind the plot. "The fools tried to kill his son, and what's worse, they made a mummer's farce of it. He's not a man to put that aside. I warn you, the wolf and lion will soon be at each other's throats, whether we will it or no." A Game of Thrones - Arya III "The Wall can stop an army, but not a man alone. I took a lute and a bag of silver, scaled the ice near Long Barrow, walked a few leagues south of the New Gift, and bought a horse. All in all I made much better time than Robert, who was traveling with a ponderous great wheelhouse to keep his queen in comfort. A day south of Winterfell I came up on him and fell in with his company. Freeriders and hedge knights are always attaching themselves to royal processions, in hopes of finding service with the king, and my lute gained me easy acceptance." He laughed. "I know every bawdy song that's ever been made, north or south of the Wall. So there you are. The night your father feasted Robert, I sat in the back of his hall on a bench with the other freeriders, listening to Orland of Oldtown play the high harp and sing of dead kings beneath the sea. I betook of your lord father's meat and mead, had a look at Kingslayer and Imp . . . and made passing note of Lord Eddard's children and the wolf pups that ran at their heels." A Storm of Swords - Jon I The only hard evidence we are given is the Valyrian blade and the bag of silver. The blade was taken from the baggage train. But, I believe Tyrion's mistaken conclusion that it was Joff, based more on his hate of Joff than any evidence, does provide the reader with additional textual clues. He ought to have seen it long ago. Jaime would never send another man to do his killing, and Cersei was too cunning to use a knife that could be traced back to her, but Joff, arrogant vicious stupid little wretch that he was . . . He remembered a cold morning when he'd climbed down the steep exterior steps from Winterfell's library to find Prince Joffrey jesting with the Hound about killing wolves. Send a dog to kill a wolf, he said. Even Joffrey was not so foolish as to command Sandor Clegane to slay a son of Eddard Stark, however; the Hound would have gone to Cersei. Instead the boy found his catspaw among the unsavory lot of freeriders, merchants, and camp followers who'd attached themselves to the king's party as they made their way north. Some poxy lackwit willing to risk his life for a prince's favor and a little coin. Tyrion wondered whose idea it had been to wait until Robert left Winterfell before opening Bran's throat. Joff's, most like. No doubt he thought it was the height of cunning. The prince's own dagger had a jeweled pommel and inlaid goldwork on the blade, Tyrion seemed to recall. At least Joff had not been stupid enough to use that. Instead he went poking among his father's weapons. Robert Baratheon was a man of careless generosity, and would have given his son any dagger he wanted . . . but Tyrion guessed that the boy had just taken it. Robert had come to Winterfell with a long tail of knights and retainers, a huge wheelhouse, and a baggage train. No doubt some diligent servant had made certain that the king's weapons went with him, in case he should desire any of them. The blade Joff chose was nice and plain. No goldwork, no jewels in the hilt, no silver inlay on the blade. King Robert never wore it, had likely forgotten he owned it. Yet the Valyrian steel was deadly sharp . . . sharp enough to slice through skin, flesh, and muscle in one quick stroke. I am no stranger to Valyrian steel. But he had been, hadn't he? Else he would never have been so foolish as to pick Littlefinger's knife. The why of it still eluded him. Simple cruelty, perhaps? His nephew had that in abundance. It was all Tyrion could do not to retch up all the wine he'd drunk, piss in his breeches, or both. He squirmed uncomfortably. He ought to have held his tongue at breakfast. The boy knows I know now. My big mouth will be the death of me, I swear it. A Storm of Swords - Tyrion VIII Tyrion is literally piss drunk at the point he is coming to this conclusion. Joffrey would not be a stranger to Valyrian Steel after Ned's execution, he even uses the two handed executioners swing when cutting the book Tyrion gave him. Tyrion misquotes the, "send a dog to kill a wolf," line. I think this is meant to call us back to the section below from Game of Thrones, and also he leaves us with the question of the why of it. His legs were stiff and sore as he eased down off the bench. He massaged some life back into them and limped heavily to the table where the septon was snoring softly, his head pillowed on an open book in front of him. Tyrion glanced at the title. A life of the Grand Maester Aethelmure, no wonder. "Chayle," he said softly. The young man jerked up, blinking, confused, the crystal of his order swinging wildly on its silver chain. "I'm off to break my fast. See that you return the books to the shelves. Be gentle with the Valyrian scrolls, the parchment is very dry. Ayrmidon's Engines of War is quite rare, and yours is the only complete copy I've ever seen." Chayle gaped at him, still half-asleep. Patiently, Tyrion repeated his instructions, then clapped the septon on the shoulder and left him to his tasks. Outside, Tyrion swallowed a lungful of the cold morning air and began his laborious descent of the steep stone steps that corkscrewed around the exterior of the library tower. It was slow going; the steps were cut high and narrow, while his legs were short and twisted. The rising sun had not yet cleared the walls of Winterfell, but the men were already hard at it in the yard below. Sandor Clegane's rasping voice drifted up to him. "The boy is a long time dying. I wish he would be quicker about it." Tyrion glanced down and saw the Hound standing with young Joffrey as squires swarmed around them. "At least he dies quietly," the prince replied. "It's the wolf that makes the noise. I could scarce sleep last night." Clegane cast a long shadow across the hard-packed earth as his squire lowered the black helm over his head. "I could silence the creature, if it please you," he said through his open visor. His boy placed a longsword in his hand. He tested the weight of it, slicing at the cold morning air. Behind him, the yard rang to the clangor of steel on steel. The notion seemed to delight the prince. "Send a dog to kill a dog!" he exclaimed. "Winterfell is so infested with wolves, the Starks would never miss one." Tyrion hopped off the last step onto the yard. "I beg to differ, nephew," he said. "The Starks can count past six. Unlike some princes I might name." Joffrey had the grace at least to blush. "A voice from nowhere," Sandor said. He peered through his helm, looking this way and that. "Spirits of the air!" The prince laughed, as he always laughed when his bodyguard did this mummer's farce. Tyrion was used to it. "Down here." The tall man peered down at the ground, and pretended to notice him. "The little lord Tyrion," he said. "My pardons. I did not see you standing there." "I am in no mood for your insolence today." Tyrion turned to his nephew. "Joffrey, it is past time you called on Lord Eddard and his lady, to offer them your comfort." Joffrey looked as petulant as only a boy prince can look. "What good will my comfort do them?" "None," Tyrion said. "Yet it is expected of you. Your absence has been noted." "The Stark boy is nothing to me," Joffrey said. "I cannot abide the wailing of women." A Game of Thrones - Tyrion I Joffrey is annoyed by the howling of the wolves, and literally says that the boy means nothing to him. Nor does he seemingly take action against Tyrion, despite Tyrion thinking he's given away the fact that he knows about Joff's supposed catspaw. The phrase, mummer's farce appears again, this time in reference to The Hounds antics, pretending he can't see Tyrion. Except, in retrospect, there was a person secretly in Winterfell, Mance Rayder, who is also mentioned remarkably early in the story, for someone we only meet later. This brings us back to the question Tyrion left us with, the why of it. I don't think Mance went all the way to Winterfell just to see Robert, in what otherwise amounts to little or nothing in the plot. And, I believe Mance has a double motive. First, as Varys points out, the mummer's farce sets the lion and the wolf at each other's throats. But, this would likely have been a crime of opportunity, as it's hard to imagine Mance would know that Bran would fall and end up crippled. Second, and maybe the real reason for Mance's visit to Winterfell in the first place, is the library and it's ancient information. The fire was seen by everyone as a diversion from the catspaw, but I'd suggest that it was as much a target if not more, and whatever Mance found is what led him to digging in the Frostfangs. Tyrion spending his night's there probably played a role in waiting for the king's party to leave as well. "They're dogs and he's a wolf," said Jon. "They know he's not their kind." No more than I am yours. But he had his duty to be mindful of, the task Qhorin Halfhand had laid upon him as they shared that final fire—to play the part of turncloak, and find whatever it was that the wildlings had been seeking in the bleak cold wilderness of the Frostfangs. "Some power," Qhorin had named it to the Old Bear, but he had died before learning what it was, or whether Mance Rayder had found it with his digging. A Storm of Swords - Jon I So, in conclusion, I think Mance is the shadowcat behind the catspaw assassin who tried to kill Bran, and the evidence was given to the reader in A Storm of Swords.

This is literally a haterade thread with people asking questions then acting put upon when they are answered. I'm telling you where I think the story is going, no skin off my back if you don't believe it. But let it rest? No, these discussions have only served to convince me there's something to this. Obviously, one has to speculate about details since we don't have the end of the story, but people who pretend lemongate doesn't exist won't change the text in front of me. I don't think there is a reasonable way to reconstruct Cat's beliefs about Jon that makes sense. I think she has shown herself to be unreliable when it comes to him. Her own children had more Tully about them than Stark. Arya was the only one to show much of Ned in her features. And Jon Snow, but he was never mine. She found herself thinking of Jon's mother, that shadowy secret love her husband would never speak of. Does she grieve for Ned as I do? Or did she hate him for leaving her bed for mine? Does she pray for her son as I have prayed for mine? They were uncomfortable thoughts, and futile. If Jon had been born of Ashara Dayne of Starfall, as some whispered, the lady was long dead; if not, Catelyn had no clue who or where his mother might be. And it made no matter. Ned was gone now, and his loves and his secrets had all died with him. The only theory she has heard of for who Jon's mother would be was Ashara Dayne, and we are told that story in Arya's chapter, it's about the Tourney of Harrenhall. "Aye, he told me. Lady Ashara Dayne. It's an old tale, that one. I heard it once at Winterfell, when I was no older than you are now." He took hold of her bridle firmly and turned her horse around. "I doubt there's any truth to it. But if there is, what of it? When Ned met this Dornish lady, his brother Brandon was still alive, and it was him betrothed to Lady Catelyn, so there's no stain on your father's honor. There's nought like a tourney to make the blood run hot, so maybe some words were whispered in a tent of a night, who can say? Words or kisses, maybe more, but where's the harm in that? Spring had come, or so they thought, and neither one of them was pledged." Cat does not dismiss this story because of Jon's perceived age, so I have to conclude that, in the story, this is not an issue. If only we had a Dunk and Egg story from their time in Dorne!

Nobody is asking you to disprove anything. I think the text asks us to question Dany's past, and I think this is the best explanation for the information we have, that's all. And you can grow lemons inside with heat lamps, but we are dealing with a story and should probably put down the rulers and stop watches when discussing it. Great point, Jon was also an orphan if he is the child of Rhaegar and Lyanna too. Unclear how long Wylla stayed in Winterfell and what role she played, maybe she was just caring for the boy and not breastfeeding any longer at that point.

Honestly, I think we have to give old George a little leeway when it comes to babies, not sure he ever had one. But for another example, there is Ermesande Hayford. Who is a baby with a wetnurse during the Tourney for Joff's Nameday in Clash of Kings, and still is when Jaime see's her at Hayford in Feast for Crows.

As long as you are sorry

I see them as described as "of an age", but that's hardly specific. Because this: He did more than that. The Starks were not like other men. Ned brought his bastard home with him, and called him "son" for all the north to see. When the wars were over at last, and Catelyn rode to Winterfell, Jon and his wet nurse had already taken up residence. Doesn't call Jon a newborn baby. And of course there is this great interaction in Jon's fist chapter: "I am almost a man grown," Jon protested. "I will turn fifteen on my next name day, and Maester Luwin says bastards grow up faster than other children." "That's true enough," Benjen said with a downward twist of his mouth. He took Jon's cup from the table, filled it fresh from a nearby pitcher, and drank down a long swallow. Repeated again in his 6th chapter: He'd heard it said that bastards grow up faster than other children; on the Wall, you grew up or you died. Like I get it, it's hard to believe Cat could mistake the age of such a young child, but honestly it's hard to believe Cat really gave the whole thing much honest thought if she thought Ashara was the mother and the story about her and Ned was from Harrenhall, let alone that Ned would have cheated on her after they were married, or when he'd have found time.

Are you highlighting the point that a name can be spelled multiple ways and pronounced the same? Or just quoting a transcript as if it were the text? Well, not even quoting, referencing. If you want to clean up the attitude and ask honest questions I'm game, otherwise be well.

How do you know this? After that he remembered nothing. They had found him still holding her body, silent with grief. The little crannogman, Howland Reed, had taken her hand from his. Ned could recall none of it. I think the issue is that people put to much stock in Cat's view of Jon when it comes to his age, which was biased at best, and in my opinion likely more akin to willful ignorance. The story about Ned and Ashara, that Cat seemingly believed, as told to Arya, was a conception at Harrenhall. "Aye, he told me. Lady Ashara Dayne. It's an old tale, that one. I heard it once at Winterfell, when I was no older than you are now." He took hold of her bridle firmly and turned her horse around. "I doubt there's any truth to it. But if there is, what of it? When Ned met this Dornish lady, his brother Brandon was still alive, and it was him betrothed to Lady Catelyn, so there's no stain on your father's honor. There's nought like a tourney to make the blood run hot, so maybe some words were whispered in a tent of a night, who can say? Words or kisses, maybe more, but where's the harm in that? Spring had come, or so they thought, and neither one of them was pledged." While I don't believe that Ned and Ashara are Jon's parents, I think his being conceived at Harrenhall makes a lot of sense.

So you're suggesting the author is making a statement about an unmentioned character with the same name as a character in the book? Really? Hahaha Ok, have a good one

The Tourney of Harrenhall was in 281, the events at the Tower of Joy were in 283, there was time for two pregnancies.

The chapter names change for the same character, I expect to see a "Dany" chapter or a few before the series is over. This is part of how GRRM plays with "identity". Ok sure. I'm not big on using quotes from the author instead of the text in the first place. I'm not sure what your point is, but ya sure, people can have the same name. Ok, I don't know why you'd think this but yes obviously not naming Tywin as Tyrions father in the quote you supplied seems just as intriguing as not saying who Dany's mother was. Edric Dayne is younger than Jon. I mean you sound dumb sure, but you must have thought there was a reason to ask dumb questions. The clear difference between making up imaginary characters with the same name as an existing character and the theory that Dany doesn't know her past is textual evidence.

To point out the obvious, "Dany" is not the same name as Daenerys, and I think there are a lot of people who don't think Jon's real name is Jon at all, but Aegon. "Danny" is a northern name, as in Danny Flint. Lyanna's Grandmother was a Flint. GRRM likes his name games, just look at the titles of the chapters, and probably also something with Willem/Willam.

FWIW Occam’s razor doesn’t apply to fiction at all, especially not fantasy.