Odej

Jaime's idea of telling everyone the true about his incestuous relationship with Cersei so they could live together. Jaime's intention of killing Arya out of Cersei's desire after Nymeria attacked Joffrey. It's said Aerys did many things only to be contrary to Tywin's wishes cause the king was jealous of his Hand, it never ocurred to Tywin to use reverse psychology?

Jaime Lannister: I love the turn of tables that overtakes him after he lost the two things that had defined him his entire life: his skill with a sword and his incestous relationship with Cersei. Sansa Stark: The naive little girl who had all of dreams shattered having to learn to play the grown-up game and potentially outwitting her tutor, that's my thing. Brynden Rivers: What can I say? He makes horny.

That is by far the best thing I've read in a while

Honestly, I don't believe in any of the more famous theories about Lemore: Ashara, Elia, Mellario, Tyene's mother, etc. I try them several times, but they seem absurd to me and the supposed signs and evidence more the product of the reader's desire to believe than actually deliberate hints. If Lemore's identity is something significant, I believe and hope that this time Martin will surprise us.

I agree that Rhaegar was a skilled warrior. You must have some excellence to be able to hold a fight for a while and manage to wound one of the most powerful warriors in the kingdom, physically much stronger than you, and who was fighting with the weapon with which he was most destructive. Besides, it doesn't have much to do with the subject of the thread, but I always found it absurd that Aegon V allowed Brynder Rivers to take Darksister to the Wall. It was the Targaryen's valyrian steel sword that only the family's most renowned warriors wielded and they had already lost Blackfyre to the Rebellion, so Darksister was the only one left.

When you think about it, the dramas of a Kingsguard are common to any knight or soldier who serves a Lord. It is absurd to think that all Stark kings and lords were as honorable as Ned and never ordered controversial actions or omissions from their servants. This goes for any other noble house. In the end, Westeros is a feudal society. Obedience to one's masters is not only a matter of honoring an oath, but also driven by the risk of one's own neck. Aerys and Rhaegar's actions crossed the line so much that they ended up triggering a rebellion that removed the Targaryens from power, but in general people just turn a blind eye. Just see how even though he was considered the worst king of Westeros, Aegon IV ruled until his death. It's great to think that if it were me I'd never submit, but there's no sword pointed at my throat as I type.

Sansa Situation: hidden in Vale as Litterfinger's bastard daughter. Pros: recognized as Robb's heir after the supposed death of Bran and Rickon, a marriage of her to Harry Hardyng would get her the support of the Vale. Cons: she is still married to a Lannister, she is a female. Rickon Situation: walking around Skagos. Pro: male, supported by the Starks' wealthiest vassals, the Manderlys, who would offer their support to Stannis (who is going to fight against the Boltons for Winterfell) if the boy is found. Cons: too young and probably too wild. Jon. Situation: apparently dead, but with an almost certain return (whatever that may be). Pro: male and a will from the last king of the North legitimizing him as his heir. Cons: bastard, member of the Night's watch.

I don't believe Ned would ever tell Jon the truth about his birth. And as for not wanting to paint Rhaegar in a bad light, that was unnecessary as the official story of the rebellion was that Rhaegar kidnapped and raped Lyanna. This was common knowledge, Bran tells Osha the story that way so Jon obviously knew too.

Thinking badly of others, even when those others have done questionable things, is not a Ned trait (unless that person is Tywin). I believe he sees no point in brooding over grudges against people who are already dead. There isn't a single thought of his about Aerys II, the king who had his father burned and his brother strangled. When he thinks of Rhaegar it's wondering if the prince frequented brothels and what I find curious is that according to Ned this was his first thought about Rhaegar in years. Assuming that Jon is Rhaegar's son and that Ned saw the boy every single day, it was to imagine that his real father came to Ned's mind with some frequency.

This debate always reminds me of this passage from ACOK “How can you still count yourself a knight, when you have forsaken every vow you ever swore?” Jaime reached for the flagon to refill his cup. “So many vows . . . they make you swear and swear. Defend the king. Obey the king. Keep his secrets. Do his bidding. Your life for his. But obey your father. Love your sister. Protect the innocent. Defend the weak. Respect the gods. Obey the laws. It’s too much. No matter what you do, you’re forsaking one vow or the other.”

I agree that Cersei really didn't literally try to kill Tyrion when he was little, but her hurting him like she did on the Martell visit wasn't an isolated case. "King Baelor imprisoned his own sisters, whose only crime was being beautiful. The first time Cersei heard that tale, she had gone to Tyrion’s nursery and pinched the little monster till he cried." AFFC This episode makes me believe that Cersei hurt Tyrion quite often, not only because she blamed him for her mother's death, but she also used him as a scapegoat for any bad feelings or bad things that afflicted her. This probably stopped while Tyrion was growing up and could blame her, but I totally believe it was a thing.

Arthur Dayne was the youngest knight to wield Dawn. His fame began to spread and he traveled to King's Landing to participate in a tourney. He won and King Aerys bestowed him with the honor of being Prince Rhaegar's sworn shield when the boy was still a child and thus began the friendship between the two.

I believe the main purpose behind all the Aerys/Joanna thing was to raise doubts about Tyrion's parentage. But Martin can make this one more interesting for the lady, at least this time.

If it was really Tywin who had that tunnel built for the Chataya brothel, which I strongly believe, it would be interesting that it was while Joanna was still alive. Aside from his hypocrisy in getting involved with Shae after spending a lifetime criticizing Tyrion for sleeping with whores, it would be a stain on the perfect marriage that Lannisters and his supporters believe Tywin and Joanna had. Added to that, I really like the idea of Joanna having an affair with Aerys. Mostly because I hate the passivity and victim role attributed not only to her, but to other women in the Dead Ladies Club, like Ashara and Lyanna. If a man like Tywin loved, in whatever way, advised and trusted his wife, it suggests that Joanna was closer to being a successful Cersei than a Catelyn Stark. She must have been a real Lannister, which makes her much more interesting and her having an affair with Aerys rather than being a victim of harassment and rape gives her agency. This also would make her relationship with Tywin more complex. Joanna might even like him to some extent, or just wanted a good marriage, but she could had others ambitious and since she was publicly desired by the king this may have increased her vanity. And at the time, Aerys was still handsome and charming even though he'd always been an asshole, but when was that a hindrance?

Renly's most accurate description was said by Lady Olenna Tyrell: "Gallant, yes, and charming, and very clean. He knew how to dress and he knew how to smile and he knew how to bathe, and somehow he got the notion that this made him fit to be king."

The Quentyn is alive/Quentyn is Aegon son of Rhaegar makes me divided between pity and mockery.

We know he will and there were convenient moments for Reed to appear as a Stark vassal and as Jojen and Meera's father, but of course Martin will only make the character appear when it fits for the story he wants to tell. The thing is, unless the writer wants to portray Reed as a neglectful father and vassal, or make his introdution too randon and convenient he better have a good excuse for the character absence all this time. The fact that he remains in the shadows despite everything that has happened makes me think Martin is going to make a pretty dramatic entrance to him and I believe is going to be during the power struggle at Winterfell between Sansa, Rickon and Jon. In what context do you think Howland will finally show himself?

It's not a big question, but it always bothered me. JonCon was one of the prince's men. A close friend, even if not close enough for Rhaegar pick him for Lyanna's abduction group. By this time the mad king was quite paranoid about his son so it's strange to me that Aerys chose a guy remarkably loyal to Rhaegar to be his Hand. And given all of JonCon's crush on Rhaegar and how that's reflected in Griff's grudge against Elia, I also find it strange that he doesn't mention Lyanna at any point. But I imagine Martin is saving that for the sixth book, where much concerning Harrenhal is likely to be revealed and I think JonCon as well as Howland Reed will be an important source of information.

I always wondered why there's no mention of the Tullys at the Tourney of Harrenhal. Most of the great houses were there: Baratheon, Stark, Martell, Arryn, Tyrell. Tywin and Aerys broke up so the Lannister weren't there, but what about the Tullys? The were the Lords of the Riverlands they are supposed to be there.

It isnt really a random thought but, I really hate the way Catelyn, Robb and Brynden treat Edmure. To them Ed is a big soft-hearted goof who they almost never take seriously who is always doing shit, but like, have they ever looked at themself? Catelyn thinks the commoners Edmure let into the castle are useless mouths which strategically makes sense, but she should keep in mind that she had a big part in the destruction that befell the riverlands when she made the great mistake of kidnapping Tyrion, which definitely is one the dumbest decisions in asoiaf. Robb complains that Edmure didn't do what he asked, stay in Riverrun, 'cause Robb had a plan to lure Tywin into a trap, but man, why didn't you just tell Edmure your plans? "Oh, but he told Edmure to stay there and defend the castle." The guy was Robb's main ally, his uncle, Lord of one of the great houses and his country is the most fucked up in a war that his sister brought to him and the kid doesn't have the regard to let the guy know about his war plans?! Robb still sent Edmure to a last minute wedding 'cause the boy broke his marriage pact. And Brynden always with that air, "you're weak, you lack hate".