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Loraq

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  1. This is more than what Robb and Catelyn apparently knew. When they talked about Robb's succession, there was no mention of such a thing like that. They even talked about his sisters' claims to Winterfell.
  2. Exactly. By normal succession, and if he was still alive, Cregard, as Edric's eldest son, who was in turn Cregan's third son, was the one who should have inherited Winterfell after the dead of his uncle Jonnel, not Barthogan, Cregan's fourth son.
  3. Well, truth be told, any claim can be disputed, if one has the right arguments. We can even say that the current main Stark line isn't the rightful ruler of Winterfell, based on what happened between Cregan's descendants. As GRRM said, this matter of succession isn't clear, which only confirms the fact that we can't say for sure that a female Stark or her descendants are barred from inherit Winterfell, because George himself never said such thing explicitly.
  4. If a female Stark, or at least her male descendants, aren't barred from inherit Winterfell, then Jocelyn's grandsons would supposedly be the heirs, as they would be the sole direct descendants of Lord Willam, although through the female line. On the contrary, if only males who descend from the male line are allowed to inherit, then the situation would be completely different. Catelyn, talking about Robb's succession, implies that Jocelyn's descendants are the closest kin to the Starks with the right to inherit Winterfell if the main line dies out. Although their rights of succession are dismissed by Robb, it's because, as you stated, they were raised away from the North, not because they are descendants from the Starks through a female line (something Robb would point out, if that was another of the reasons for him to dismiss their claim). I think that what may play against these descendants in these type of cases it's the fact that some may have been raised away from the North, as with Jocelyn's descendants, not the fact that they descend from the female line. Well, until GRRM himself gives us a clear answer about this situation, we will never know.
  5. Daemon's marriage was planned by his father and concluded by his half-brother, the king. So it seems that it was a political match. Well, Ysilla Royce marrying Mychel Redfort makes perfect sense. On the other hand, Jocelyn Stark and Benedict Royce (a younger son from a minor branch) not so much.
  6. To the closest male available who may be from a female line of House Stark. GRRM said that there has never been a ruling Lady of Winterfell or a Queen in the North, but he never said that the male descendants from a female line can't inherit Winterfell and change their name to Stark. Even husbands can do that, as happened with Joffrey Lydden (Lannister). It's almost impossible for a lineage extending for several millennia to always have a male descendant from a male line available to rule. Some of these males most probably are descendants from female lines. Also, when Robb is talking about his succession, Catelyn suggests Jocelyn Stark's own descendants as Robb's heirs, and even though her suggestion is dismissed, it has nothing to do with the fact that they are descendants from a female line but because they are Vale lordlings with supposedly no knowledge of the North. So, I think if something happened to Edwyle and Rickard, although Jocelyn would not have been considered as a potential Lady of Winterfell, her hypothetical male descendants surely would be the best candidates to the Lordship.
  7. More strange to me was the marriage of Jocelyn Stark, who was much more higher in rank than Branda Stark, to Benedict Royce. Maybe these two Stark ladies were somehow allowed to marry for love? As strange as it is, especially in Jocelyn's case. Or, for example, Jocelyn got pregnant and had to be quickly married to avoid a scandal (we don't know if Branda had children or not). The fact that this marriages involved two first cousins is also curious. I also hope that in the future we learn more about Jocelyn and Branda Stark and what motivated their respective marriages.
  8. I already requested an account so I could directly edit the wiki (I believe on december 12th). However, I didn't receive the email with the password yet.
  9. This is strange. I think it's because of the family tree's size and shape. Benjen Stark's box is smaller than the others. It gives the impression that it barely fits there and one more box added would make it disappear. So the lines don't appear simply because they don't have enough space to appear. I think the best way to do it, as we don't know for sure, is to put in the box "Issue" and link it to the page "Template: Stark tree Jocelyn" as you can see it was done in the family tree on Jocelyn Stark's wiki page. In the "Stark full tree" Lord Roderick Stark's name isn't in bold as the names of the other Lords of Winterfell. In the "Stark tree Conquest" Lord Roderick Stark's name appears there but then shouldn't Brandon the Boastful's name and lineage appear as well? Also, Alaric Stark's wiki page says: "According to Archmaester Gyldayn, Alysanne charmed a reluctant Alaric into granting the New Gift to the Night's Watch because, even though Alaric was a strong friend to the Watch, he knew the northern lords who already held the lands in question would not be happy to be given away." Shouldn't it be: "According to Archmaester Gyldayn, Alysanne charmed a reluctant Alaric into granting the New Gift to the Night's Watch because, even though Alaric was a strong friend to the Watch, he knew the northern lords who already held the lands in question would not be happy to give them away."?
  10. 1 - I don't know if it's only me who sees it like that, but the connecting lines between Rodrik Stark, Arya Flint and Lyarra Stark as well as those between Rickard, Lyarra and Benjen Stark in the family tree on House Stark's wiki page disappeared. 2 - There's some discrepancies between the wiki pages of House Royce of Runestone and House Royce of the Gates of the Moon. House Royce of Runestone House Royce of the Gates of the Moon As shown above, Perra Royce, Ryella Royce and Kyle Royce are members "with unspecified familiar relationship to the main branch" on House Royce of the Gates of the Moon's wiki page. However, on House Royce of Runestone's wiki page Perra Royce is listed instead as an historical member of the House. Also, until stated otherwise, shouldn't they be considered by default members of House Royce of Runestone? And as such shouldn't their names be erased from House Royce of the Gates of the Moon's wiki page? 3 - Catelyn Stark says that Jocelyn Stark married into a junior branch of House Royce (she never specifically said it was House Royce of the Gates of the Moon). Nonetheless, in the family tree on House Stark's wiki page the link in the box about Jocelyn's issue redirects to House Royce of the Gates of the Moon's wiki page (it used to redirect to a wiki page named "Template: Stark tree Jocelyn" - the same page that the link about her issue in the Stark family tree on her own wiki page redirects).
  11. @Nittanian @Thomaerys Velaryon On the family tree on House Stark's wiki page the lines linking Rodrik Stark and Arya Flint to Lyarra Stark and Rickard Stark and Lyarra Stark to Benjen Stark were erased. Also, on the Sheepshead Hills' wiki page it says: It should be: "According to a semi-canon source, the hills are located within the dominion of House Manderly, and Hornwood [this link should redirect to the seat of House Hornwood, also called Hornwood, and not to the page of the House itself, as it currently redirects], the seat of House Hornwood, is located near the northwestern edge of the hills."
  12. Hello, I think the rules are: "After you've had 5 or more posts on the forum, you'll be able to see a new sub-forum to the Wiki of Ice and Fire forum. This sub-forum is called Wiki Account Registration. Post in the sub-forum according to the instructions provided in its description. An account will be made for you and an e-mail with a random password will be sent to the e-mail with which you registered for the forum. Once that's done, you can log in to the wiki and begin editing immediately!"
  13. I think Ramsay was deceived by someone.
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