Prince of the North

No. but you should be!

Hey, the phrase "It's five o'clock somewhere!" makes no reference to AM or PM.

@larrytheimp Just want to add my condolences and thank you for sharing a bit of the beautiful story you and Darcy lived together. I hope, if such a thing is even possible, the sharing helps ease your loss.

Like many others have said of quotes in their sig - I've always liked the Schopenhauer quote below. It seems pretty straight forward. But I love the little, subtle shift in that last part where it leaps right over simple acceptance to "is accepted as self-evident" that I think sums humanity up pretty well (at least in that sense).

This is awesome, really! But, unfortunately, it's also a lot of speculation, opinion, and assumption with no in-story evidence to support it. It reminded me of this Thus Spake Martin" quote from Martin so I'll just let him speak for himself here: The point is that Martin himself was never concerned with being this precise while writing the story so using this approach or level of precision is not the way to "prove" anything in the story.

Sorry, but the reason you think it's important to determine whether Rob or Jon is older doesn't matter to the point I'm making. I said readers not knowing how soon Catelyn left Riverrun after Rob's birth or how soon Wylla left Starfall after Jon's birth (if that's, in fact, how Jon was brought to Winterfell) means that the timing of when they each reached Winterfell does not give us any indication of who was born first. The only way it could is based on the assumption that Catelyn and Wylla both set out very soon after the babies were born. Because we don't know that, it has no bearing on trying to determine whether Rob or Jon is older.

But all this is based on the assumption that Catelyn and Wylla set out for Winterfell right after Rob and Jon were born. We don't know this at all. Catelyn could have stayed in Riverrun for a time. Wylla could have set out much sooner after Jon was born. The point is, we don't know. And we don't know because Martin either doesn't want us to know or he doesn't think it's important. I believe the latter because, of course, it doesn't matter whether Rob or Jon is older regarding inheritance of Winterfell and all that goes with it. Jon is not Ned's son so he's not in that line of succession in any case.

Yeah, I'm gonna have to go ahead and assume Bronn is illiterate. I mean, we all remember his reaction upon hearing that The Eyrie is "impregnable", right?!

Hey! It worked for the "Battle of...FIVE ARMIES?!?!?!" And, since many seem to want to compare what's going on now with Tolkien's "Scouring of the Shire", why couldn't it work here, too?

No, I'm not really conflating two concepts...but good points.

Hmm...maybe. But if iron actually can keep wights in check in that way it's strange that it doesn't have much effect on them when, you know, it's actually used to fight them. Also, there were several swords taken from the crypts...but I suppose we can assume they were replaced. And, finally, I wonder if Lyanna's tomb got an iron sword

Wait a minute?! Are the crypts of Winterfell magically warded like the Wall, etc.? Because, if not, couldn't all the entombed Starks simply be raised to attack those sheltering there? And then they're already inside Winterfell! Um, our heroes might wanna get that checked out!

US, North Dakota.

Iain Glen also stars in the "Jack Taylor" series.

Great point and, actually, I think we do agree. Perhaps I didn't articulate it very well but that's sort of what I was at least trying to get at with my last sentence: that they did, basically, reverse or forget what they did before supposedly indicating that Sansa was growing, becoming more powerful, and learning to play "the game". But, even just looking at this specific season only, with Sansa going to Winterfell, she didn't have a choice but that doesn't stop people from saying that she did. My complaint is that it's just more inconsistency/nonsense in the show's writing.

Heh, you really had me going there! I didn't read your entire post because I didn't get that you were being sarcastic (and, thus, the post was confusing me given what I've read of your other posting on this subject). Whew! Glad you were being sarcastic! And I completely agree with you. Sansa was shown, realistically/logically, as having NO choice (and just saying she did without showing it, too, is the height of incompetent storytelling). If Sansa really had a choice to go to Winterfell, why did they have Littlefinger not tell her what they were doing until he had her all the way to Moat Cailin?! Are we supposed to believe Sansa could have said "No, let's go back to the Vale" and Littlefinger would have just said "OK"?! That certainly wouldn't be very realistic or logical. If Sansa really had a choice they would have shown Littlefinger telling her of the idea/plan to marry Ramsey while they were still in the Vale and, you know, actually showing Sansa choosing whether to go or not. Also, I hate how stupid they made Sansa seem in that situation: as if she didn't even realize they were travelling north? Or even begin to suspect they may be going to Winterfell, etc.? That certainly didn't help indicate a new-found ability to "play the game", developing her own agency/power, etc. to me either.

Interesting read but, wow, I could not disagree with Amanda Marcott any more on that piece. I don't have any of the problems with the Sansa scene that she purports to be "debunking" except one: they did make it about Theon. That is, they took a major character who had her own story and made her take the place of a minor character who's story arc serves another major character's (Theon's) arc. The other elephant in the room that this "debunking" never brings up is simply that, even within the show, Littlefinger taking Sansa to Winterfell and marrying her to the Boltons makes absolutely no sense (my main problem with the whole thing). Those are the problems I have with the Sansa scene (along with the simple fact that it was all done for shock value). So, no, it doesn't "debunk" anything for me. Ultimately, she has her opinion and I have mine and I would simply point out that disagreeing with something is not necessarily "debunking" it. ;)

Heh, yep. In the books, Darkwing Duckstar wanted to start a war so he tried to kill Myrcella and did end up maiming her. In the show, Ellaria and the Sand Snakes flat out state they want to hurt/kill Myrcella to start a war so...why were they shown only trying to kidnap her? I mean, when their plan was thwarted by Jaime, Bronn, and Areo et al. showing up why no last ditch effort to at least harm Myrcella with the whip or thowing the spear or, better yet, a poisoned dagger?

Good point about the SS not even trying to harm Myrcella when that was their stated goal. That's another thing that should have gone differently if the show were internally consistent at all. Your second point is what I am getting at with having the SS conceal their intent a bit and just walk into the water gardens. That way some guards could have been shown and that would have been at least a bit more logical. However, then we couldn't have Jaime and Bronn just easily walk into the place unchallenged so... :dunno: Also, that scene really, really should have taken place in the evening. I mean, it's simply logical that one would make the attempt, whether it's to kill Myrcella or "rescue" her, in the evening because the coming darkness would make getting away much easier.

HA! Great question! Also, they didn't even have to go in armed to the teeth with spears, etc. (not to mention in broad daylight - didn't Trys and Myrc take evening strolls?) They could have just nonchalantly strolled in (with some concealed weapons, of course) and tried to snatch Myrcella. That would have made quite a bit more sense.

Great stuff in the open letter, JCRB! Thanks! :thumbsup:

Yes, where are all the children of varying classes, colors, creeds, etc? Would have told us a little something about Dorne amiright?!

Agreed. Poor Bronn. He's one of the many changes in the show that I don't mind as much.

Well, of course, that's a possibility. But, for now, I don't believe his story ends in the books with being executed by Stoneheart. I think Martin has much more planned for Jaime. And I definitely don't believe they're going to kill him off soon in the show. I mean, they've cut much of his story line but they're going out of their way to manufacture other things for him (going to Dorne!) and, besides, he's a fan fave!

For now, my money's on Bronn basically getting the fate of Ser Arys Oakheart from the books while fan fave Jaime gets more of what Ser Balon Swann does (unless he gets killed soon in the books, too). I agree. I think it's probably Shireen. Another shocking case of an innocent being ground up in other people's machinations (the Game of Thrones, so to speak). But if it is Shireen ,and we already saw Davos go to the mat over Gendry, what would he be willing to do for her? Assuming consistent characterization, of course (always dangerous, I know).