Cadiva

I agree. I didn't find anything remotely racist in it. I'd suspect it's more likely the other way round actually. I'm English and found nothing remotely racist in the scene. Exactly my thoughts when I saw it the first time - they've filmed in Morocco, the extras are Moroccans.

I gave it an eight, it was a good end of season episode in that it tied up loose ends, left some open and created the beginning of new story arcs for next season. The ending was a tad cheesy but had a good cinematic shot and the Mhysa song was beautiful. There were some good individual moments too, Arya's pathway to Braavos beginning, Sam and Maester Aemon, Davos, the reminder about the Ironborn and the reveal of Ramsey (for those who hadn't already twigged and aren't book readers). I thought the scene with Roose and Walder was off though, it felt out of place and out of character for Bolton to be "crowing" like Frey was. I suppose it was there for the exposition of what had gone on at Winterfell for those none book readers who may not have made the connection yet. I was "glad" to see they'd used Robb/Grey Wind because that was one of the defining images for me from the books, extreme in its cruelty and sense of petty viciousness, although it was so damn dark in the lighting that they might as well not have bothered! I was surprised by the lack of supernatural elements in the final episode though but I can see why they'd chose to end with Dany and her freeing of the slaves and capturing of Yunkai. You get the feeling she's going somewhere and then Meereen happen. I did think we'd get UnCat but I can see them wanting to keep that as the big shocker for the start of Season Four. I was also surprised they went with Jaime arriving in KL before the Purple Wedding, wonder what they're going to do there. Absolutely loved Twyin schooling Joffrey though, Jack Gleeson is such a talented young guy.

No it's perfectly to term, pregnancy takes 40 weeks but anything over 38 is usually considered term and anything over 40 is late (says she who had her baby after being induced at 41+3).

I've always thought the "moral" of ASOIAF (obviously up to book five only) was - shit happens, deal with it. I mean, GRRM's not made any secret of how much he's inspired and fascinated by the brutality of the feudal medieval society, the Wars of the Roses in particular, and that the good guys don't always win and sometimes you just have to put up with the lesser of two evils. I think that's what he's driving at throughout the books. Honour is personal to the circumstances in which someone is being tested on theirs. No-one would say Jaime's behaviour as the "Kingslayer" was honourable but his actions actually were the lesser of two incredible evils and he's had to live with the repercussions of that ever since. Ned's honour is that he thinks everyone should be treated fairly and that he expects everyone else to follow the same rules as he does, it costs him his life. Robb's honour is to offer to marry a girl he's slept with during a period of insane grief and following a fairly debilitating illness, it costs him his life. Varys' "honour" seems to be to Westeros as a whole, surprising considering his upbringing and background, but so far he's managed to steer that course while also carrying out some pretty unpleasant things along the way. And plenty of people do just that, or the modern equivalents. It's as endemic in the world today as it was during the middle ages. It's human nature (for some).

Magna Carta - perfect example of those with power getting what they want. Nowhere in my previous post did I say the King was the one doing whatever he wanted or that he was "the law", I said feudal lords could pretty much act as they wished with very little recourse. Magna Carta didn't make a vast amount of difference to that premise. King John was forced to concede on a number of points, it didn't mean the lords who forced him to sign it went off to their own lands and behaved any more honourably than they were doing before hand. It just meant they succeeded in wresting some of the power away from the throne and protecting the power they already had over their own feudal subjects. As it happens, although it's hailed as a great document for democracy, by the 19th century only three of the statues still remained part of English law. It's become far more important because of the actualities of how it came about - the idea that the King could be bound by "laws".

Historically correct for a great number of medieval feudal lords. Having no honour whatsoever didn't have any negative consequences for them because they were "the law". I suspect you're going to be proved right. GRRM has said the ending will be "bittersweet". I'm suspecting there will be a resolution to the conflict in Westeros, possibly via a merger of House Stark and House Targaryen, but then the whole of the kingdom, no matter what side they started off on, are then going to have to unite to face the threat of The Others and that it will end up in a greater sacrifice than anything that's gone on so far.

Isn't it possible that that element is going to be shown in the next episode though? From the trailer it would appear there's a scene of wholesale destruction in the Northmen camps outside the Twins so that sense of the North being lost may come then.

In the book he kills four Frey wolfhounds and bites off the arm of a single man. I'm not sure where this almost mythical idea of him taking out dozens of Freys trying to get to Robb comes from but it ain't the books. Grey Wind kills dozens of Lannister troops during the Battles of Whispering Woods and also at Oxcross but at the Twins he is felled by dozens of Frey crossbowmen.

As far as I understand it, Clive Mantel had other commitments so wouldn't have been available to shoot during Season Two.

It's someone disagreeing with your interpretation of a scene.

Different opinions then, I found her expressions whether she was smiling or not, to still be a little odd, especially when she was looking at the top table and Edmure. Her smiles, for me, seemed to be more directed towards her brother than the wedding itself and when she was talking to Roose about his Frey bride I thought they had a discordant note to the whole conversation. For me Cat throughout the whole wedding ceremony and breakfast seemed to be uneasy and on an edge without knowing why and when the Rains started playing I think they perfectly portrayed her dawning recognition of what was going on.

And I personally thought they did all that. There was tension throughout the episode, you could see in Cat's face that she wasn't entirely comfortable or relaxed well before the point at which she spotted Roose Bolton's armour. The Rains of Castamere being played perfectly ramped up the disquiet and tension and feeling of oddness and I think Michele Fairley nailed that absolutely to perfection.

Couldn't agree more. It was perfectly done, I was on a knife edge throughout the episode because I knew what was coming and it just ramped up the tension throughout. The whole episode was perfect imho and Bran's warging was brilliantly done. I also found the utter silence over the end credits to be more emotional than I expected, I just sat in utter silence for about five minutes until it ended.

Nine out of 10 for me, excellent pacing throughout, some great build up to set pieces (Sam the Slayer was perfectly done imho) and the depositing of his fellow captain's heads by Daario in Dany's chambers. Also liked the scene with The Hound and Arya. Just gave her enough doubt about his motivations to make their journey to The Twins interesting. The wedding was brilliantly played by all involved. Joffrey stealing Tyrion's stool was a masterpiece in showing what a little shit he is and also giving that awkward moment when Tyrion has to ask her to knee so she can be cloaked. I don't really care at all about the "whitewashing" of him the show's allegedly done, he's still a totally flawed character and Peter Dinklage portrays that perfectly, loved the "And Now My Watch Begins" line. Great to see Davos and Stannis' relationship again and I thought the scene with Gendry was fine, if a little long, but can understand they're trying to reference back to the whole King's Blood being powerful stuff of the shadow baby. Will be interesting to see where they go with the leeches/power of the Red God when dealing with the fate of the three usurpers Stannis named. Loved Sam the Slayer, the ravens foreshadowing and the weirwood tree and thought their flight perfectly ended the episode.

Another great episode taking some of the major storylines further along without there being any specific "big" events other than Brienne and the Bear. Loved their use of music in this episode, the Bear and the Maiden Fair being sung when Jaime arrives back at Harrenhal and then the very clever re-use of the Rains of Castamere over the end credits. Loved Tywin's clever playing of Joffrey, he may be sitting on the Iron Throne but there's no doubt at all about who is running the kingdom. Also liked the scenes with Margaery and Sansa and the little dig about mothers bringing up their sons properly. The BwB scenes weren't as good for me this week but, to be fair, there wasn't really much they had to do other than facilitate Arya's escape and capture by The Hound and it definitely looks like Gendry's getting an expanded role in the TV show given Melissandre's revelation of his parentage. Dany's scenes were good and it was nice to see the other two dragons as well as Drogon and the CGI on them was incredible. Theon's torture continues apace and it's still a muddled confused mess for the TV viewer who, imho anyways, has no idea what the chuff is going on there or what the point of it is. Hopefully they're going to expand on it or give a few more clues as to the "why" it's happening. Robb and Tulisa's scenes, while all jolly and nice for them, really didn't do much for me or for his storyline other than I guess show again that he married her for love and to throw out the potential "heir to the Northern Throne" storyline. Jon and Ygritte's story is progressing nicely and I liked how they showed her naivety about what life was like south of The Wall. Not really interested in the introduction of the Orell love triangle though other than I guess it emphasised the difference between Jon and Ygritte's backgrounds. Also loved the echo of the "I was his and he was mine" line when Osha was telling about the return of the White Walkers and what it's really like beyond The Wall during the scene with Bran and the Reeds. Eight out of 10 for me and, I think, the poorest of the episodes GRRM has penned for the show so far but only because there were no great big set pieces. It had some brilliant dialogue and Jaime's "sorry about the sapphires" line was genius.

I gave it a seven but still agree with pretty much everything in your summary. It was a really good solid episode with some moments of sheer brilliance - mostly the double headed conversations between the various pairings you've mentioned. It also had a pretty spectacular ending shot and I thought Rose Leslie did a great job in showing Ygritte's stunned shock/appreciation for the "other side" of The Wall. Except for the QoT and Tywin exchange, she agreed to the wedding so that Loras wouldn't be drafted for the Kingsguard :)

Totally agree, brilliant episode again, loved the use of fire as the theme through all the cut scenes, the fight with The Hound and Beric was brilliantly done too, especially Sandor's fear of the fire. Loved the scene with Gendry and Arya and also the one with Arya, Thoros and Beric, giving a bit more background and depth to the extent that the Brotherhood has been working behind the scenes. Jaime and Brienne's scenes were brilliantly played too, loved his line where he says his name is Jaime, simple but really effective and the Dragonstone story line was done well too, good to see they've stuck with Shireen's greyscale and great to see Davos back on screen. Absolutely cracking ending with Tywin, Cersei and Tyrion and a fairly complex book plot (the Tyrell's plotting and the Wilas (now Loras) wedding suggestion for Cersei) got much simplified for the TV version which I think worked really well. Was interesting to see they've gone to Yunkai (on the title map anyways) and not missed it out and headed straight to Mereen also loved the scenes with Grey Worm. The scenes beyond the Wall were the weakest for me but then I'm not a Jon Snow fan but they were well done in terms of advancing the plot along for the assault by the Wildlings and I liked the way they reintroduced Walder Frey in the scenes with Robb at Riverrun. I gave it an 8 (but it was more of an 8.5 for me).

Totally agree, I thought it worked brilliantly, it was a superb cover of the song and referenced back to the earlier acoustic version of it when Jaime and Brienne had their hilarious argument about who was the better swordsman and the impact of it coming just after he's lost his hand was really well done imho. Overall it was a 9/10 episode for me, my favourite scene was Gendry and Arry saying goodbye to HotPie. The pathos and depth to their parting was perfectly understated and all three did a great job in showing it without any grand gestures. Also loved the chair repositioning in the Small Council, hilarious and perfectly timed to add contrast to the rest of the episode. My only criticism is, as has been mentioned repeatedly, the scene with Stannis and Melisandre. It didn't have anywhere near the sinister impact I was expecting when she starts to refer to the other people with "King's Blood" in them and the threat implicit in that story line to Shireen and, to a lesser extent, to Gendry as well for being a Baratheon bastard.

No all those you mention, where relevant, are included in my original comment. But, specifically: which covers both Isabella and Roger Mortimer's removal of Edward II and then later Edward III claiming his throne back, a period of 3 years if memory serves during which he was a minority. He retook his throne as soon as he was old enough to rule himself without needing a council. It also covers Henry Bollingbrook's rebellion and seizure of the throne as that directly comes as a result of the fall out of seniority from Edward III's children, which I said. The War of the Roses consisted of sporadic rebellion and counter rebellion over a period of time from 1455 to 1485. From 1485 there is no real conflict over the succession to the throne of England (later England and Scotland), with the exception of the Lady Jane Grey incident, until the 1700s when the Stuart dynasty gets mired in Catholic/Protestant debate and the exiled Stuarts try to take it back from the Hanovarians, who were actually invited to take the throne by the people (which I also mentioned). The debate was over whether the succession to the throne had been without incident, not whether there had been any conflicts during a King's rule. The conflict between Robert and Henry was mostly over the Dukedom of Normandy, as they had been separated by their father, not the English throne and it was over and done with in 1106, (after a period of six years) when Henry defeated Robert and took the Dukedom as well as the throne of England which he'd held since 1100. The conflict here came, as I said, when Matilda inherited her father's throne and some of the barons refused to be ruled by a woman, which I mentioned at point 1. The first baron's revolt didn't remove John from the throne and it wasn't about his succession to it, it came at the end of his reign and was about his method of ruling not whether he should rule in the first place. It resulted in the signing of Magna Carta to clarify what power the monarchy should be able to exert over the barons. There have been rebellions against the throne throughout history. That's not what was at debate though, it was whether the successions passed over smoothly with all the barons and vassals happily swearing feality. You're arguing two separate points but only one of them is relevant - the length of time of the Anarchy and the War of the Roses. The Anarchy lasted from 1135 to 1153 a period of 18 years, the War of the Roses lasted from 1455 to 1485, a period of 30 years, Lady Jane Grey was proclaimed but never crowned queen for 9 days (July 9 to 18th) and the two Stuart rebellions add up to a period of three years (in combination not in time scale) between them giving a total of 51.09 years in which there was conflict over the succession of the throne. Considering the first accepted king of a united England was Aethelstan in 924 and our current Queen Elizabeth II is still sitting on the throne in 2012, I think the English succession can absolutely be held as a good example of feudal succession. It's fairly easy to gauge the success of the English monarchy (and obviously the change to England and Wales, then Great Britain, then the United Kingdom of Great Britain and now, finally, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland) by the fact it's still there.

Have you actually read any of the English history from which GM took his inspiration? Serious question not being sarcastic because I'm trying to see where you're coming from with your modern ideas of what feudalism actually meant in the Middle Ages. There have been very few instances, in the long 1000 plus years history of rulers of what is now the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, in which power didn't pass smoothly from father to son or father to grandson or, occasionally, uncle to nephew. Once William the Conqueror set himself on the throne in 1066 there have been less than half a dozen unique incidents involving either an outright rebellion or a war between claimants to the throne: 1 - Matilda and Stephen following the death of her father (his uncle) Henry I. Matilda should have been queen but she would have been the first female ruler and the barons weren't so sure about that so Stephen went for the throne. His reign was short and resulted in him accepting Matilda's son as his heir. 2 - Simon de Montfort's baron's rebellion against his brother-in-law Henry III, which centred around Henry being pissed off at de Montfort using his name to secure a loan from European bankers and used it as an excuse to try and get rid of him and his fellow barons who were seeking reform in the way in which the country was governed by the King. In his one year long de facto reign, de Montfort called the first recognisable version of a Parliament. 3 - One long period of history, starting from the fact Edward II was a dick and unfit to rule, in which the descendants of Edward III fought over who had the senior claim to the English throne - called the War of the Roses and, oddly enough, one of the main inspirations from which George Martin draws his ruling families and the Five Kings War in Westeros. 3a - Henry VII seizes the throne from Richard III to basically end the War of the Roses. 4 - the Duke of Northumberland, John Dudley, tries to put his daughter-in-law Lady Jane Grey on the throne instead of Mary I (his excuse being that he doesn't wish to see England return to the Catholic faith and because neither did Edward VII and there's no suitable male heirs in the Tudor line). 5 - the exiled Stuarts two failed rebellions in 1715 and 1745, unlikely to succeed because there's been a German born king on the throne quite successfully now for a period of more than 50 years (also no longer technically in the Middle Ages). So yes, in the more than 1000 years history of English rule, pretty much every succession bar these few have passed without any incident and without barons failing to swear allegiance to the crown. (None of this includes the English/Welsh or the English/Scottish conflicts, they are not based on feudal fighting but sovereignty over another country). Under any version of primogeniture and sovereign law, Stannis has the senior claim over Renly.