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It's a time paradox....so I guess it wasn't ever avoidable. Methinks this won't be the last time Bran does this.

I was confused by this as well. I'm assuming that somehow he heard her through his future self? (because Bran had warged into him while also being in the past?)

I didn't watch the segment, I read it here. My week isn't ruined or anything, I would just prefer if they avoided doing things like that. The curtain doesn't always have to be pulled back that far. I mean, GRRM shares enough of the blame for this situation in the first place, it isn't like I'm interested in bashing him or D&D.

I know what I've opted into, thanks. I just wish they didn't feel the need to volunteer privileged information that they're obviously privy to due to being responsible for adapting it to screen. I don't think something like that is an unreasonable request. They obviously don't care, which is unfortunate, that's all.

Hear, hear. I expect that the "hold the door" stuff might be something we'll read about someday, but I don't remember a door being there underneath the Weirwood. So who knows...

It all started with the Shireen stuff. Idk, seems like a ridiculous excuse if that's really their thinking. You think they'd have been made aware after last season and avoided doing that.

I get where you're coming from, but there is "spoilers" in the title of this thread :/

I mean, I'm not really interested in blindly bashing D&D as people, I prefer critiquing the show. Why do they insist on being dickish like that? So frustrating.

What is with D&D and them spoiling the story in the "Inside the Episode" stuff? I mean, I know HBO has the rights to the story, but do they really have to fuck over the book readers who don't wish to have plot-points spoiled as whether they're the genuine article or not? Are they really that dense?

Totally agree, but that can't really be an excuse used for this episode. They had some amazing stuff to work off of for the Kingsmoot and it was mostly squandered IMO. Other than that, this is probably the best episode of the season.

I completely understand this line of thinking, I just thought how it happened was somewhat inauthentic to Davos. The notion that Melisandre would be crestfallen after Stannis' forces were completely destroyed is fine. Putting Jon in his place as something Melisandre can find a purpose for again makes perfect sense. But the notion that the longest living anti-Melisandre character in the books, Davos, would be the one to coax her into "helping" Jon, and calling what she does "miracles" is just bizarre to me. But like I mentioned in an earlier post, this is a problem they created themselves by sending Davos to the Wall instead of what he does in the novels. I understand the consolidation in plot made there, but it's a corner they wrote themselves into by choosing this scenario. I'm not a writer, but if they had done something similar to having him be resurrected while Mel gave him the Last Kiss prior to putting him on a funeral pyre, it would have worked better. Unless of course, the writers are trying to say there is a difference between how Beric came back to life and how Jon did....who knows.

In the show? Probably the Crown (Westerlands+Crownlands). Maybe, but I took it as him talking about Qhorin, and perhaps Mance (he did technically kill him, after all).

Yeah, I definitely agree. Melisandre's progression at the moment is mostly earned IMO. I just don't know why they decided to have Davos be the one to suggest resurrection to her. I guess it's sort of a corner they wrote themselves into last season, oh well.

Actually, Sam did it first. But yeah, I see your point. I just don't think someone who abhorred Melisandre and everything she stood for would be playing cheerleader for her in order to resurrect someone he barely knows. Like I said before, I think combining this with Melisandre becoming a potato is what created the issue for me.

Comparing the books to the show is kind of inevitable, unfortunately. There were changes made way early when the show had less criticism, so I'm not really sure what's happened. I think it's easy to say that the writing looks weaker since they've run out of book material to adapt, but I don't know what goes on in the writer's room.

No, I suggest you follow your own advice. You're literally telling people that they shouldn't be allowed to say or think certain things because they aren't capable of creating it themselves. That's very much the definition of ad hominem. Attitudes like that only do a disservice to any reasonable discussion. Calling people "haters" is such a fatuous remark and only seeks to undermine their opinion. Mind you, I'm not the one here calling D&D idiots or telling people who have no issue with the show today that they're stupid. I just don't think the show is at the level of quality it once was.

How does he know that? Jon lost at Hardhome by the way. Him having a Valyrian Steel sword doesn't qualify him to defeat them necessarily.

And her miraculously surviving being burned alive isn't repetitive either? Well, I guess it is different this time with no magic being involved...lol

So because someone can't create an immensely popular television show themselves, they have no right to critique or complain about it from a fan's perspective? Sorry, that's pure ad-hominem.

It's this compounded with Mel losing her faith that made it even worse to me. We're supposed to believe Davos, who literally tried to kill her, would think of resurrecting Jon before she ever would and give her a pep-talk over her "miracles"?

Yeah, Aegon V and Prince Duncan the Small died in the tragedy at Summerhall as well. Hell, if the Targaryens were somehow immune to fire they would have been unique among those from Valyria, considering what we know of the Doom of Valyria.

Yeah, typo! Well, I was having my doubts about it even being brought up again, so who knows. Where the story is going, I wonder how relevant it'll be exactly. Well yeah, rather obvious...just seemed like a goofy thing IMO. The writers deciding that's how they wanted things to be "resolved" with the Dothraki, but not actually thinking through it at all.

By making her immune to being burnt? I'm all for giving a character more agency, but this wasn't very different from Drogon saving her.

Best part of the episode was Jon and Sansa reuniting. The writing was a bit improved over past episodes IMO. Jon's vows were touched on, Davos finally decided to give a damn about Stannis and Shireen again. But for me, the last scene stuck out like a sore thumb. Randomly deciding that Dany is immune to fire in the show-canon isn't an excuse really.