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  1. JagLover

    I just finished the GOT books!

    So what? Her being a ruthless character, but introduced to us sympathetically, makes her a far more interesting character than one who is "mad".
  2. JagLover

    I just finished the GOT books!

    In the books the lessons that Dany were being taught seemed to be that she was a conqueror not a peaceful ruler. To plant no trees, to rule by "fire and blood". This is not the same thing as her going mad in the same way that we do not refer to Alexander the Mad or Genghis the Mad. History was not made by the weak. I like Dany because she is a grey character and I expect her to be even more so by the time she lands in Westeros. The show went a bit Disney at the end there and I expect the books to have a far more satisfying journey for her.
  3. JagLover

    How would you have ended it?

    The problem with much of the analysis I have seen elsewhere, and suggested improvements, is that the show died from a narrative cohesion point of view mid way through S7, with Dany inexplicable not taking KLs and the whole catch a Wight plot. I watched S8 without much enthusiasm and just for the battles really. GOT died for me then, not in S8Ep5. The way to fix things so that character actions make sense is to return to that point and start again. So Dany takes KL, and we have a few episodes devoted to the fall of Cersei, perhaps ones that give Cersei more to do than stand by a window drinking wine. Season eight then by necessity at least one or two episodes longer and give us a proper battle against the NK, rather than the damp squib we have. Leaving Dany in an even more desperate situation than in the show, in that she has the North and KL, but the vast majority of her army has been wiped out. Leading to the whole needing to rule by fear bit to bring the rest of the lords inline. If you are going to show the more ruthless and dangerous Dany, then have her torch another city that fails submit in time, creating a similar scenario. Personally I would then have preferred a more Michael Corleone ending as an increasingly dark Dany rules over all as many of our characters look at her with fear. That would have fit more the theme of the show and books that this isn't a fairy-tale and the strongest and most ruthless rise to the top.
  4. Fair enough perhaps I am reading too much into symbolism created by D&D, who after all kind of forgot to give us a proper ending.
  5. JagLover


    The girl who turned him down First of all this isn't a fairytale. House Baretheon was pretty much wiped out as well so he needs to marry pretty swiftly. Secondly his one true love?, seriously?. I interpreted it more as a girl he could fall in love with, one with the correct status now he was a lord, and one he would be happy to marry, rather than some great undying love story.
  6. The symbolism of the scene strongly suggested otherwise. Jon taking one last look back at the lands south of the wall, and the gate then being closed behind him.
  7. JagLover


    Well precisely. All the talk about Gendry ignores the fact that his children are going to be Baretheons. When I was talking of Arya staying I meant as Sansa appointing her as lady of one of the many now vacant castles in the north and then Arya marrying someone who would take her name. I was talking therefore of the duty that comes with being part of a great house, not her romantic interests.
  8. JagLover


    From where it was left in the show, true, but I think the question is more around why it ended that way?. There was a whole thing about Arya rediscovering her identity and her loyalty to her house and she is now going to risk the line ending because she wants to be Dora the explorer? She is a conventionally attractive straight woman/girl, in both show and book. Yes she has undergone some very traumatic experiences, but so do many men in times of war.
  9. JagLover


    "There must always be a Stark in Winterfell" comes from GRRM. So some named houses are more important than others.
  10. JagLover


    I think she also said that he had left unhurt her face and what she needed to produce a baby (from memory). But if there is the slightest doubt than that makes Arya's decision even more a betrayal of her family.
  11. JagLover


    Sansa was certain to marry I thought as there should always be a Stark in Winterfell and she is it as far as continuing the line. She wont marry a fellow ruler though. Jon seems pretty likely to build a normal life for himself in the North, would have liked it if at the end if a girl who looked like Ygritte caught his eye, just to make his ending a bit more satisfying. Arya's ending was a bit of a nonsense really, so she rediscovered she was a Stark, and then promptly p*ssed off. It wouldn't have been right for her to marry Gendry, but becoming a bannerwoman of her sister, to maybe then marry herself in the future, would have been more satisfying to me.
  12. It is more just an example of the contrived writing leading to this point (which is why the show died for me mid way through S7). She wouldn't have needed to do anything like what she did in S8Ep5 because at that point she felt secure, she still had all of her army, all of her dragons, and Jon's rival claim had not been revealed. There was also no reason whatsoever to pause after destroying most of the Lannister army in the field. It was fairly easy in the show to storm KL as it was, imagine how much easier it would have been with a weaker Lannister army, no Golden Company and a full strength army. The show needed to get to a certain point and didn't have a logical way to get there.
  13. You seriously think the next city isn't going to surrender after seeing what happened to those who defy her? For your logic to have work what should have happened is KL surrender without a fight and then Dany kill everyone, that would have made her irredeemably evil. There isn't any surrender at the last moment after the attackers have fought their way past the walls and it was common practice by conquerors to make an example of cities that resisted. The whole business with the bells is in there for modern audiences.
  14. JagLover

    Jon killing Dany doesn’t work for me

    The signs were there alright for her to become an increasingly ruthless conqueror, but the signs were also there for her to remain a grey character, rather than a blonde Hitler.
  15. The only way "breaking the wheel" makes some sort of sense (and bearing in mind this is D&D so it may not make any sense) is that Dany wants to upend the existing social order, to end Feudalism. So she is not talking of conquering lands she already controls only that they will be included in the social changes. The imagery was Nazi like, but her message was similar to the French revolution or Communism.