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About olibar

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  1. Bran was playing the Game of Thrones way harder than anyone understood and has tricked Westeros into basically putting Skynet/The Architect in charge. Looks like Tyrion has made yet another world ending mistake while trying to do good. I mean, they talk about succession but won't Bran live for hundreds of years or perhaps forever if a successor is never born? Sure, it seems like a great idea to have an all-knowing, emotionless leader make all your decisions for you, right up to the point where they decide that the only solution for the problem of human suffering is to kill all the humans. And isn't the Three Eyed Raven thing a Children of the Forest creation? If so, was this their ultimate plot to finally kick humans off Westeros?
  2. olibar

    GoT and Feminism: What Happens Now?

    Awesome post, and I'll admit that I was a fan of her's who did exactly that. Since The Bells, I've had to go back and reexamine her journey, and am slowly starting to understand just how I was taken in by her. I wonder if Tyrion is doing the same thing... I think the biggest clue was that her arc only moves forward from Mereen when she goes back to her roots with the Dothraki and reconnects with the lessons she learned from Khal Drogo. What she did to KL was no different than what he would have done if faced with a contender to his rule.
  3. olibar

    [Spoilers] Episode 805 Discussion

    That's a completely different criticism than of them being lazy, and one I can respect, though I don't agree with. Is it an A+ term paper? No, probably a solid B+ or A-, but at least it was turned in. Meanwhile your roommate is working on what may be the greatest term paper ever written, but has failed the class for failing to turn it in at the deadline But to bring it into specifics, exactly which character arcs do you feel were sabotaged? Which plot lines critical to the narrative dropped? And are you sure those criticisms are because of poor execution by the writers in the dramatization of the themes and narrative, rather than personal taste as to how you would have resolved them or explored them?
  4. olibar

    [Spoilers] Episode 805 Discussion

    I regard those who call showruners lazy to be lazy critics. I can promise you that laziness has nothing to do with the issues you are identifying. What they had was a deadline (due to actor availability and need to not have too much time pass between seasons), a budget, and the inability to go back and change anything once it was filmed, three issues that Martin doesn't have. I mean, it's been eight years since ADWD and even he can't even finish the next book, much less the series. That's not from laziness either, it's from how difficult endings are and the quality level he wants it to be. The difference is he can take as long as he wants, doesn't have to worry about how much it will cost to produce, and can look at the final product, decide he doesn't like something, and go back and fix it as many times as he wants. I commend D&D for having the guts to push forward to the finish. Perhaps it's an imperfect finish (I think it's pretty great but can also admit that it would be better if they were working off Martin source material rather than having to invent whole cloth), I'm sure there is much they would do differently if they had the time and budget to change certain things, but I for one prefer getting an imperfect ending to no ending.
  5. olibar

    The Perfect Ending

    Tyrion steals Drogon and flies off into the sunset after Dany tries to burn him alive with dragon fire. As a bewildered Dany watches them fly off, Arya stabs her in the back.
  6. olibar

    Welcome to war

    Without the fear instilled in the seven kingdoms of what defiance of her rule means, the other nobel houses would be much more willing to push Jon's claim. Now it doesn't matter that he's the "rightful" heir, it only matters that they know their kingdoms will be burned to the ground if they move against her. That's the stick. But the move also comes with a huge carrot. Without the million mouths of KL to feed, the other nobel houses will be able to better feed their people during a winter that wasn't properly prepared for because of the war. Sure, they may grumble about the dragon queen, but when they aren't facing peasant or lessor nobel revolts, they will all secretly thank her for burning it down. So when the official reports coming out all say that Cersi never surrendered and forced the rightful Queen to use extreme measures, well, they might not exactly believe it in private, but it will be better for all to propel that rewriting of history forward in public. Not to say any of this makes what Dany did right or good, only that it makes logical sense and shows her understanding of how the game is played in Westeros.
  7. olibar

    Welcome to war

    I believe she planned the slaughter as retribution against Cersi and the belief that Cersi would never actually surrender anyhow. When she agreed to Tyrion to stop if she heard the bells ring, she did so only because she thought it would never happen. When the bells actually did ring, she had a choice to make, continue with the plan to ensure HER rise to the throne, or abandon it and allow Jon to rule. We the viewers, and Jon and Tyrion and everyone who knew Dany well, should have known that she would choose the throne. She made it crystal clear. Varys saw it, tried to explain it to Tyrion and Jon and the viewers, and we all ignored it because we wanted to believe in her doing the right thing, even though her solution has always been the Targaryan one, burn everything and then make changes from the ashes.
  8. olibar

    This is all Jon’s fault

    That's a really good point. Had Dany accepted the surrender, Cersei likely would have escaped and could have potentially tried to gather support to throw out the Usurper from Essos. So another strong reason why Dany did what she did.
  9. olibar

    This is all Jon’s fault

    Yes exactly! Had Dany accepted the surrender, she would be forced to accept Jon's claim to the throne soon after. She needed Cersi to not surrender so that she had an excuse to burn down KL and move the capitol to Dragonstone, where she would rule as absolute monarch (Empress instead of Queen), projecting her will via the force of her Dragon and protecting Dragonstone with a small army. It's my guess that she will be pushing a narrative of the battle around Westeros that Cersi never did surrender (which, given Cersi's history, will not be much of a stretch for the other nobels to believe, especially if they don't want to piss off the Dragon Empress) She is looking to break the wheel of the nobility but can't do that with KL intact as the bureaucracy there is too strong. She might win their favor for a while, but would always be at risk of being overthrown as that's become an acceptable political process in the Seven Kingdoms now.
  10. olibar

    This is all Jon’s fault

    While the final decision to raze Kings Landing was Dany's and therefore ultimately her responsibility, Jon is certainly at fault for putting the choice in front of her and for not understanding what she would choose when the time came to make the choice. Jon really does know nothing. His decision to tell his family about his true heritage, rather than hide it, is the tragic flaw of the Stark honor writ large. Dany understood exactly what would happen if he told them, and exactly what she would have to do to secure the throne once the secret got out. It's why she lowered herself to beg him not to do it. She was at least self aware enough to know she wasn't going to give up the throne. Jon's failure here is twofold, first in not understanding the politics of the Kingdom and what was going on between Dany and Sansa, and secondly in not understanding how committed Dany was to winning the throne. Once again, Jon really does know nothing. I can almost forgive Jon for not understanding that Dany would not give up the quest for the throne for any reason. She was actively trying to hide that from nearly everyone. She fooled a lot of people with her talk of breaking wheels and freeing slaves. But I can't forgive him for not understanding that his decision to tell Sansa would mean that Dany would not be able to rightfully claim the throne. I don't forgive him for thinking that what he told Dany, that she would always be his Queen, would trump doing what she begged him not to do. If he was choosing honor and family over fealty to her then, why in the world would he choose her over honor and family when they asked to anoint him as rightful heir? If he believed that Sansa would keep his secret, then he truly knows nothing! And of course the real tragedy is that Jon does have one thing right. He shouldn't be King. He would likely be worse than Robert Baratheon, the last reluctant king who was really nothing more than a somewhat inspiring battlefield commander with no interest in ruling or how to rule. Hopefully, when Dany is assassinated and Jon is risen to King, he will at least remember that, end the Iron Throne rule over the kingdoms, then exile himself to the north.
  11. olibar

    A failed tragedy

    A tragedy is defined as a story in which a character's weakness is never overcome and it leads to their destruction. Dany's quest for power and Jon's belief that honesty trumps all other concerns are the twin tragic flaws that led to the destruction of Kings Landing. Because Jon telling his sisters meant that even though Dany had won the battle, she had also lost the war (to sit on the Iron Throne). I'm sure Dany believed and hoped that Cersi would never surrender (Cersi's own tragic flaw, and the one that killed her because she didn't do it earlier) and that it would "force her hand" in destroying Kings Landing, providing the show of force necessary to get the other kingdoms in line behind her regardless of who the true heir to the throne was. But Cersi did finally surrender, forcing Dany to confront her tragic flaw head on. Would she be willing to give up the throne for the betterment of all? She wasn't, and so pushed on as if Cersi had never surrendered, showing the Kingdoms what happens when you defy her while also keeping their larders full in the winter due to not having to divert food to sustain the population of Kings Landing. Regardless of whether Jon defeats Dany in the final episode, the tragic consequences of his decisions have already been felt, and I'm guessing he will exile himself because of it.
  12. olibar

    Welcome to war

    Taking this one step further, the kink in her strategy came when Cersi actually surrendered. She wasn't expecting it and it gave her pause. She'd probably been hoping to use the refusal to surrender as her excuse to burn the city. With that justification gone, she had to decide to either push on or give up the throne (she may have won the battle of KL but she'd already lost the war for the Throne). I'd expect we will continue to see her acting rationally in the final episode by trying to change history and officially declare that Cirse never surrendered. For the outlying kingdoms, that's probably not a hard thing to swallow, and given that they now will have quite a bit more food for the winter given the destruction of Kings Landing, something they might actually be happy about. Of course the Starks aren't going to stand for it. Not for the lies and not for the act itself. Because even though what Dani did was coldly rational, it was also purely evil.
  13. olibar

    [Spoilers] Episode 805 Discussion

    The northerners who were there would be mad to tell any story except the official narrative of the Queen, and the ravens she will send out telling her version of the story will beat them home. By the time of the invasion, she had a reasonable certainty that Jon was going to be put onto the throne by the Westerosi lords before long. The battle of KL may have been won when the bells tolled, but the War for the Throne had not, and winning battles doesn't win wars.
  14. olibar

    Welcome to war

    On top of that, by leaving virtually no survivors she now has the opportunity to spin what happened as Cirse's fault. The official narrative should be that the bells were never run, that Cirse fought to the end, and Dany's only choice was to raze the city. To the victor goes the history.
  15. olibar

    [Spoilers] Episode 805 Discussion

    If I may add one more recent example, how about the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki at the end of WWII? The US had won the war, but those bombings meant the war ended in the most favorable way possible to us. Dany will no doubt claim that the destruction was necessary to bring a true end to the war, and will likely spin the narrative to say that the bells never tolled (since there are virtually no witnesses to attest otherwise). Unless we are given reason to believe otherwise in the final episode, what Dany did was not insane or mad, but a calculated choice to win the last war.