Frey family reunion

He’s from my area, he’s a right wing religious tool.

There are always two, (maybe three) possible explanations for seemingly uneven wedding matches at least when the position of the bride appears much stronger than the position of the groom. The first is that the bride is homely. While it doesn't appear that the brides have a whole lot of say in who they are to marry, the grooms on the other hand seem to have a bit more autonomy. It may simply be that if the bride was not considered comely, her father may have a hard time making a match despite his position and despite the dowery offered. The other possibility is that the bride isn't considered chaste. That seems to be a real issue in Westeros. If the bride has a reputation of sexual impropriety, word gets around especially among the Houses that are closest to the bride's house. It might explain Lord Hightower's difficulty in finding a match for Lynesse. Perhaps her reputation preceded her in the Reach, thus he had to find a Lord from an isolated area that would have been unaware of her reputation. Finally, some of the Houses despite their apparent prestige might have financial difficulties where they can't match the doweries of lesser houses.

I think that’s the fear though. People of Jewish faith or let’s just even put it as non Muslim faith, have a fear that they become second class citizens if people of Muslim faith all of a sudden become the majority government in the region. It seems to me that we have a gerrymandering situation on steroids in the region. The West Bank and Gaza are given their own separate political structure, so they can have people of Muslim belief in power, but also so the sheer numbers don’t start to threaten the current political makeup of Israel. Being from the South in the US, I see certain parallels with how political jurisdictions are shaped with the black and white communities were I’m from.

The question is would the Israeli state allow for a majority controlled Muslim government?

I think we’re making this a lot more complicated than it really is. It’s always been about religious beliefs. When people of Muslim faith were in power, people of Jewish faith were second class citizens. Now that people of Jewish faith are in power people of Muslim faith are second class citizens. As long as religious identity is more important than any type of regional or national identity this conflict is never going to end.

I think you're right. And militarily speaking, I think Israel doesn't want to bring troops into perhaps the most densely populated area in the world without trying to force a good deal of the populace to leave, which might explain one of their motives in turning everything off in Northern Gaza. Because for their troops everyone they encounter is going to be a potential threat/target.

It's an interesting premise. One of the first strangled victims we hear about is Brandon Stark. And George goes out of his way to show that Brandon ultimately strangled himself. ETA: going down a rabbit hole here. Is GRRM creating a parallel between the two Brandon Starks in the story? The first Brandon Stark strangles himself to try to reach his sword. The second Brandon Stark is in GRRM's version of the Yggdrasil, the tree from which Odin was hung. So is there a parallel? Bran the broken needs to metaphorically hang or strangle himself to reach his "sword". My suspicion is that George's "magical swords" are actually characters in the series. And one of the characters with the most sword imagery up North is Jon Snow.

I don't think I get your basic premise. Is Shadd supposed to be Shadrich or is Howland supposed to be Shadrich? I don't see how both can be true.

Also : https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/bolshoi-zayatsky-island Located in Russia’s White Sea. ETA: from The Encyclopedia of the Arctic:

I think the tv show reversed it and had Will escape and get beheaded. ETA: Oh, yea, the abomination. LOL

And not just any Velaryon but a first cousin. I assume there was a real concern that if they started diluting their bloodlines too much they would lose their connection with their dragons. ETA: sorry, cousin not first cousin.

Undoubtably they would have refused these matches.

Will was in the tree who watched Royce get slain by the Others and was then presumably killed when Royce rose. Gared was the one who fled.

I agree. I don't think there is a comparison between Holocust victims and Gared. That's not to say I agree with the execution of Gared, you would think that in all cases even in Westeros a ruler should be able to temper justice with mercy, and considering Gared's mental state, I think Ned could have exempted him from execution. Even Jon, fully in his right mind, escaped any punishment for his desertion from the NIght's Watch, so there is obviously some leeway. If Jon wasn't who he was would he have gotten off so lightly?

The impression I get is that GRRM has a general criticism of "honorable" characters, if they let their honor get in the way of a positive outcome. So while Ned couldn't bring himself to cause the death of Cersei's children or their imprisonment, Ned's actions led the way to not only his death but a spiralling situation that set the table for a war that brought a tremendous amount of hardship on a great many people. Varys is not honorable, yet he seems to have a noble goal in mind, to create a ruler that would be more empathetic with the common people. Varys reminds me very much of the protaganist in Tuf Voyaging. Someone notably not heroic but willing to do some dark deeds for the greater good.

The impression I got was that Sabine missed Exra and she just wanted to get back together with him, even if it meant that she was going to be exiled in another galaxy with him. I don't think she had any grand plans on how to get him back. So yea, it was a pretty selfish move on her part. As for Ashoka and Hera, I think they primarily wanted to find Thrawn, because they were afraid he was plotting to return, so they could nip it in the bud. And also finding Ezra was just an additional bonus. Which is why Ashoka had decided that if they couldn't get to Thrawn on their own terms it was better to destroy the map than let Thrawn's allies get to him. ETA: nevermind, I just relaized who you meant by "they". Umm, I guess he wanted Sabine to lead them to Ezra so he could kill Ezra before he headed out.

I think the explanation was he was buying time to keep filling up his ships with coffins/bodies from the catacombs. Yea, I know that's kind of paper thin, but I think we're supposed to come away with the idea that Thrawn is some sort of tactical genius because he's using his troops to buy time so he can get his fill of bodies and leave. BTW, I guess it doesn't matter if they are "night troopers" or "storm troopers" they both seem just as inept. I was kind of hoping we'd see something cool happen, like after they were mowed down, they started rising again. But no, I guess they're just regular stormtroopers with more bling. Over all though, I enjoyed the episode well enough, even though it didn't move the plot along very much. They probably should have used this episode to set up a conflict between Ezra and Sabine over what she did to get to him, so they could get that out of the way before the last episode.

I don't think it takes a political science degree to have had red flags raised about someone who was fighting Russians in eastern Europe in World War II. That would have mainly been Germany or at least affiliated with Germany. It's fairly amazing that this idea didn't seem to cross anyone's mind.

Yes, if it was clear that Rhaegar was making a move on Lyanna, than I do expect him to react like Brandon reacted but moreso. If nothing else his honor wouild have demanded it. The only thing is he might have had to wait for Oberyn to be restrained from attacking Rhaegar. That's what ya'll are completely ignoring. If Rhaegar's intent was clear the aftermath of Harrenhal would have been much more explisve than just Brandon's temper tantrum. It's clear that no one quite knew what to make of Rhaegar's gesture. I understand that most of you have a pretty naive view of these tourneys, that the crowning of a queen of love and beauty has to be some type of romantic gesture or proposal, but that's simply not the case. And that comes from George's own inspiration behind this tourney in the Ivanhoe tourney. Depending on the cirdumstance, it's just as likely that someone already attached like Rhaegar would have used the crown to show honor to the recipient or to their family. The likspittles conclusion was completely understandable given the circumstances. The problem is, Rheagar never made it clear why he was crowning her. I think it's very likely that his silence might be because he determined that Lyanna was the mystery knight and he was honoring her secret. But he still wanted to give her an honor for her actions.

Umm, no. The dream is very personal to Ned, and it reflects an important part of Ned's subconcious. It doesn't mean that it's a literal representation of what occurred at the Harrenhal tourney. If it was clear that Rhaegar's act of crowning Lyanna was the act of a married man wooing a young underage girl betrothed to another, while his wife sat in attendance, we should expect the following reactions: 1. Outrage from the Dornish contingent, especially Elia's super protective, hot tempered, brother who we know as in attendance. Yet not a word of that. 2. Outrage from his bride Elia. Yet not only don't we have that, we are privy to a private moment, that probably happened after the tourney where they show no signs of a strain existing from Rhaegar's actions at Harrenhal. 3. We would not have gotten a muted reaction from Robert who himself is hot tempered and jealous. Instead he decides to agree to the interpretation that Rhaegar was giving Lyanna her due, while deep down suspecting that Rhaegar was somehow disrespecting him. If he clearly realized that this was an attempt by Rhaegar to steal his bride from him, his reaction would not be so muted. 4. The lickspittles who seize on any opportunity to to cast dispersions on Rhaegar would have clearly seized on Rhaegar's inappropriate actions towards Lyanna and against his wife as proof that he's not fit for rule. Yet even they, don't jump to that conclusion. Instead they jumpt to the more logical conclusion that Rhaegar was trying to woo the Starks to his side in a conspiracy against his father. 5. Everyone goes back to a semblance of normality after the tourney, until Lyanna's disappearance. Something that wouldn't have happend if Rhaegar had clearly been trying to steal Lyanna from Robert. So no, despite Eddard's dream, it's clear that the nobles of Westeros had not jumped to the conlcusion that Rhaegar was suggesting anything sexually inappropriate towards Lyanna, or he was trying to woo her for himself. The Worldbook is fairly clear that if the smiles "died" it's because everyone was confused as to why Rheagar crowned her, because it seemingly came out of the blue. The evidence is that the only person who 100% jumped to the conclusion that Rhaegar made an inappropriate act was Brandon. And perhaps Eddard, but even that's unclear based on the accounts. So the question, is why did they come to that conclusion instead of the more logical conclusion that Rhaegar was trying to honor their family by awarding their only sister with the prize of the tourney. It's kind of why I wish more of you would check out the tourney in Ivanhoe, where it's abundantly clear that's where GRRM drew his inspiration for this tourney. That tourney makes it clear that this award of love and beauty could have different motivations. Yes, it could be motivated out of a romantic overture to the recipient, but it's also clear that it can also a political overture trying to win over the family of the recipient. Since Rhaegar's wife was in attendance, and since Lyanna was underage and betrothed to another, and considering Rhaegar did not have the reputation of a womanizer, the most logical conclusion to be drawn is that Rhaegar was attempting to honor the Stark family. The confusion undoubtably occurs because no one was expecting it, and the strong negative reaction from the Stark family.

Actually, I'm just joking.

I’m not dismissing the dream, I’m just putting it in proper context. For Ned, Lyanna’s crowning was when all the smiles died, because that’s the moment when everything started going wrong for him and his family. It doesn’t mean that there was a collective gasp from the crowd as they watched in disbelief as Rhaegar made a public romantic overture to Lyanna. If that was the case, then the ramifications of the tourney would have been much greater than it was. At the very least Robert would have reacted more strongly, and Oberyn would have probably confronted Rhaegar as well. The Worldbook makes it apparent that the initial reaction was that of confusion. Why did Rhaegar do that? And why were the Starks so upset?

Maybe, unless the rose crown is sowing confusion among the readers as well… ETA: One thing can of course always lead to another. It doesn’t necessarily mean that it was Rhaegar’s intent at the time though.

It just means that he’s easily manipulated.

Lest anyone forget, Ned was on board with the killing of the direwolf pups.