DisraeliGears

So watching the Ep 4 preview, I'm presuming that Theon is being led to the Dreadfort, where in ep 5 or 6, Ramsay will be fully revealed. As for Ep3 it was fantastic. Loved just about everything about it.

Ok so bad acting. Not going to try and argue that point because it will simply go in circles. I believe she's doing a good job distinguishing Shae from a common whore (or even an uncommon whore like Ros) Yes, how silly in a world where people are commonly killed, where the king slaughters innocent babes, where thousands of men are burnt to death in a single battle, that Tyrion would get so hung up over killing a whore he rather liked instead of his father lets say. In the books, Shae doesn't make a sufficient impact that a character so supposedly smart as Tyrion should get caught up with her. This Shae adds enough depth for it to be believable, so that in season 4 and onward, when he has issues with love and women, IT'LL BE BELIEVABLE! That's why we get so much Shae material, why she's so important (more so than Jeyne/Talisa) and why the actress is actually doing something with what was a one note character in the books Equally worse is laughable, and Shae gets much more screen time. It is a matter of choice. You get 550 minutes for a season, how to allocate those minutes are crucial So Tyrion's major flaw is that he gets fucked over by women? Guess what, that's not a character flaw. If he was too obsessed with women, then it'd be a character flaw, but really Shae is the only woman (aside from his first whore yadda yadda) he's developed a weakness for. Indeed Shae keeps him on the straight and narrow rather well. Tyrion's flaw is hubris in his own intellectual talent. He thinks he plays the game better than he does, which gets him screwed over, imprisoned, and exiled to Essos. Because he believes in his own intellectual superiority he continues to indulge Shae, as she is the only person he doesn't understand. You are still assuming that Shae is entirely genuine and won't turn away from Tyrion. Really if she was genuine and turned away it would be even more emotionally wrenching. While I won't saying I know what D&D are doing exactly, I understand how their approaching this and they are doing an excellent job. Really, his musings on her in the book could be read as him still not understanding her motivations. He's not so much torn up, weeping about his lost love, as thinking, "Why? I don't understand why she did this, and I'm usually so good at understanding everything. Why does a whore do what she does?"

Putting aside the Sansa stuff, isn't the fact that Shae is a cipher the reason Tyrion finds her so interesting? She is one of the few people (along with Varys most likely) that Tyrion can't see through. If he could, then she'd be just another whore. At some point before the end of the Shae/Tyrion plot I expect we'll get an idea what motivates her but for now, Tyrion is continually kept intrigued by actions and loyalty to him that he can't understand. The jealousy bout has a few angles, but is impossible to fully decipher at this point. First it could be sowing the seeds for the Tyrion/Shae falling out over Sansa. It could very well be Shae simply teasing Tyrion (which she has done before though not in that specific way). Or it could also be Shae keeping Tyrion off balance (which is one of the reason he is so fascinated by her). The Sansa stuff I'd need to rewatch a couple S2 episodes to really interpret well though so I'm going to avoid getting into that for the moment (and it really is less important anyhow)

I'm also surprised by the immense Shae hate I see here, because the actress really brings something to the role. Part of the problem I think people have with her is the odd cadence she uses, but it helps emphasize the exotic nature of Shae (and is probably part of the reason Tyrion falls for her). Unlike numerous other "foreign" characters who may as well be Westerosi in the show (Talisa or Thoros for example) there is a definite sense of otherness with Shae. In fact, comparing Shae with Talisa shows exactly why Shae is a good character in the show (while Talisa is one of the biggest mis-steps in the adaptation). Basically, Shae and Talisa are flipped from the books. In the books Shae is a one-note gold digger who somehow takes in Tyrion, while in the show Talisa is a one-note romantic love character. In the books the Shae character detracts from Tyrion because A. He shouldn't fall for that kind of thing and B. Why does it affect him so much during Dance. I don't buy how hung up he is in the books over a gold-digger, but I DO buy him being so hung up over this Shae characters betrayal (however it happens). On the other end of the spectrum, the Jeyne character adds to Robb in the book, showing he has the same flaw as his father (his honor). In the show however, her substitute (Talisa) really dumbs down his characterization into a simple doomed love story kind of thing. I understand why D&D decided to emphasize Shae over Jeyne/Talisa (Tyrion is much more important long run than Robb basically, so if you have to pick which one is going to be more fleshed out, it ought to be Tyrion) but it still majorly damages Robb's character. So can someone explain to me why the show Shae is so terrible aside from "bad acting"? The worst part about show Shae is that the actress doesn't sell her connection to Sansa all that well, but her connection with Tyrion is MUCH more important, and in that respect she does a fine job showing why she isn't just another whore to Tyrion. Um no. Having no serious flaws makes your character alien and unrelatable. One crucial piece to being sympathetic is being human, and being human means making mistakes.

Helps to be reminded occasionally. When you consider the fact that (especially in the show) Cat is the only "good" mother figure we really see (and most of the parental figures are dead anyhow) it becomes very easy to forget about her dislike of Jon. That is one of the major currents of the speech as a whole. Basically Cat was lamenting that one reason for all this tragedy befalling her family is that she broke her oath to the gods to accept Jon. Cat is essentially saying that if accepting Jon as a Stark would bring back Ned, Arya, Sansa, Bran, and Rickon, she'd do it and she regrets not doing so. Honestly it shows the motherly side of Cat more, willing to sacrifice her own feelings about Jon/Ned's infidelity to keep her family intact. Finally, it emphasizes Cat's losses so far. Cat was unwilling to love a "motherless child" but she can see soon that she may very well be a childless mother considering every Stark aside from Robb could be dead, and Robb has her locked up. Not gonna get into this one, as Jon's bastard status does seem to be held against him numerous times That is EXACTLY what this speech is supposed to emphasize. It just seems that people who interpret long fantasy novels can't interpret T.V. scenes. This whole speech was basically I love my family more than I hate Jon, and if I could go back and redo things I would. Final comment about Cat. I hear a lot of complaining that she only thinks Bran/Rickon are dead instead of "knowing" it like the books, and how that damages her character. I can virtually promise you that she will find out about their "death" sometime in episode 5 or 6 probably. I'm sorry but every ep is gonna check in with Cat/Robb, and 7+ episodes of Cat moping over their death would be extremely tiring, which is why D&D are holding it back. Cat is going to lose EVERYTHING, and it will have more resonance if it happens closer to the RW.