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Universal Sword Donor

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  1. Universal Sword Donor

    Were Ned, Robert and Jon Arryn the villains of the rebellion?

    I'd swap Rhaegar with Aerys, as the execution of Rickard and Brandon didn't set off the rebellion. It was the call to execute Ned and Robert that pushed Jon to rebel. Robert was really the only viable choice if you wanted to please the former loyalists with Targ blood and reward the leaders of the rebellion. Stannis spent the entire war in SE. No doubt that's important, but not quite as important as Robert's participation in every major battle fought in RR. More importantly Stannis hates the Tyrells and the Redwynes, and the war wasn't over until Mace dipped his banners. They still fear what he would do to them as king in 299 AC, so if Ned had been naming Stannis king at SE, I don't think it would have gone well.
  2. Universal Sword Donor

    Were Ned, Robert and Jon Arryn the villains of the rebellion?

    That particular clip basically says "Robert and the other lords finally realized the Targs are humans like them, not some omnipotent Gods who control dragons." There' absolutely nothing in there to hint that any of those lords were trying to remove the Targs from power. The most generous interpretation from that viewpoint is that those lords realized they didn't have to bow and scrape to an absolute monarchy. Rickard wasn't doing anything that House Stark hadn't done before (or been promised before). Tywin was trying to do the exact same thing with Jaime when he was still Hand and probably before Lyanna was even betrothed to Robert. If Rickard had wanted to challenge Aerys, you'd think he'd have gone to KL with more than 200 guardsmen (if they even came with him) or not have gone at all and raised his banners in defiance, even with Brandon in his custody.
  3. I don't. Kingswood is a lot easier to traverse than the high road and the small folk were more than willing to turn them over once they were given some boons. As to the vulture king, I can't really comment since I don't have FAB around me, but if it was was an invasion that differs substantially than raids of the MC. the mountain clans were lawless brigands, descending from the heights to rob and kill and melting away like snow whenever the knights rode out from the Vale in search of them. the clans that dwelt in the mountain fastnesses were brigands and murderers who bowed to no law but the sword. Ser Donnel thought it would be easy: "If it were up to me, I would take a hundred men into the mountains, root them out of their fastnesses, and teach them some sharp lessons." Clearly it is not since Jon Arryn nor any other lord bothered to do so. You could ask the same thing about Skagos or the Wildlings. Periodic raids seem far more acceptable than mounting the large, costly expeditions to essentially commit genocide over a huge mountain range.
  4. Universal Sword Donor

    Chapters' predicitions for TWOW

    I predict that this thread will either be closed or moved to TWOW forum
  5. Because it's not worth the time or effort?
  6. And yet they haven't raised a large host to go commit genocide on the mountain clans? Honestly minor raids aren't really worth the time or effort and how many Arryn kings have been killed by the clans? Definitely none post AC. The closest we get is one of the Arryn daughters being seized on her way to her marriage. Honestly based on the condition of the High Road it doesn't seem like it gets that much traffic. The one thing people keep noting about it is its dangers, even beyond the mountain clans. I wasn't talking about the ambush. I was talking about the fact Dorne used asymmetric warfare for hundreds of years to keep the IT away The Americans also have satellites to track movement, night vision, complete air superiority, and much better weapons, yet we can't wipe them out either. The clans know where they can hide themselves, their family, food and live in the mountains. Any Arryn army would need to bring all their supplies with them and they are far from home. Piles of rocks are common in the mountains, or so I have heard. You can put the equivalent of ghilly netting over dead animals or anything else you want to hide. This is even assuming that the Vale could beg. steal or borrow a dragonrider to do that in the first place. You'd have to have scouts on the ground too, and they would be perfect targets for the mountain clans to ambush. I still have yet to hear a compelling reason why the mountain clans merit such a response in the first place. Getting Vhagar and Balerion to do anything in tandem basically is calling it a threat to the realm. The mountain clans are barely a threat to the borders of the Vale.
  7. Yeah it is that hard and it's also not really worth doing. In Planetos, they tried to do this in Dorne and it failed miserably. In the real world they've tried to do this in any number of places,. FARC lasted for 50 years. The communists in Vietnam / French Indochina did it for a decade. The Taliban has been resisting and hiding from two superpowers since the early 80s. Really Afghanistan is a pretty good real world analogue since it's been a thorn in every conquering power's side since Alexander the Great
  8. The Soviets and the Americans had/have trouble with the Taliban despite having modern tech that far outstrips dragons. Asymmetric warfare lasting for generations isn’t exactly a new thing
  9. Universal Sword Donor

    Were Ned, Robert and Jon Arryn the villains of the rebellion?

    They would not have had to plan to overthrow Aerys... nm they didn’t plan on that. Sorry
  10. I mean it’s all relative. He’s not commanding the armies, but he is trusted to lead the van. He’s trusted to lead a chevauchee twice across the Riverlands. Clearly he’s someone Tywin, who we can safely consider a warfare expert, entrusts him with critical roles and missions. When the Wo5K erupts, how many expert commander are there really? Tywin, Robert, Ned, Stannis, Tarly, maybe Kevan? it seems like the characters are generally ascribing warfare expertise to anyone who’s fought in battles and commanded something more than an honor guards. Frankly that’s a pretty fair assessment given how rare pitched battles actually were.
  11. And the Triarii were the oldest, best trained, and best equipped soldiers. Thanks Rome Total War!
  12. Universal Sword Donor

    Were Ned, Robert and Jon Arryn the villains of the rebellion?

    That is an excellent way to phrase it. I had not thought of it in that light.
  13. Universal Sword Donor

    Were Ned, Robert and Jon Arryn the villains of the rebellion?

    Basically everything he did post Duskendale and a fair amount before it. Euron is definitely mad. His IB say as much. If he controls as much territory for remotely as long as Aerys, he will be worse. Robb Stark had already started his war and fought both Lannister armies at this point. Lol Euron's intentions are immaterial to my point. Balon had already started a war and taken 4 northern castles at this point. Oh he's definitely bad and mad, but frankly he just hasn't has as much time or influence. That is why Once again, scope. Walder is definitely a villain but other than the RW what has he done? As to LF, more often than not he's just letting people do what they want to do and goes along for the ride. He's definitely a bad(der) guy but hardly an arch villain. Aerys lost his entire kingdom, one that he ran. Ramsay ruins one part of a kingdom that he does not run Never said it was. I just said that basically everyone acknowledges that the Targs are a threat to his life and his throne.
  14. Quick note: We know from Ned that Gregor also fought in the Greyjoy Rebellion. “Ned Stark could not recall ever speaking to the man, though Gregor had ridden with them during Balon Greyjoy’s rebellion, one knight among thousands.”
  15. TBF we see them advancing in formation just before that as well: “and suddenly the enemy was there before them, boiling over the tops of the hills, advancing with measured tread behind a wall of shields and pikes.” I am not of the opinion that absolutely everyone is a professional soldier in Robb's army, but what we see is pretty indicative of well-drilled and well-equipped men going off to war. The entire series the only descriptions of peasants fighting we get are from a trap for Robb, Frey men sent off to die in the North (imo), and Meribald, who seems to have been in a group of camp followers not levied men.
  16. Universal Sword Donor

    Why was Addam of Hull named heir to the Driftmark not Joffrey

    I can't say I ever thought it was clear: Well, the short answer is that the laws of inheritance in the Seven Kingdoms are modelled on those in real medieval history... which is to say, they were vague, uncodified, subject to varying interpertations, and often contradictory. https://www.westeros.org/Citadel/SSM/Entry/The_Hornwood_Inheritance_and_the_Whents
  17. Universal Sword Donor

    It seems that Aegon Targaryen was actually a MORON

    Who considered Jaehaerys a greater warrior than Maegor?
  18. Universal Sword Donor

    It seems that Aegon Targaryen was actually a MORON

    Parents play a huge role in a child's personality. Uh yeah. No one would have done that. Good luck trying to kill Maegor normally, let alone after he bonded Balerion.
  19. Universal Sword Donor

    Were Ned, Robert and Jon Arryn the villains of the rebellion?

    Those two are inseparable. Rumors from Aerys' lickspittles that the exact same text says they had no shred of proof. rumors flew thick and fast across the Seven Kingdoms. Some claimed that the crown prince was planning to depose his father and seize the Iron Throne for himself, whilst others said that King Aerys meant to disinherit Rhaegar and name Viserys heir in his place. Shockingly neither happened. Probably because they were worthless rumors. Had any whiff of proof come into their hands to show that Prince Rhaegar was conspiring against his father, King Aerys’s loyalists would most certainly have used it to bring about the prince’s downfall. Indeed, certain of the king’s men had even gone so far as to suggest that Aerys should disinherit his “disloyal” son, and name his younger brother heir to the Iron Throne in his stead. Oh man no proof, despite Varys being on the case with his little birds. Wait there's a pattern here: The lickspittle lords who surrounded Aerys II had gained much and more from the king’s madness and eagerly seized upon any opportunity to speak ill of Prince Rhaegar and inflame the father’s suspicions of the son. --- Prince Viserys was but seven years of age, and his eventual ascension would certainly mean a regency, wherein they themselves would rule as regents. ----- the lickspittle lords gathered around the king declared that [naming Lyanna his Queen of Love and Bueaty] further proof of his perfidy ---- I, for one, definitely put 100% stock in people like this. It's how I make decisions in my life. This is accurate Except the formula is x + 2 = y, not 2 + 2 = y. You can opine that Rhaegar's intent was 100% slam dunk removal of Aerys, but you have nothing concrete to base it off of, which is entirely GRRM's intent.
  20. Universal Sword Donor

    Were Ned, Robert and Jon Arryn the villains of the rebellion?

    The people you listed. Aerys did far more than execute a few lords and you know that. The Lannisters had already broken the King's peace and there was fighting all over the RL. Joff had no hand in that. Nor did he have a hand in Ned's imprisonment. That was Cersei and LF. Euron was joining a war that had already started from the IB perspective. Agreed No? Maybe one? Euron is probably more villainous but we only have a small taste of what he's done Well no. A grown Viserys is not going to like the man who killed his father and older brother. Pretty much everyone in the books agrees that living Targs are a danger to Robert AND his throne, not just his throne. Even Ned admits that, but merely observes that the Dothraki "can't run on water." Or as GRRM put it: "My father had a saying too. Never wound a foe when you can kill him. Dead men don't claim vengeance." "Their sons do," said Hoster, apologetically.
  21. Universal Sword Donor

    Were Ned, Robert and Jon Arryn the villains of the rebellion?

    Your summation of the conversation is flawed. I will leave it at that. Your assertion that a council would neuter him entirely is also opinion. We have literally no idea what the council would have done. It could have been a full overthrow, something akin to the Magna Carta, or just an airing of grievances. We have no idea.
  22. Universal Sword Donor

    Were Ned, Robert and Jon Arryn the villains of the rebellion?

    He condemned people without trial and had them burned to death, yet had nothing to do with executions? I am glossing over a lot of the crazy shit he did and moving on to the stuff that actually fomented rebellion.
  23. Universal Sword Donor

    Were Ned, Robert and Jon Arryn the villains of the rebellion?

    Narrator: This person is
  24. Universal Sword Donor

    Were Ned, Robert and Jon Arryn the villains of the rebellion?

    Restricting Aerys by denying him the right to execute people for no cause is not making him a figurehead. That's a ridiculous thing to opine
  25. Universal Sword Donor

    Were Ned, Robert and Jon Arryn the villains of the rebellion?

    Lol. "Imperfect men should be executed because of a crazy man so the kingdom doesnt split. It's the only way." "Better a few innocents be executed than one crazy man overthrown." "Killing guiltless nobles is the better part of valor." "innocence and naïveté will always lose to kangaroo courts and insane judges." or my favorite Shakespeare quote: "Fuck those guys. I don't understand basic civics OR ethics." - Act 1, Othellocop
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