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JNR

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  1. JNR

    Who is the great other?

    You might be thinking of this: Moqorro is a priest of the red faith, too, of course.
  2. JNR

    Heresy 222 vindication

    A curious position to take, because Show Dany never contends with Show Jon. Jon is on her side practically from the day they meet until the very instant she dies. But will Book Dany contend with Book Aegon? We'll find out, but I think she will... In the books, Book Aegon is backed by the Golden Company. But in the show, the Golden Company is opposed to Jon Snow. The show-runners were also apparently fooled into believing R+L=J, and as a result, committed themselves to many comical decisions such as giving Jon the secret Targ name "Aegon." It seems they forgot that Show Rhaegar had already had a son named Aegon in Show World, as referenced so memorably by Show Gregor Clegane during his fight with Show Red Viper. In general, I think it would be best to say that D&D totally abandoned Book Aegon's entire storyline, and everything and everyone in it. Jon Connington, Septa Lemore, Haldon the half-maester, Rolly, Ysilla and her excellent biscuits, her husband Yandry, etc, etc. All completely tossed out the window. All literally nonexistent in the show. So as usual, just a dog's breakfast on the part of Benioff and Weiss.
  3. JNR

    Heresy 222 vindication

    Well, we'll have to wait and see. However, for me, we do already know that they ended it egregiously far off. The oncoming Long Night in the books... which I think we agree is going to be the primary and final conflict of the series, in contradiction of the show... really can't end with killing Night King. Because he doesn't exist in the books, except as a mythical reference to a human being. The show ending also depends on the premise that killing a Popsicle instantly kills all the wights (or other Popsicles) that that Popsicle created. And this crucial concept, like Night King, simply does not exist in Book World. And while it's technically possible that Westeros will arbitrarily abandon the claim-driven succession by which, for thousands of years, it has chosen kings, I really don't think that will happen, either. So IMO, Bran, who has no conceivable claim, is not going to be king of Westeros at any point in the books -- certainly not the ending. However, I do expect the Wall to fall, I do expect Dany to run into trouble with Westerosi nobles, and I do expect there to be a war for survival in the North. So in terms of those major beats... yes, I think we will get that much in the books.
  4. JNR

    Heresy 222 vindication

    Sure. That basic sequence is, as I've noted before, right out of the 1993 synopsis and was also already heavily implied by the title of ADWD. But I can't call that story the same story we got from HBO at all. For one thing, in the show there is no Aegon and there is no Arianne either. For another, it's hard to imagine that if Dany torches thousands of innocent civilians, as on the show, she is going to have any kind of following after that. She will have exposed herself as a mass murderer, and I just don't see GRRM shutting down her story in book six. And let's not forget that in Book World, we've already had Dany's theoretical madness evaluated by someone remarkably competent to assess Targ insanity... someone who served two Targ monarchs before her, one of whom was insane. He was, he told us, specifically looking for such insanity in Dany. And he never found any. Was Barristan Selmy wrong? Maybe. I doubt it. I expect some conflict with Aegon, but not anything like what we saw on the show. And I expect Book Dany to come out of it, at the end, smelling a whole lot better than Show Dany... whose paranoia, rage at the idea of being supplanted by someone more popular and worthy, and grotesque actions remind me quite a bit of the nut in the White House right now.
  5. JNR

    Heresy 222 vindication

    We can only wait and see. However, he has a much stronger motive to finish TWOW now than he's ever had before. This is presumably not a situation he wants to have to endure for one day longer than he has to: people literally laughing at the piss-poor quality of a show they are also confident spoiled all the important points of his last two books. Really, some of us have been laughing all along. Back in season four, many were awed when Night King touched a baby's face with a fingernail. But I was objecting that a newborn baby would never, ever survive weeks of travel to the uttermost north, cradled as it was next to a Popsicle, never being breastfed, exposed directly to the elements, etc... all to reach a Dark Lord who simply does not even exist in the books. So GRRM, I am sure, would like to redeem himself and his work from the connection to that kind of trash, because the world has finally realized it's trash. We'll see if he does.
  6. JNR

    Heresy 222 vindication

    Still rather striking, given the way it deviates from the position he's had for years now, as reiterated this very week in the immediately prior blog post: Whereas now we get: Hard not to feel a little encouraged by that. Even if he pulls a Douglas Adams -- "I love the whooshing noise deadlines make as they blow by" -- he'll know fans will give him grief about it all convention long. "Are you a secret Targ, George? 'Cause this is getting a little... insane."
  7. JNR

    Heresy 222 vindication

    I'd think about it like this: • Suppose you're right, and the Wall's magic ward is getting stronger, not weaker • Notice also Silverwing wouldn't even fly over the Wall (never mind going through it, as Coldhands refused to do) • Thus, it certainly seems like for the Wall to fall to the Popsicles and wights... that magic ward is going to have to fail So if we think the Wall is going to fall, we should consider how that last bullet point might happen. This is a very interesting area, rarely discussed in Heresy. One way it's not going to take place, IMO, is for a wighted dragon to somehow knock the Wall down with its icy breath that somehow acts like an invisible wrecking ball the size of the Death Star.
  8. JNR

    Heresy 222 vindication

    In that case we don't disagree at all. The concept that Shireen may, under some circumstances, burn is certainly possible. The concept that the show got it right -- that Stannis is the author of her fate, and her death happens at that time, in that place, for that reason -- is an extremely doubtful matter. That's really my point in saying simply that GRRM told D&D "something about Shireen." We don't know what he said, we don't know what D&D decided he meant or whether they decided to do the same thing on the show... and when we look at the show, we can see many clear reasons to believe what they did choose to do will not be the same in the books. I think that's the case with all of the moments GRRM told them about, actually. Just as with Shireen, it's very easy to demonstrate the Hodor revelation just isn't going to happen in the books in anything resembling the same way. I wouldn't be the least surprised if GRRM simply said "Hodor's name derives from the phrase hold the door" and they took that and ran with it... in directions wiser analysts would not have gone.
  9. JNR

    Heresy 222 vindication

    What they say is "this." As in: "When George told us about this..." At the time, that was immediately defined by some, such as the admin of this site, to mean: "Stannis burns Shireen." Well, we'll see... but I really doubt it. Shireen is hundreds of miles away from Stannis at this time in the books, and so is Selyse, and so is Melisandre. In ADWD he refuses to burn people for R'hllor at that same point in the story. And in the TWOW sample chapter he specifically tells Justin Massey this: That guy is not gonna burn his daughter alive, in my strong opinion.
  10. JNR

    Heresy 222 vindication

    Yes, I would certainly agree with that. You could even say that Jon was... non regis.
  11. JNR

    Heresy 222 vindication

    Welcome aboard. You seem, from your post, like one of us to me. Some of us have argued it, actually, but I agree. I think it's plain there's a magical ward in the Wall, of a sort. (And if we're being a bit more literal, there's also some sort of structural magic, or the Wall would have imploded into a giant mound millennia ago.) Sure seems like it, doesn't it? I interpret this just as you do: And having recognized that, we can go on to speculate about the principles involved... and perhaps reach interesting conclusions when we do, and then go on to make predictions. However, you should know that in accordance with the ancient law of Heretics Never Agree, some in the thread probably do believe it's directed toward dragons.
  12. JNR

    Heresy 222 vindication

    Hmmm... while I'm certainly no fan of R+L=J, I don't think we know any of that. Here's what I know, concerning the show vs. the books: • The show creators constantly changed things -- all kinds of things -- to suit their own interests • The things they changed absolutely did include character deaths (numerous examples) • In the show, R+L=J did turn out to be true and did matter quite a bit (without it, Dany probably would have survived) • GRRM confirmed D&D knew Jon's mother, but has never once said a peep about D&D knowing his parents • GRRM also told them something about Hodor, something about Shireen, and something that turns up at "the very end" of the show That's really it. It adds up to almost nothing about future books IMO per se, because Book World is simply not Show World. All the same, Heresy has always stood for keeping an open mind and not jumping to premature conclusions -- not feeling obligated to believe whatever other book fans believe. It still should stand for all that. And in the end, that is going to prove the better approach, because as Parris McBride so accurately observed:
  13. JNR

    Heresy 222 vindication

    ...among other things. Outstandingly good question.
  14. JNR

    Heresy 222 vindication

    Which outcomes would you say have been revealed? I think our independent stance has been encouraged all along by the huge variations we've seen across the two projects... not to mention GRRM's many statements since 2011, almost all somehow forgotten by the fans, that differences between them would get bigger and bigger and bigger over time.
  15. JNR

    Heresy 222 vindication

    This particular comparison has famously been suggested by GRRM himself, in fact. The second part of GRRM's response, btw, seems to me to hint heavily at the concept that it has a magical ward, and that is what prevents Coldhands and other wights from passing the Wall.
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