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Yoren Luck

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  1. Yoren Luck

    [Spoilers] Rant and Rave Without Repercussion

    Yeah the way Winterfell plots have been written, I've been wishing they (the writers) had just left it in the Bolton's hands and never bothered with it again. There hasn't been an interesting scene there in like three years. Ramsey was a stupid comic book villain...Sansa rape was unnecessary and very off-putting (she was beautiful though!)...battle of bastards was stupid from start to finish and had unbelievable hollywood-esque aspects...littlefinger had no scheming left once he got there so his character totally fizzled out...Sansa as Lady of Winterfell has been underwhelming (not in terms of acting, but in terms of them not really showing her do anything of interest, like cement their alliances, gather info on rivals, actually have a discussion about anything longer then three lines of dialogue)...bran's return was too early and all he's done is sit around until his big exposition day...arya's return was underwhelming and the best moment about it was seeing Brienne and Pod comment on it, because there was next to no dialogue between Sansa/Arya/Bran except for the littlefinger knife gifting and then a few scenes where we are supposed to think arya is mad and sansa for 'reasons'...arya and brienne 'training' was pathetic fan service and should have been totally out of character for arya and why the fuck did Brienne kick her during it?...Littlefinger's trial was forced, stupid, weak and was everything you wouldn't have expected to have occurred for that character's death if you thought about if 5 years ago...am I forgetting anything, I'm sure I am...so much worth forgetting. I think my biggest gripe with Winterfell stuff this season (biggest, not only) was simply that all of the scenes felt like they should have unfolded within two days, yet they were drawn out over 7 episodes which amounted to i guess weeks or months for other characters (who f'ing knows anymore really)...Even if you buy the bullshit that Bran couldn't just spill all the important info right away, are we really supposed to believe that Arya and Sansa only talked to each other like 3 times in (lets say) four weeks of actual time lapse? Because that's what it felt like as a viewer. It certainly didn't feel like they were having dialogue off screen, since the two scenes we saw them both together (in their respective rooms) felt like they had occurred without any additional communication between them. Anyway, back to Euron...I haven't read those leaks but I may. Waiting around for this turd of a show to finish so I know the end game seems pointless, since the remaining 6 episodes are just going to be underwhelming anyway. If they make Euron some savior though, after only giving him like 5 minutes of screen time and developing his character no further than a one dimensional horny pirate i'm gonna laugh. I'm actually kind of rooting for him to take the Golden Company and Ironborn and conquer all of Westeros, and find some dragon living at Storms End that breaths obsidian and valyrian steel daggers to murder every army there is so he can sit on the throne and enjoy the shoehorned character that was promised
  2. Yoren Luck

    [Spoilers] Rant and Rave Without Repercussion

    Yep, D&D really put the 'low brow' in high fantasy. They don't know how to write anything besides immature bullshit. Did you know a million people live in Kings Landing because the brothels are better? That's some top notch world building right there. And that exchange between Bronn and Jaime atop the walls of Kings Landing? It's all about the cocks in the end? Bravo! Emmys all around. Oh and don't forget Sandor 'Cunt' Clegane can't say four Cunt words without dropping a Cunt in for good Cunt measure because saying Cunt is edgy and Cunt. These are supposed to be important scenes. Why are they written by 15 year olds?
  3. Yoren Luck

    [Spoilers] Rant and Rave Without Repercussion

    I responded to this yesterday with a joke about how that should tell you the leaks are fake, since the Stormlands haven't been mentioned in the show in ages...but now that I've had some time to think about it, it would not surprise me if D&D drum up some extra conflict to draw out next season by having Euron back stab Cersei. Think about it - he goes and gets the Golden Company, and between them and his own men has probably enough of a force to take half of Westeros pretty quickly. I could easily see D&D doing this, when them landing in the Stormlands and taking the Reach and possibly even the Throne. Lots of options for shoehorning in more conflict if they want, and it would be the type of 'twist' to the story they are capable of writing (meaning a GRRM plotline they have taken from other characters not in the show, and butchered it to force it into Euron's arc)
  4. Yoren Luck

    [Spoilers] Rant and Rave Without Repercussion

    When Jon and Tyrion were talking on the boat ride into Kings Landing, could they please have had Tyrion say the population was half a million, not a million. That number is ridiculous unless they mean the entire crownlands, and even then seems way high. Also, when Jon then responds about why so many people would live there, could they please have had Tyrion not mention brothels ffs. Say its because there are more jobs (that's a fair point) and then have hims say a quip about how "the weather is better than in the North - it hardly ever snows in Kings Landing" That way, when Jaime is leaving near the end of the episode and the snow begins to fall, it creates a nice set-up/parallel. This shit is not hard to write. Why do they fail so hard and have to include brothels and cocks all the time rather than a nice tidbit that sets up the fact that the winter that is approaching is going to be uncommonly harsh and long.
  5. Yoren Luck

    [Spoilers] Rant and Rave Without Repercussion

    That along should tell you the leaks are fake. No way in hell D&D remember what the Stormlands are. LOL I didn't put two and two together when watching but good catch. Probably should have had way fewer people in that scene anyway so I was actually kinda glad when Bronn and Pod left. Because the plot demands it
  6. Yoren Luck

    [Spoilers] Rant and Rave Without Repercussion

    Yeah it appears there was no plan to get across the wall sans necro-dragon. Which makes the wight hunt scene not only perhaps the most contrived scene in the history of the show, but maybe the most consequential contrived scene in the history of tv. Bronn could have just shipped those 1,000 barrels of pitch to Eastwatch and Tormund could've dumped 'em on the dead army as they gathered at the base of the wall, unable to go any further. Pick off the rest of them with obsidian tipped arrows and presto, it's springtime for "Aegon" & Co.
  7. I've been wondering this myself. Lord Okra is like the only one defending this scene on this thread, and is so steadfast in that defense that their conviction seems fake in the wake of the 40+ pages of criticisms (large and small) As a debate thread, this thing is going nowhere because the majority of posters are in agreement that the scene was ridiculous, and the small but vocal minority that are not in agreement but still posting in this thread are not bending an inch despite many, many good points being raised by the majority. Honestly it feels like this thread has reached the 'agree to disagree' point. the plot that drove the scene was contrived, the scene had to used several contrived elements for it to be successful, and most viewers recognize that. the ones that don't are never going to, so as a debate thread this thing is dead in the water
  8. Yoren Luck

    [Spoilers] Rant and Rave Without Repercussion

    Yeah this felt odd to me too, like she had just cast a spell on him or something haha. Funny then how Davos' first words after Gendry reaches that wall are "Get the Maester". Not that it matters, I just assumed Eastwatch has someone there who can manage the ravens and Davos just used the word Maester because it is easier in-story to say that than a more lengthy explanation. But it is still a relevant point - did Eastwatch have any ravens. If so, why didn't they bring their raven keeper person along on the journey. That is after all how Samwell found himself north of the wall for the Fist of the First Men. He was no maester, just working as an assistant to kept the birds
  9. NO IT IS NOT! You are still misinterpreting the usage of the work 'introduce' despite my having explained that this does not mean 'newness' to the story. It stems from the literal definition and original usage of the term, where the character/prop was 'introduced' into the scene from above via a crane or other mechanism rather than being introduced from stage left or stage right. 'Introduced' in this sense meaning how the character/prop was physically brought onto the stage. It does not mean this was an 'introduction' of a new and unexpected character to the audience. It can be a character that is entirely new to the play, such as a god that comes down seemingly out of nowhere to fix something, but it does not have to be. It just has to be a character that is not previously involved in or previously discussed in the scene or in any preceding scenes that led to the unexpected resolution. A deus ex machina does not require the introduction of an entirely new character to the story. It refers to the mechanism that is used to introduce a character into a scene. A character that already exists in the story can still be 'introduced' into a scene where their involvement is entirely unexpected, in order to resolve a situation that appears to be unable to be resolved. You need to understand that the work references how the character is brought into the scene, now that the character is new to the story. Gandalf's eagle rescue of Frodo at the end of LOTR is a classic deus ex machina, yet we know these eagles exist in this universe, both from the Hobbit and from references/scenese in earlier books of the LOTR trilogy. The most blatant examples I can remember are that the eagles save Gandalf from the tower at Isengard, and transport him to Rohan. The head eagle also saves Gandalf from the mountain where he basically died fighting the Balrog. These eagles are then used to save Frodo and Sam. This was the last of several times they are referenced or used as a plot device in the overall story, but is still a classic deus ex machina because it was an unexpected resolution to that scene. The eagles had not been previously discussed as a possible exit strategy by Frodo and Sam, we did not see Gandalf preparing to have them used in such a way, and we did not seem them anywhere near Mount Doom in any preceding scene that might allude to the fact that they were ready to help. The were 'introduced' into this scene to resolve an unsolvable issue as a dramatic and unexpected solution - a deus ex machina.
  10. I said this earlier, so I will respond. Samwell told the maesters that the realm respects their opinion, and if they said this was an issue, people would listen and act accordingly. The maesters responded by saying it could be a plot to undermine Cersei, and that they needed more proof. That is why the told Sam they would write again to Winterfell for clarification...to see if this was some sort of mistake or overreaction or if they could read more into the situation and see if it is all some ploy. Bringing a wight to the Citadel and telling the head Maesters there is 100,000+ more north of the wall, they are nearly impossible to kill, and they are coming this way would go a long way towards giving them that clarification.
  11. Agreed! The fact that there is like 4 pages of debate in this thread over the definition of 'deus ex machina' is all the proof anyone should need that this episode had some serious issues. For the record, the origin of the term and most literal definition is the unexpected usage of a god to resolve a plot, by suspending a character or representation of that god over the stage/arena, using a crane or similar device during a Greek or Roman performance. Hence the literal translation "god from a machine" (the god character/prop was lowered using a machine). Merriam-Webster's definition for this literal usage is "a god introduced by means of a crane in ancient Greek and Roman drama to decide the final outcome." Having the word 'introduction' in this definition does not mean 'this is the first we ever see or hear of this character'. It means 'this character is being introduced onto the stage via a crane, as opposed to introducing them from stage left or stage right. This is not a debatable point. The Merriam-Webster definition as it relates to modern usage is "a person or thing (as in fiction or drama) that appears or is introduced suddenly and unexpectedly and provides a contrived solution to an apparently insoluble difficulty". Again, having the phrase "appears or is introduced" in this definition does not mean 'this is the first we ever see or hear of this character or thing'. It means the character or thing is brought into the story in a sudden or unexpected manner. This is not a debatable point. In both of these definitions, the word 'introduced' refers to how the character or thing enters the scene or stage, not that it is the first time we are being introduced to that character or thing. The word 'introduced' on its own has multiple meanings, but the meaning with respect to the phrase 'deus ex machina' stems from it's most literal and original definition/usage, meaning 'entering the stage'. Uncle Benjen coming to save the day is absolutely a 'deux ex machina' both when he helps Bran and when he helps Jon. This is also not a debatable point. If you want to debate something regarding Savior Benjen, you can debate whether we should be calling Jon's rescue a "part deux ex machina" or a "dos ex machina" since this is the second time the show runners have used the same contrived solution to the same problem because they are now apparently even too lazy to write new contrived solutions.
  12. 1.) Because Jorah is a longstanding ally and trusted adviser who would not mislead her regarding something this serious, and because he was told this information from a man who was saving his life, who had absolutely no reason to lie to him about any of it and already established that he respected the hell out of his father, and because this would be the second time Dany received the exact same information and hearing it from Jorah would be a confirmation that Jon is not some crazy northerner and his motivations in trying to convince her of the danger are valid. 2.) At Eastwatch Jon admits that they need the wight to convince both queens: Cersei and Dany. She already doesn't believe him in the show version, and let him go for a bad reason. In fact, after talking to Tyrion about it, she seems to think the whole endeavor is little more than a stupid attempt of Jon's to show he is heroic so she falls in love with him.
  13. LOL, same with the one addressed to Casterly Rock, Storms End, Highgarden, Riverrun, Horn Hill, and all parts Dorne. The one sent to the Vale was automatically forwarded to Winterfell. I'm sure there's other houses/castles I am forgetting that are also vacant
  14. I agree I think Jaime will be convinced. I think Jaime has been convinced the Lannisters are going to lose since he saw a dragon and realized the power of Dany's forces. I also think he has been reassessing his impressions of Tyrion since learning from Olenna that he didn't murder Joffrey. But I don't think any viewer of the show expects Cersei to be convinced, which is what makes the plot so unbelievable. And I don't think Cersei is going to hand Jaime the tattered remnants of the Lannister army to march north to fight the dead. If she does, it will be as a ruse only, to buy more time to get the Golden Company to Westeros. So the magnificent 7 risk losing the King in the North and a handful of other prominent characters and end up losing a dragon, in order to gain a capable general and perhaps a small contingent of Lannister soldiers. It doesn't add up to me. Also, its not queen of the ashes if Dany lands in Kings Landing, and gives an impassioned speech to the people of Flea Bottom telling them to rise up against the evil queen and overthrow her so Dany can rule them more justly and actually help them. All she'd have to do is melt the gates, burn a few guards, and wait. Why does the KILL THE MASTERS plotline work in Essos but a KILL THE QUEEN plotline can't worn in Westeros? You are talking about a woman who used an impassioned speech, a show of force, and a demonstration of her power to overthrow thousands of years of enslavement. These same elements would undoubtedly work to muster a popular uprising in Kings Landing. Don't believe me? Ask yourself why is it that Hot Pie of all people knows that Cersei blew up the Sept of Baelor (the Vatican of Westeros) along with dozens of lords and hundreds of important people including a Queen that actually cared about the poor, but no one in Flea Bottom seems to know or care? The answer is that the plot demands it, just like the plot demands the Dany lose half her alliances and inexplicably isn't allowed to direct any effort to taking Kings Landing. Honestly, after the blowing up of the Sept, the people in Flea Bottom should have already been uprising. Instead they are for some unknown reason totally on her side and cheering for her, despite being the same people that were throwing garbage and rotting food and flopping their dicks at her just a little while ago. King's Landing should be a tinderbox but instead it seems the common folk are more on board with the royalty than ever before, which is simply not plausible given how the show has previously established these same people and their opinions regarding the ruling class.
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