Characters You Love Even Thought You Know You Should Probably Dislike/Hate Them

[Sansa_Stark]

Well, I like Lady Stoneheart. Should I hate her?

You should.

[Mad Monkey]

Hmmmmmmm, anyone hate Wylla? That seems unthinkable, LOL

And like clockwork someone will register an account called "Kill_Wylla2001" who will post half a hundred thinly-veiled Wylla-bashing threads such as, "Wylla Manderly - Westeros's Greatest Monster?" or "Wylla - Cersei Baratheon Come Again?"

[Lady Fevre Dream]

And like clockwork someone will register an account called "Kill_Wylla2001" who will post half a hundred thinly-veiled Wylla-bashing threads such as, "Wylla Manderly - Westeros's Greatest Monster?" or "Wylla - Cersei Baratheon Come Again?"

LOL You are probably right. I was trying to think of someone that just oozes the 'love' thing, I'm sure there are others.

*Apologizes for the possiblity of the Wylla hate thread and looks for it at the same time?* :leaving: :dunno:

[Feliciano69]

Haven't heard much about The Hound here, which should deffinitely be frequent among readers !

[King Brandon Ice Eyes]

i thought the ultimate heresy would be..I dunno... Breaking guest right and betraying his king

Are you trying to convince me that murder and betrayal are worse than book burning? By the way: he didn't break guest right. He was a guest at the Twins as well.

Anyway GRRM (apparently) said in an interview that that passage was a microcosm of Roose's character. The fact that he is so selfish and pragmatic that he would burn a book to prevent anyone from potentially acquire some advantage over him through the knowledge contained in the book.

[Lady Fevre Dream]

Are you trying to convince me that murder and betrayal are worse than book burning? By the way: he didn't break guest right. He was a guest at the Twins as well.

Anyway GRRM (apparently) said in an interview that that passage was a microcosm of Roose's character. The fact that he is so selfish and pragmatic that he would burn a book to prevent anyone from potentially acquire some advantage over him through the knowledge contained in the book.

I think though that Roose at least had a semblance of a reason for the burning of the book, sacrilege that is was........it's Joffrey and his joyful, wanton destruction of a rare book I think is the truly horrific crime. It's almost up there with the killing cats and pulling out the not ready for primetime kittens, potential serial killer persona almost trumps the book boogery.

[Lady Fevre Dream]

Haven't heard much about The Hound here, which should deffinitely be frequent among readers !

I don't know, maybe I'm gonna get a virtual clout on the head, but I don't really think The Hound is supposed to be hated. He did turn out to be one of my favorite characters, too.

[Jalapenohitchhiker]

I don't know, maybe I'm gonna get a virtual clout on the head, but I don't really think The Hound is supposed to be hated. He did turn out to be one of my favorite characters, too.

Agreed. He is depicted as ruthless by Sansa, but those were the days when she judged him mostly by his appearance. The only truly bad thing he did was when he killed Micah, and that was during a time when he was still taking orders from Joffrey.

[King Brandon Ice Eyes]

Roose was my answer, too. I hadn't thought of that problem for him, the book burning. I really am thinking that was more about code and/or some book he didn't want people looking at, more likely a code. I love the saying The Roose is Loose and I do want him to stay that way, or at least......make til almost the end of the series. He is really just so fascinating, and other than that, I also think I'd like to have a hint of what he was like before he took to having his passions bled from him, as Lady Dustin I think it was suggested, with all the leeches. May The Roose stay Loose as long as possible.

Amen. :drool:

Do you think the leeches really drained his passions? I don't know... if there's really Ice Magic involved it's probably true... but if Roose is a normal human don't you think he was always like that? It's a very fun explanation though. I always loved that touch about the character: the bloodletting, the humorism theory. There's other instances that shows their medicine is not advanced enough to comprehend some phenomena that exists in our world, like Reek's disease is a real thing but all the maester could come with was that the gods made him stink because his soul was deteriorating. But I also would love more insight about Roose and his backstory. Also I would like to know more about his ancestors. Dunk and Egg need to go North soon. Maybe they will make contact with some Boltons.

A question: based on your name I'm supposing you read Fevre Dream. If so, is it true that the antagonist vampire in the story has some similarities with Roose? Someone said that in a thread and I will probably buy the book.

I like Lady Stoneheart too.

[King Brandon Ice Eyes]

Hmmmmmmm, anyone hate Wylla? That seems unthinkable, LOL

I imagine that is only possible if a person hates the Starks.

[Sansa_Stark]

I imagine that is only possible if a person hates the Starks.

Yo.

[Gertrude]

Jesus, there are so many people who have done horrible things, but I can't bring myself to hate them at all. The Hound and the Lannister boys for starters. I felt sorry for Theon even as he was doing horrible things at Winterfell, but I don't especially like him. I can't help but root for Stoneheart either, but mostly for her Frey crusade. When we actually see her kill Jaime/Brienne/Pod, then I might turn on her, but probably not til then. I know she's a monster, but she's a monster of the Frey's making and holy hell I just have to applaud her revenge on that score. Hell, Arya is a stone-cold killer and she's not considered a bad guy.

I love that we get these yummy grey characters to root for.

I appreciate Littlefinger and the way he has played his hand, love reading about him, but that little fucker should burn. Don't like him and that kingdom-sized chip on his shoulder.

[Lady Fevre Dream]

Amen. :drool:

Do you think the leeches really drained his passions? I don't know... if there's really Ice Magic involved it's probably true... but if Roose is a normal human don't you think he was always like that? It's a very fun explanation though. I always loved that touch about the character: the bloodletting, the humorism theory. There's other instances that shows their medicine is not advanced enough to comprehend some phenomena that exists in our world, like Reek's disease is a real thing but all the maester could come with was that the gods made him stink because his soul was deteriorating. But I also would love more insight about Roose and his backstory. Also I would like to know more about his ancestors. Dunk and Egg need to go North soon. Maybe they will make contact with some Boltons.

A question: based on your name I'm supposing you read Fevre Dream. If so, is it true that the antagonist vampire in the story has some similarities with Roose? Someone said that in a thread and I will probably buy the book.

I like Lady Stoneheart too.

Let me try and address all the issues you've raised, but first.......let me just drool over Roose. :drool: I love TVRoose, too. :wub: He needs to get some of that great dialogue in the books. With the leeches, I'm not sure it's that the leeches themselves work (at draining his passions and 'bad blood' as he calls it), I think it really is just a matter of his inner will. He's DECIDED to rule his passions, and he does. I think he thinks that leeches, as well as his prunes, help keep him physically healthy and well, add to his creep mystique, I'm sure that's part of it, too. But, I think it's a force of will, the controlling of his passions but either way, whether he thinks the leeches help or he just uses them for health reasons (or both, and it's an insurance policy), I think it's just a conscious decision. The emphasis he puts on the bad blood, etc., just makes me wonder if and what was in his past, was he passionate about something and it got him into trouble. With the Awesomeness that is Roose, he's just decided on what his personality should be, hence.....it IS.

I do think there is something to OG Reek and the aroma, and it's a nod to disease or disorders that they couldn't figure out back then, perhaps. I agree, alot of it is about where medicine was in the medieval world. I guess too, it's a nice touch to give the reek syndrome to someone whose bad odor should warn the world he is coming. I'm not any type of medical expert, but I do know there issues that can cause strange body aromas, and of course, how medieval society went about thinking the physical could show symptoms of the soul, the inner person, etc.

In answer to the Fevre Dream question, yes I read it and I can see, a little, how the equation for the character could be made to Roose, his supposed unfeelingness, all the blood and passion and feeling drained from him, etc. The main protagonist is an ancient vampire who puts on a charming, handsome face to the world, but as the story goes they realize it's a beast underneath, that feels nothing, cares about nothing, and just like a wild animal on instinct...........will strive to survive. With the vampire Julian from FD, I can see how some would think the vampire with nothing left to him on the inside, being just a soul-less beast who will struggle for survival instinctually when threatened.......I suppose could sound similar to Bolton, but having read both, I don't see it. The description of dead inside might superfically fit, but Julian the Beast lived for thousands upon thousands upon thousands of years, you could see how even a vampire would get tired. I don't think Roose is THAT old, and that tired, and I do see lots of differences. Yes, that description can sound close, but I do see lots of differences.

I hope that helped!!

ETA: I read Fevre Dream in my teens, and have read it many times. So, I know Julian well, but inspite of that dead inside thing, I can't say as I see the similarity, I don't see a beast in Roose that lies underneath and will fight to survive like a wild animal when threatened and that is just the start. I fell in love with steamboats on the Mississippi and poetry by Bryon and Shelley from that book, too.

[Lady Fevre Dream]

I imagine that is only possible if a person hates the Starks.

That's why I was trying to think of someone neutral and more universally loved, I came up short, LOL

[The Traveler]

Tywin, I love how he solved things with the castamere massacre :blush:. Bob and Theon, well I don't love the bad as for Tywin, but the wrong they did was not such a big deal IMO.

[Ned Snow]

I'm a big fan of the Hound, but in real life I wouldn't want to be anywhere near the guy.

[Alistair's Pantaloons]

I hate almost all the characters who are still alive in this series, and hated some of those who are already dead. I love Jon and the Direwolves, even Shaggy. Maybe I should dislike Shaggy because he is a wild beast but I don't.

[King Brandon Ice Eyes]

Let me try and address all the issues you've raised, but first.......let me just drool over Roose. :drool: I love TVRoose, too. :wub: He needs to get some of that great dialogue in the books. With the leeches, I'm not sure it's that the leeches themselves work (at draining his passions and 'bad blood' as he calls it), I think it really is just a matter of his inner will. He's DECIDED to rule his passions, and he does. I think he thinks that leeches, as well as his prunes, help keep him physically healthy and well, add to his creep mystique, I'm sure that's part of it, too. But, I think it's a force of will, the controlling of his passions but either way, whether he thinks the leeches help or he just uses them for health reasons (or both, and it's an insurance policy), I think it's just a conscious decision. The emphasis he puts on the bad blood, etc., just makes me wonder if and what was in his past, was he passionate about something and it got him into trouble. With the Awesomeness that is Roose, he's just decided on what his personality should be, hence.....it IS.

I do think there is something to OG Reek and the aroma, and it's a nod to disease or disorders that they couldn't figure out back then, perhaps. I agree, alot of it is about where medicine was in the medieval world. I guess too, it's a nice touch to give the reek syndrome to someone whose bad odor should warn the world he is coming. I'm not any type of medical expert, but I do know there issues that can cause strange body aromas, and of course, how medieval society went about thinking the physical could show symptoms of the soul, the inner person, etc.

In answer to the Fevre Dream question, yes I read it and I can see, a little, how the equation for the character could be made to Roose, his supposed unfeelingness, all the blood and passion and feeling drained from him, etc. The main protagonist is an ancient vampire who puts on a charming, handsome face to the world, but as the story goes they realize it's a beast underneath, that feels nothing, cares about nothing, and just like a wild animal on instinct...........will strive to survive. With the vampire Julian from FD, I can see how some would think the vampire with nothing left to him on the inside, being just a soul-less beast who will struggle for survival instinctually when threatened.......I suppose could sound similar to Bolton, but having read both, I don't see it. The description of dead inside might superfically fit, but Julian the Beast lived for thousands upon thousands upon thousands of years, you could see how even a vampire would get tired. I don't think Roose is THAT old, and that tired, and I do see lots of differences. Yes, that description can sound close, but I do see lots of differences.

I hope that helped!!

ETA: I read Fevre Dream in my teens, and have read it many times. So, I know Julian well, but inspite of that dead inside thing, I can't say as I see the similarity, I don't see a beast in Roose that lies underneath and will fight to survive like a wild animal when threatened and that is just the start. I fell in love with steamboats on the Mississippi and poetry by Bryon and Shelley from that book, too.

Thank you very much. I really like the way you interpreted Roose's character.

Also thanks a lot for the insight about Fevre Dream. It helped very much. I will start looking in Amazon for the book. I already ordered Dreamsongs: A RRetrospective and just received Dangerous Women. I'm a little short in the money department :P but I'm really interested in the novel.

[Feliciano69]

I don't know, maybe I'm gonna get a virtual clout on the head, but I don't really think The Hound is supposed to be hated. He did turn out to be one of my favorite characters, too.

Well, we should hate him on the grounds that he brutally murdered an innocent boy :lol:

But alas...........he's one of my favorite characters as well.

[Lady Fevre Dream]

Thank you very much. I really like the way you interpreted Roose's character.

Also thanks a lot for the insight about Fevre Dream. It helped very much. I will start looking in Amazon for the book. I already ordered Dreamsongs: A RRetrospective and just received Dangerous Women. I'm a little short in the money department :P but I'm really interested in the novel.

I know how you feel, every time I want to go on a book buying spree, it seems I find other things that need to come first. Fevre Dream shows the start of the alternating POV and the propensity GRRM has for terrific nicknaming, too. Hairy Mike Dunne and Sour Billy Tipton come to mind. It's a nice quick read, and it made me really feel the love for the steamboats of the era, and one of my dreams is still to vacation in New Orleans someday and have a little cruise on one of the real ones. Myself, I'm working on finally getting started on some of the novellas soon, one or two for Christmas perhaps.

Because of the affection I had and still have for Fevre Dream, I've always tried to make sure I had a copy. The first one from my teens disappeared, so I've at times over the years have had paperbacks specially ordered, many years ago. Obviously, this was pre ASOIAF, now.......no special ordering required, LOL I wish I could give you one of my copies. I have an old yellowed paperback edition, with a loose last page (tucked away inside), and new copy I bought about a year ago, so I don't beat up the old one next time I take a peek at it. I hope you enjoy it.

Oh, on Lady Stoneheart, I feel bad for her. The idea of killing Podrick pisses me off, but I'm hoping that LS learns of her children alive, and finds peace. I think someone who loves her will have to put her out of her misery. Possibly Arya, or if not, Brienne?