Bakker XXI: Attack of the Maximum Fun-Fun Ultra Super Happy People

[Anatúrinbor]

On another topic, if Earwa is an anagram of Aware, what is Eanna an anagram of?

Could it be, Anane?

Anane is a fallen angel in Christian mythology, and appears in the first book of Enoch^[1]

[Serious Callers Only]

Anyone else thinks that the engineers from Inericon and like dunian-lite from a more catholic viewpoint? Obvious inspiration.

[WrathOfTinyKittens]

Edit 2: Here we go!

Trisk, I know. But she redeploys the Scylvendi Columns prior to this. WLW, nook version p. 223-224:

[Esmenet] had labored tirelessly since word of Iothiah's fall had reached her. Emergency sessions with Caxes Anthirul, her home Exalt-General, as well as the ever-irascible Werjau, Prime Nascenti of the Ministrate. Apparently activity along the Scylvendi frontier, which had surged in recent weeks, had now dwindled to nothing, a fact that at once heartened her, because of the redeployment it allowed, and troubled her. She had read The Annals, and though Casidas had died long before the Scylvendi sacked Cenei, she could not but recall throughout that reading how all the far-flung glory he described had been swept away by the People of War.

[....]

Though her generals had eyes only for the prospect of avenging their fellows in Shigek, she knew stripping the Scylvendi frontier was a risk - a mad risk. Despite denuding the Empire otherwise, Kellhus had left three crack Columns to guard the Gap, and for no small reason.

But Fanayal had left her no choice. The plan was to garrison Gedea as best they could while the Imperial Army of the West assembled at Asgilioch. Hinnereth could be supplied by sea. General Anthirule assured her that they would have five full Columns ready to retake Shigek by summer's end.

There isn't any other mention of it. So the setup is the stripping of the garrisons along that frontier plus the suspicious surge and then total cessation of raiding.

It also makes one wonder how Fanayal managed to get from Shigek to Momemn when there should have been at least three full Columns already assembled at Asgilioch.

[Francis Buck]

Edit 2: Here we go!

Trisk, I know. But she redeploys the Scylvendi Columns prior to this. WLW, nook version p. 223-224:

There isn't any other mention of it. So the setup is the stripping of the garrisons along that frontier plus the suspicious surge and then total cessation of raiding.

It also makes one wonder how Fanayal managed to get from Shigek to Momemn when there should have been at least three full Columns already assembled at Asgilioch.

This is very interesting, not something I'd noticed before at all. I'm not even quite sure what the implication is. Did the suspicious end to the raids occur because the Scylvendi were fleeing from the encroaching Fanim, or are they working in tandem (seems unlikely), or did the Scylvendi just happen to catch word of the Fanim's attack and withdrew in hopes of returning to reap some of the spoils of Momemn's fall?

Regardless, I just really hope the Scylvendi have a notable part to play in TUC or later. They're such an interesting race/culture, it would be neat to get another significant POV from them.

[WrathOfTinyKittens]

I suspect that the raiding surged when the Scylvendi realized that Kellhus and most of his armies were gone, then stopped to regroup in the face of strong garrisons. It's also possible that they know that Fanayal is marching against the Empire (remember that Cnaiur was pretty well-informed about events in the Nansurium, so they must keeps tabs on the situation there), so they are massing and waiting for their moment to strike.

Just a theory of course with very little to support it, but it makes sense to me.

Edit - That reminds me ... the whole company of Scions is dead, right? Left behind in the plains by Sorweel and Zsoronga? Did we ever see anything else from them?

[Kalbear]

I think it's quite clear that the Fanim simply deployed only their elite paratrooper drummer corps.

[Kalbear]

The next no god will sound like

CAN YOU DIG IT

SUCKAS

CAN YOU DIG IT

[Wise Fool]

The No-God is the Internet.

*Sranc flashmob*

LOL WAT DO U SEE

ROFL

[yuansikay]

Perhaps Fanayal did ally with the Scylvendi and passed through the steppes? It could possibly explain how he came that near to Momemn given that the capital is very close to the steppes and the border here is unguarded.

[Sci-2]

Perhaps Fanayal did ally with the Scylvendi and passed through the steppes? It could possibly explain how he came that near to Momemn given that the capital is very close to the steppes and the border here is unguarded.

He might have promised them plunder but the closest chieftain would either have to know his son was dead or would have to not care.

It's hard for me to see why the Scylvendi should remain a major threat. Couldn't Kellhus send School Men into the Steppes to cull their male adults over and over again?

[yuansikay]

And why did they pose such a great threat before Kiyuth? This is something I don't really get. As far as I remember, they're a horde of horsemen who don't wear any armor (except for trophies worn by their chieftains), have no sorcerers and aren't that numerous. The Fanim are the same horde of horsemen with no armor (except for padiraja's guards), but their numbers are enormous and they have Cishaurim. And still the Fanim get massacred in every pitched battle against the Inrithi knights. Couldn't the Inrithi do the same with the Scylvendi to get rid of this pain in the ass at some point in history?

[Maithanet]

I think it's the deeply ingrained warrior culture (and they do have chorae). I am no great student of history, but I think that's kind of like asking why the Huns for the Mongols were a threat.

And they are well led for the most part. When Cnauir is trying to convince the other generals not to attack at Kiyuth, he comments that the Fanim were too strong to take on in a pitched battle initially, and had to be drawn in, whittled away and then finally destroyed. In addition, when Cnauir is observing the Holy War, he found the number of men involved totally staggering. It gives the impression that time may be up for Scylvendi, that their warrior culture may have been surpassed by the increasing numbers of thier foes (both Inrithi and Fanim).

[Castel]

And why did they pose such a great threat before Kiyuth? This is something I don't really get. As far as I remember, they're a horde of horsemen who don't wear any armor (except for trophies worn by their chieftains), have no sorcerers and aren't that numerous. The Fanim are the same horde of horsemen with no armor (except for padiraja's guards), but their numbers are enormous and they have Cishaurim. And still the Fanim get massacred in every pitched battle against the Inrithi knights. Couldn't the Inrithi do the same with the Scylvendi to get rid of this pain in the ass at some point in history?

I suppose it's their speed and ability to raid and move at will plus the warrior culture Trisk mentioned. Most of them are a horsemen,they can all fight. They're faster and more agile than knights, can lead them into ambushes (especially since any counter attack will take place on their territory) and, during the brief period where they actually fight, they're united and don't have to worry about anything else, unlike the Nansur.

Before someone like Maithanet came and united the Inrithi there might not have been that great a number of knights on the field at the time either.

He might have promised them plunder but the closest chieftain would either have to know his son was dead or would have to not care.

It's hard for me to see why the Scylvendi should remain a major threat. Couldn't Kellhus send School Men into the Steppes to cull their male adults over and over again?

I wonder just how many of the Chorae bowmen died at Kiyuth. Because all I recall was it being said that Conphas drove them off. If they're still around it may not be worth it. If not...they're totally fucked. Might as well drop the act really. Strange to think that a culture can be sent into a slow death spiral because they lost that one weapon but c'est la vie.

It gives the impression that time may be up for Scylvendi, that their warrior culture may have been surpassed by the increasing numbers of thier foes (both Inrithi and Fanim).

I reckon they've always been heavily outnumbered. Before they simply had two foes they could comfortably beat on. Now, everyone has a stake in the Nansur and Fanim lands.

[Gaston de Foix]

How are any Nonmen "Intact"? Alright, Nil'giccas is much much older than the Womb Plague and there must be Nonmen around who were born just before, but surely they would have gone crazy in the intervening time as well?

[yuansikay]

RSB once mentioned (don't remember where) that the Nonmen of Ishterebinth have been inventing magical and non magical means to preserve their sanity for all these years. So, we'll definitely learn more about the Intact from TUC.

[WrathOfTinyKittens]

Superior brains, intentional closeting of selves to limit new memories, some kind of meditation techniques to purge old memories, and so on ... there's no way to know. It could be chance or there may be a forthcoming explanation.

The Scylvendi are dangerous because they are the People of War, as pointed out. Their whole culture is built around warfare, much like the Mongols - they are more flexible, more agile, and better fighters than their opponents. The Mongols destroyed armies much larger than themselves through their tactics, which Cnaiur aludes to.

As for numbers, there were apparently thousands, maybe tens of thousands, of Scylvendi at Kiyuth. Impossible to know how many or how many died. But even there Cnaiur notes that it is foolish to attack the Nansur on ground of their choosing, and prior to Zirkirta it is said that they harried and bled the Kianene army before finally finishing it off. So they were probably always outnumbered and likely fought cautiously in their campaigns aside from Kiyuth.

[Rhom]

Superior brains, intentional closeting of selves to limit new memories, some kind of meditation techniques to purge old memories, and so on ... there's no way to know. It could be chance or there may be a forthcoming explanation.

Could Kellhus "scrape the parchment of their soul" (or whatever it was that he did to Esmi to make her forget her possession) and remove memories to restore sanity?

[Sci-2]

Could Kellhus "scrape the parchment of their soul" (or whatever it was that he did to Esmi to make her forget her possession) and remove memories to restore sanity?

Hmmm....this would leave people who barely had memories at all. Would the Nonmen choose to become babes to be lead around by a human?

I doubt it.

[Castel]

I thought that was more of a block under hynosis -deceptive language choices aside- than an actual removal of memory?

[lokisnow]

Maith - We have no evidence whatsoever that Mek helped recover the Heron Spear, right? That's just some theory someone just threw out?

well not really evidence, but it took what, two thousand years for thousands of cunoroi to thoroughly search, secure and purge the ark, once they gained entrance? And Seswatha and Nau Cayuti steal into the ark for a very short period and come out with the Spear? Sounds like they knew where it was.

Additionally, presumably Mekeritrig let Seswatha down from the wall, after torturing him there. Unless of course Seswatha on the walls of Dagliash is a complete fabrication (to hide his alliance with Mekeritrig) since Akka revisits this dream and there is no seswatha on the wall, iirc. If Mekertrig allied with Seswatha for a time (regardless of any involvement in the heron spear) then he would have rode against the No God as well.

And additionally, look to Cleric's responses to Mimara and Achamian, he plans on turning against them because it will be MEMORABLE. What could be more memorable to Mekeritrig than turning against a plan he helped author for millenia? Betrayal seems to be writ into being an erratic, I do not think Bakker made a mistake by having him say he rode for and against the No God.

Perhaps this is even the KEY to what really happened. the dream of being tortured on the walls of Dagliash is a lie. The dream of Anaxophus firing the heron spear and destroying the no god is a lie. These lies are meant to protect the MOLE, meant to protect Mekeritrig, so that the Consult does not know it was an inside job. Rather than Anaxophus firing the heron spear, Mekeritrig triggered the destruction of the No God by some means as yet unknown to us.

Why protect the mole? Because Seswatha is seemingly the only one who does not think war is over after the destruction of the No God. He thinks they've merely resisted the sally, that suggests that Mek told him they could stop the No God for a time, but it would not be a complete destruction. they would have to prepare for the response, a response millenia in the making as well.