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Mithras

Dany's Dragonriders

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 Now that she has bonded with Drogon, her hold on the other two dragons will probably be fragile. She can't ride and control all three of them at once, I think her story has been pointing that out.

Yeah she needs two more riders in SB, or those dragons are not going anywhere.

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Great post and I agree 100% that Tyrion is one of the heads of the Dragon and will ride Viserion but I do not agree that Victarion will ride Rhaegal. Victarion isn't important enough to bigger story, he will more or less be dead when he arrives in Meereen, he's dying but doesn't know it, and Moqorro is using him to get to Dany. Moqorro hasn't told him what he truly sees in the fires, he's kept it vague. 

Jon Snow will ride Rhaegal. The three heads of the Dragon will be the three main characters from the start of the story. Vicatarion only comes into the story from A feast for crows. I know some people think Bran will warg one of the dragons but I think if he was to warg it'll be an ice dragon. 

Drogon - Daenerys

Rhaegal - Jon

Viserion - Tyrion

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Dany's situation and potential relationship with her dragons will be different from that of Rhaenyra.  Rhaenyra was just another Targaryen who had the genes that allowed her to bond with dragons.  Daenerys is much more than just Targaryen.  She is the Mother of Dragons, Atzor Ahai, the Unburnt, the closest being to a god in this story.   In short, I do not think she needs two others to ride Rhaegal and Viserion.  Dany already bonded with Drogon.  Drogon is the Alpha, the Uber Dragon.   The other two will follow his lead. 

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I totally agree about Tyrion nursing Viserion back to health after Viserion is struck down outside Meereen. But I think Brown Ben will be the beneficiary. 

As to Rhaegal... well I think Aegon has to be Rhaegal's rider eventually, but how to get there? I don't  have any confidence in that dragon horn. And I think Victarion will die in the Dothraki Sea. 

How bout this... Daario? He has the blue eyes that look almost purple, no? Now let's say Daenerys comes to Westeros to her "nephew's" aid as Tyrion foretold. Then, Illyrio, Daemon Blackfyre's heir and Aegon's true father, betrays Daenerys for blood. And Tyrion betrays Daenerys for all the gold of Casterly Rock and those promissory notes he will one day rue. And Aegon, who grows resentful and jealous of Daario will betray Daenerys for love. 

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13 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

I totally agree about Tyrion nursing Viserion back to health after Viserion is struck down outside Meereen. But I think Brown Ben will be the beneficiary. 

As to Rhaegal... well I think Aegon has to be Rhaegal's rider eventually, but how to get there? I don't  have any confidence in that dragon horn. And I think Victarion will die in the Dothraki Sea. 

How bout this... Daario? He has the blue eyes that look almost purple, no? Now let's say Daenerys comes to Westeros to her "nephew's" aid as Tyrion foretold. Then, Illyrio, Daemon Blackfyre's heir and Aegon's true father, betrays Daenerys for blood. And Tyrion betrays Daenerys for all the gold of Casterly Rock and those promissory notes he will one day rue. And Aegon, who grows resentful and jealous of Daario will betray Daenerys for love. 

Should those things come to pass, Drogon would roast those scumbags.  Drogon is loyal to Dany.  That has been proven time and time again.  Should that ugly little stump betray his only hope of redemption, he would deserve to get roasted slowly over the course of seven days.  Think slow-cooked pit barbecue.

Tyrion committed a heinous act when he murdered his father.  The only redemption for him is to serve Daenerys.  She has a cause worthy of his submission and his service.  She is that "something greater than yourself" that Jorah spoke of in the show.  She is the way for two disgraced men to find redemption.

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On 7/31/2015 at 0:04 PM, King Viserys Targaryen IV said:

I personally think Rhaegal dies. Jom will mount a dragon but it wont be one of Daenery's dragons. His will be older and larger.

Cannibal?

On 7/31/2015 at 0:16 PM, Drogonthedread said:


I didnt see that at all

i saw rhaegal and viserian looking for their mother when quentyn tried to steel them

i believed in jon riding rhaegal and tyrion viserian but after rereading the books again and again ..i dont think anyone will ride them other than dany

both books and show are full of dany and her dragons as three headed dragon symbolism

That's a good point but...Dany herself takes the three dragons as meaning that there are two men she can trust, hence she expects to be part of a trio in some way. May not mean that the two men she's expecting will be dragonriders, but it is still possible.

While I'd love to see Dany be the one person able to break the one-rider-one-dragon rule, I'm not sure Drogon will be okay with that. We've never gotten any information on why a single person couldn't ride two dragons concurrently. Is it a bonding issue? Or is it a jealousy issue on the part of the dragons? Could totally see Drogon getting angry if he sees Rhaegal crusing around with Dany on his back.

An another note...does anyone think there are parallels between who was sacrificed and the dragons' temperaments?  Drogon being very protective of Dany correlates well to Drogo. Viserion is like the baby of the bunch, and could perhaps be considered either Rhaego or the horse that Dany had put in the pyre. Rhaegal is the unpredictable one who's a bit emo, which could have something to do with Mirri Maz Duur's feelings/attitude/spunky nature...  Not that I think this is earth-shatteringly important but it could play into who else might ride dragons.  Viserion being the baby would naturally bond with anyone who takes care of him, makes him feel better, maybe sings him a lullaby. It will take someone with a very strong will to earn Rhaegal's respect though. Of course this can be true without any reincarnation-like element to the dragons.  But Drogon as an incarnation of Drogo could be the necessary sacrifice Dany has to make if she is Azor Ahai Reborn.

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On 3/11/2016 at 1:55 PM, Lady Blizzardborn said:

Cannibal?

That's a good point but...Dany herself takes the three dragons as meaning that there are two men she can trust, hence she expects to be part of a trio in some way. May not mean that the two men she's expecting will be dragonriders, but it is still possible.

While I'd love to see Dany be the one person able to break the one-rider-one-dragon rule, I'm not sure Drogon will be okay with that. We've never gotten any information on why a single person couldn't ride two dragons concurrently. Is it a bonding issue? Or is it a jealousy issue on the part of the dragons? Could totally see Drogon getting angry if he sees Rhaegal crusing around with Dany on his back.

An another note...does anyone think there are parallels between who was sacrificed and the dragons' temperaments?  Drogon being very protective of Dany correlates well to Drogo. Viserion is like the baby of the bunch, and could perhaps be considered either Rhaego or the horse that Dany had put in the pyre. Rhaegal is the unpredictable one who's a bit emo, which could have something to do with Mirri Maz Duur's feelings/attitude/spunky nature...  Not that I think this is earth-shatteringly important but it could play into who else might ride dragons.  Viserion being the baby would naturally bond with anyone who takes care of him, makes him feel better, maybe sings him a lullaby. It will take someone with a very strong will to earn Rhaegal's respect though. Of course this can be true without any reincarnation-like element to the dragons.  But Drogon as an incarnation of Drogo could be the necessary sacrifice Dany has to make if she is Azor Ahai Reborn.

Dany already made the sacrifice and "paid" for her dragons.  No additional payments are required.  She is Azor Ahai, she has woken dragons from stone.  It's done.

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On 3/14/2016 at 9:42 AM, Lame Lothar Frey said:

Dany already made the sacrifice and "paid" for her dragons.  No additional payments are required.  She is Azor Ahai, she has woken dragons from stone.  It's done.

Maybe. It's been left vague for a reason. That interpretation works fine if the dragons themselves are equal to Lightbringer, but if they aren't, then another sacrifice may be required.

On 3/14/2016 at 0:05 PM, King Viserys Targaryen IV said:

I think that it will be the mud brown dragon Sheepstealer instead of another black dragon like Cannibal.

But, Cannibal is a possibility.

Cannibal would be way old (most say he should be dead by now) but if he is still living, he'd be massive, and it would be a HUGE deal for Jon or anyone else to ride him. Did any of the dragonseeds attempt taming Cannibal in TPatQ? I haven't read that one yet.

Where would the mud-brown dragon be hiding? Are there hints for it that I've missed?  If the thing Summer saw at Winterfell was a dragon it should be grey or white. But, it could have been something else, or a trick of the light, and there were rumors in Westeros that one of the Targ dragons laid a clutch of eggs while at Winterfell, so if one of them hatched then more than one could have hatched. 

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39 minutes ago, Lady Blizzardborn said:

Cannibal would be way old (most say he should be dead by now) but if he is still living, he'd be massive, and it would be a HUGE deal for Jon or anyone else to ride him. Did any of the dragonseeds attempt taming Cannibal in TPatQ? I haven't read that one yet.

Where would the mud-brown dragon be hiding? Are there hints for it that I've missed?  If the thing Summer saw at Winterfell was a dragon it should be grey or white. But, it could have been something else, or a trick of the light, and there were rumors in Westeros that one of the Targ dragons laid a clutch of eggs while at Winterfell, so if one of them hatched then more than one could have hatched. 

First, the age of what dragons can grow to is suspect becasue there is a good possibility that all of the dragons were slowing being poisoned/ killed off by the Maesters. So we really dont know how old they can get, or what happens when they get @ 300 years old.

They did tried to tame Cannibal but it did not work

"Dragons are not horses. They do not easily accept men upon their backs, and when angered or threatened, they attack. Sixteen men lost their lives during an attempt to become dragonriders. Three times that number were burned or maimed. Steffon Darklyn was burned to death whilst attempting to mount the dragon Seasmoke. Lord Gormon Massey suffered the same fate when approaching Vermithor. A man called Silver Denys, whose hair and eyes lent credence to his claim to be a bastard son of King Maegor the Cruel, had an arm torn off by Sheepstealer. As his sons struggled to staunch the wound, the Cannibal descended on them, drove off Sheepstealer, and devoured father and sons alike."

 

My guess is that Sheepstealer is hiding in a volcano in Skaggos (Stone in the old tongue), so Jon can wake the dragon from Stone.

 

The reason I believe it is Sheepstealer is because of this line, when Sam is carrying books on Targaryen linage to show Jon:

"He had to get down on his knees to gather up the books he'd dropped. I should not have brought so many, he told himself as he brushed the dirt off Colloquo Votar's Jade Compendium, a thick volume of tales and legends from the east that Maester Aemon had commanded him to find. The book appeared undamaged. Maester Thomax's Dragonkin, Being a History of House Targaryen from Exile to Apotheosis, with a Consideration of the Life and Death of Dragons had not been so fortunate. It had come open as it fell, and a few pages had gotten muddy, including one with a rather nice picture of Balerion the Black Dread done in colored inks"

 

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27 minutes ago, King Viserys Targaryen IV said:

The reason I believe it is Sheepstealer is because of this line, when Sam is carrying books on Targaryen linage to show Jon:

"He had to get down on his knees to gather up the books he'd dropped. I should not have brought so many, he told himself as he brushed the dirt off Colloquo Votar's Jade Compendium, a thick volume of tales and legends from the east that Maester Aemon had commanded him to find. The book appeared undamaged. Maester Thomax's Dragonkin, Being a History of House Targaryen from Exile to Apotheosis, with a Consideration of the Life and Death of Dragons had not been so fortunate. It had come open as it fell, and a few pages had gotten muddy, including one with a rather nice picture of Balerion the Black Dread done in colored inks"

What color is the mud at Castle Black? Not all mud is brown.

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27 minutes ago, Raisin' Bran said:

What color is the mud at Castle Black? Not all mud is brown.

With out a qualifier saying that the mud that covered the page was a red mud mud or a black mud, and Sheepstealer being described as being mud brown, I would say that brown is the most common mud and the color that GRRM was alluding to in the quote.

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23 minutes ago, King Viserys Targaryen IV said:

With out a qualifier saying that the mud that covered the page was a red mud mud or a black mud, and Sheepstealer being described as being mud brown, I would say that brown is the most common mud and the color that GRRM was alluding to in the quote.

Yeah I was looking for any clue as to what color the soil might be at Castle Black, or even beyond. The only color I got was the black rot under the red weirwood leaves in the weirwood grove, half a league north of The Wall. Not quite what I was looking for.

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22 hours ago, King Viserys Targaryen IV said:

First, the age of what dragons can grow to is suspect becasue there is a good possibility that all of the dragons were slowing being poisoned/ killed off by the Maesters. So we really dont know how old they can get, or what happens when they get @ 300 years old.

They did tried to tame Cannibal but it did not work

"Dragons are not horses. They do not easily accept men upon their backs, and when angered or threatened, they attack. Sixteen men lost their lives during an attempt to become dragonriders. Three times that number were burned or maimed. Steffon Darklyn was burned to death whilst attempting to mount the dragon Seasmoke. Lord Gormon Massey suffered the same fate when approaching Vermithor. A man called Silver Denys, whose hair and eyes lent credence to his claim to be a bastard son of King Maegor the Cruel, had an arm torn off by Sheepstealer. As his sons struggled to staunch the wound, the Cannibal descended on them, drove off Sheepstealer, and devoured father and sons alike."

 

My guess is that Sheepstealer is hiding in a volcano in Skaggos (Stone in the old tongue), so Jon can wake the dragon from Stone.

 

The reason I believe it is Sheepstealer is because of this line, when Sam is carrying books on Targaryen linage to show Jon:

"He had to get down on his knees to gather up the books he'd dropped. I should not have brought so many, he told himself as he brushed the dirt off Colloquo Votar's Jade Compendium, a thick volume of tales and legends from the east that Maester Aemon had commanded him to find. The book appeared undamaged. Maester Thomax's Dragonkin, Being a History of House Targaryen from Exile to Apotheosis, with a Consideration of the Life and Death of Dragons had not been so fortunate. It had come open as it fell, and a few pages had gotten muddy, including one with a rather nice picture of Balerion the Black Dread done in colored inks"

 

Fair point but at what point would the maesters have begun poisoning the dragons? Seems like they wouldn't have come up with that right off the bat, and it would have taken time to infiltrate the Targaryen regime and trust enough to gain access to the dragons. And they might have had trouble finding volunteers (in my head: "Here dragon, dragon. N-n-nice dragon. Please don't eat me!).  I'm thinking Maegor's reign might have been a good place for a tipping point. And Balerion was alive then, so if that was when the maesters decided dragons were a problem, you might well be right that we don't know how long a dragon would naturally live. They still might not have been able to start any poisoning until after Maegor's death, but do we even know how old Balerion was at the time of the Conquest? He was awfully big, and that couldn't have been solely because he hadn't been enclosed or denied food.

Great potential catch on the mud, and the waking dragons from stone!  If that's how it goes, I will certainly put on a hat so that I might tip it in your direction. :cheers:  Interesting but probably completely unrelated side note: check out the arms for House Crowl of Skagos. Nice colors there, huh?

If dragonseeds couldn't ride Cannibal, and Jon Snow could...that would be epic!  Granted Sheepstealer would still be cool. Just not quite as cool as son-of-Rhaegar-tames-wild-killer-beast-no-one-could-ride-before. Though at this point, Sheepstealer could be much bigger than Drogon is, and maybe even bigger than Balerion was, and he who has the biggest dragon wins.

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44 minutes ago, Lady Blizzardborn said:

Fair point but at what point would the maesters have begun poisoning the dragons? Seems like they wouldn't have come up with that right off the bat, and it would have taken time to infiltrate the Targaryen regime and trust enough to gain access to the dragons. And they might have had trouble finding volunteers (in my head: "Here dragon, dragon. N-n-nice dragon. Please don't eat me!).  I'm thinking Maegor's reign might have been a good place for a tipping point. And Balerion was alive then, so if that was when the maesters decided dragons were a problem, you might well be right that we don't know how long a dragon would naturally live. They still might not have been able to start any poisoning until after Maegor's death, but do we even know how old Balerion was at the time of the Conquest? He was awfully big, and that couldn't have been solely because he hadn't been enclosed or denied food.

Great potential catch on the mud, and the waking dragons from stone!  If that's how it goes, I will certainly put on a hat so that I might tip it in your direction. :cheers:  Interesting but probably completely unrelated side note: check out the arms for House Crowl of Skagos. Nice colors there, huh?

If dragonseeds couldn't ride Cannibal, and Jon Snow could...that would be epic!  Granted Sheepstealer would still be cool. Just not quite as cool as son-of-Rhaegar-tames-wild-killer-beast-no-one-could-ride-before. Though at this point, Sheepstealer could be much bigger than Drogon is, and maybe even bigger than Balerion was, and he who has the biggest dragon wins.

Another reason that I dont think that it will be Cannibal is that Cannibal is a black dragon, just like Drogon.

GRRM really has an affinity with certain colors and having two dragon out of three or four being the same color does not seem like some thing he would do.

Now that is just a gut feeling, and certainly not something that I can say is 100%.

 

But, yes both dragons would be huge compared to Daenery's dragons and maybe larger than Balerion the Black Dread.

 

Another thing to contemplate would be that Jon would not know the name of this dragon. Maybe if he has Sam with him they would know, but I doubt Sam comes back that soon. So most likely this dragon would get a new name and only will be alluded to as the previous wild dragons in the text as clues.

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5 hours ago, King Viserys Targaryen IV said:

<snip

Another thing to contemplate would be that Jon would not know the name of this dragon. Maybe if he has Sam with him they would know, but I doubt Sam comes back that soon. So most likely this dragon would get a new name and only will be alluded to as the previous wild dragons in the text as clues.

So if it turns out to be Sheepstealer we'll get the color and that the dragon has a taste for mutton. Works for me.

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I think one of them will be aegon, since he claims to be a targaryen, and maybe Jon snow later down the line if it turns out that he is rhaegar and Lyanna's son, this way daenarys mirrors aegon the conqueror and his two sister wives.

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