Jump to content

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Stubby

Small Questions v 10022

Recommended Posts

Is it stated anywhere in the text that greyscale can start on the inside? Or that the affliction can be delayed?

“How long must I continue to torture myself? When will we be certain that I’m clean?”

“Truly?” said the Halfmaester. “Never. You swallowed half the river. You may be going grey even now, turning to stone from inside out, starting with your heart and lungs. If so, pricking your toes and bathing in vinegar will not save you. When you’re done, come have some broth.”

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is it stated anywhere in the text that greyscale can start on the inside? Or that the affliction can be delayed?

Lost Melnibonean, on 20 Jan 2014 - 9:09 PM, said:snapback.png

Is it stated anywhere in the text that greyscale can start on the inside? Or that the affliction can be delayed?

Yes, Haldon to Tyrion when first describing the disease after the Sorrows. I'll dig out the quote

Quote

"Never. You swallowed half the river. You may be going grey even now, turning to stone from the inside out, starting with your heart and lungs. If so,pricking your toes and fingers will not save you."

Bolded is mine, for relevance to the foreshadowing in question

Ninja'd by RumHam :ninja: :bang:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lost Melnibonean, on 20 Jan 2014 - 9:09 PM, said:snapback.png

Yes, Haldon to Tyrion when first describing the disease after the Sorrows. I'll dig out the quote

Quote

"Never. You swallowed half the river. You may be going grey even now, turning to stone from the inside out, starting with your heart and lungs. If so,pricking your toes and fingers will not save you."

Bolded is mine, for relevance to the foreshadowing in question

Ninja'd by RumHam :ninja: :bang:

Which could fit nicely with Tyrion saying several times "My mouth will be the death of me", as well as with the prophecy of a dead man on a ship with grey lips... Hm...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, that could be it! I can't think of anything else that involved Aerys ordering the murders of children...

i remember Barristan thinking that he asked Arys to spare Dontos life(he was still a child ) after duskendale but i m not 100% sure

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i remember Barristan thinking that he asked Arys to spare Dontos life(he was still a child ) after duskendale but i m not 100% sure

Yes, that is true, but the other children of the Hollard and Darklyn houses were killed, IIRC. The entire families were murdered, with the exception of Dontos. There were bound to be children amongst those people.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes, that is true, but the other children of the Hollard and Darklyn houses were killed, IIRC. The entire families were murdered, with the exception of Dontos. There were bound to be children amongst those people.

It still sounds like a stretch though, unless maybe that is one of those things that GRRM wrote before he had all the backstory thought out. Didn't Aerys spare the youngest member of Brandon's party?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It still sounds like a stretch though, unless maybe that is one of those things that GRRM wrote before he had all the backstory thought out. Didn't Aerys spare the youngest member of Brandon's party?

ETA: we know that he spared Brandon's squire Ethan Glover.

I think we are in mysteryland with the 200 finest Northerners that went south with Lord Rickard and possibly Brandon Stark and where they ended up. There's no exact explanation. There's Brandon's business in the South he is going to attend after he leaves Riverrun. We are not supposed to know what that was.

200 of the best men going desaparicidos without a song for them is utterly strange. I feel that I am led to believe, they must have somhow ended up in the dungeons under the Red Keep. Still there should be a story as to how that was accomplished.

Then Jaime tells us that mad king Aerys repeatedly burned men. We know of Lord Rickard and later former Hand Lord Chelsted being burnt. We also know that with Lord Rickard, Brandon Stark, and both Arryns were killed.

So maybe Aerys had his pyromancers burn any one of the others every day of Robert's Rebellion?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

snip

So maybe Aerys had his pyromancers burn any one of the others every day of Robert's Rebellion?

It has to be something like that, that we just aren't aware of yet because I just went through Ned's chapters and the only mention of children or kids being killed is that one statement and the rest is in regards to what Tywin did. As much as Ned despises what Tywin did it just seems like if Aerys was doing the same thing someone would have at least acknowledged it somewhere(it would make for great anti-Targ propaganda). But I guess we are verging dangerously out of SQ territory. Thanks for everybody's help though, at least now I know it isn't just something I forgot. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ETA: we know that he spared Brandon's squire Ethan Glover.

I think we are in mysteryland with the 200 finest Northerners that went south with Lord Rickard and possibly Brandon Stark and where they ended up. There's no exact explanation. There's Brandon's business in the South he is going to attend after he leaves Riverrun. We are not supposed to know what that was.

200 of the best men going desaparicidos without a song for them is utterly strange. I feel that I am led to believe, they must have somhow ended up in the dungeons under the Red Keep. Still there should be a story as to how that was accomplished.

Then Jaime tells us that mad king Aerys repeatedly burned men. We know of Lord Rickard and later former Hand Lord Chelsted being burnt. We also know that with Lord Rickard, Brandon Stark, and both Arryns were killed.

So maybe Aerys had his pyromancers burn any one of the others every day of Robert's Rebellion?

But it is unknown if Ethan Glover was the youngest member. He would not have counted as a child though, since he accompanied Ned to ToJ, and I doubt that Ned would bring a child to the fight over his sister :p

Bran mentions that Rickard Stark went south with 200 of his best men, and none of them returned north. So I think it's safe to say that they all died in KL. Also, as to Brandons business after leaving Riverrun, there is nothing that indicates that he went south. The betrothal had just been announced, and Brandon spoke to Babrey about it. Now of course it is unknow whether or not this happened after the announcement, but it most likely is. Barbrey mentions that her father had hoped to marry her off to Ned after the betrothal of Brandon was announced, and when that didn't work, she was married to Lord Dustin. Had Barbrey known about the betrothal before, she would most likely have told her father, so that they could start planning her betrothal to some other highborn (like Ned).

As to the 200 men Rickard brought south with him, they most certainly all died, though whether it was during trials (which I doubt, since only the highborns received those IIRC), or if they first spend some time in the dungeons, who knows?

It's possible that some of them were burned, but most likely, that treatment was saved for the more special cases (like Rickard, or Chelsted). The cooks that might have come along, or the boys who looked after the horses for Rickard and his men, they might have died by execution.

Which brings me to another idea. Isn't it normal for younger boys to look after the horses and such? Perhaps Ned meant those children (as well as others).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

snip

Seems like Jaime would have mentioned it as well, during his confession with Brienne. I'll look through his chapters when I get home from work.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Rhaenys;

I think you are right that Brandon cant have gone South from Riverrun. A certain amount of.time must have passed if Barbrey Ryswell had to find out about the betrothal, proposed as a match for Ned and the find another suitor who will take her. We know she was married by the time Ned was Lord and marched his army South, so it seems like Brandon returned to the North after the betrothal was announced?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Rhaenys;

I think you are right that Brandon cant have gone South from Riverrun. A certain amount of.time must have passed if Barbrey Ryswell had to find out about the betrothal, proposed as a match for Ned and the find another suitor who will take her. We know she was married by the time Ned was Lord and marched his army South, so it seems like Brandon returned to the North after the betrothal was announced?

Exactly what I was thinking. But also, what business could Brandon possibly have in the south? There is absolutely nothing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Seems like Jaime would have mentioned it as well, during his confession with Brienne. I'll look through his chapters when I get home from work.

IIRC Jaime only mentions Brandon, his companions, the fathers of his companions, and Rickard. Not the rest of the 200 men.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Exactly what I was thinking. But also, what business could Brandon possibly have in the south? There is absolutely nothing.

Search for the Brandon+Ashara threads. Maybe he had a few wild oats left to sew. :) There's an SSM where GRRM gets asked that question:

Catelyn recalls that at Riverrun, Brandon told her that he would return soon for their wedding. Where was he going?

GRRM refused to answer where Brandon was going.

IIRC Jaime only mentions Brandon, his companions, the fathers of his companions, and Rickard. Not the rest of the 200 men.

Yeah, I haven't found anything yet in his either. Maybe I'll start a thread, to see if we get more input but it will have to wait for now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Exactly what I was thinking. But also, what business could Brandon possibly have in the south? There is absolutely nothing.

Ideas?

- If Ashara Dayne got pregnant at the Tourney at Harrenhal, that would be the time of birthing. Oh, just been :ninja: 'd

- If the very vague idea of Meera Reed being born at that time, he might have gone seen his pal Howland and his wife.

- He might have gone seeking out Barbrey Ryswell (later: Dustin) to apologize and amend for the broken betrothal.

It probably will be something we haven't been imagining.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Search for the Brandon+Ashara threads. Maybe he had a few wild oats left to sew. :) There's an SSM where GRRM gets asked that question:

Ideas?

- If Ashara Dayne got pregnant at the Tourney at Harrenhal, that would be the time of birthing. Oh, just been :ninja: 'd

The Tourney at Harrenhal happened not long enough before that for Ashara to be about to give birth. I have notes about the timeline for this, since I was working on this on my From Aegon's Birth until Lyanna's Death theory, which I, since today, have time for again :) I still have to type everything into a nice order which is logical to follow though :) But staye tuned, I'm going to upload it soon on that thread :)

Second thought, I'll also post the relevant part here when it's done.

- If the very vague idea of Meera Reed being born at that time, he might have gone seen his pal Howland and his wife.

Pal? Nothing about Meera's story shows that Brandon cared about Howland. Howland was a friend of Ned's, not Brandon.

- He might have gone seeking out Barbrey Ryswell (later: Dustin) to apologize and amend for the broken betrothal.

Barbrey lived in the north :D not the south. But I agree that that is most likely where he went (although visiting Barbrey might have been a stop inbetween two destinations).

It probably will be something we haven't been imagining.

Or this :p most likely this :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Tourney at Harrenhal happened not long enough before that for Ashara to be about to give birth. I have notes about the timeline for this, since I was working on this on my From Aegon's Birth until Lyanna's Death theory, which I, since today, have time for again :) I still have to type everything into a nice order which is logical to follow though :) But staye tuned, I'm going to upload it soon on that thread :)

Second thought, I'll also post the relevant part here when it's done.

Can't wait, send me those notes, please. My timeline has a blind spot of sorts there. But it would still work out with all I remember...

Pal? Nothing about Meera's story shows that Brandon cared about Howland. Howland was a friend of Ned's, not Brandon.

That's true, and Lyanna's and probably Benjen's, too

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

×