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How would you rate episode 404?

How would you rate episode 404?  

676 members have voted

  1. 1. What's your rating from 1-10, with 10 being the highest/best

    • 1
      17
    • 2
      9
    • 3
      19
    • 4
      22
    • 5
      26
    • 6
      41
    • 7
      85
    • 8
      128
    • 9
      209
    • 10
      118


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I really liked this episode. I like how they are showing Jaime coming back to King's Landing and it's not the warmest of welcomes. He's put in a really difficult position between the woman he loves, the brother he loves and loyalty to his family. It's predictament for sure.

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I think some of you have are so enamored with the show you've lost all sense of perspective and objectivity. Browsing through some of the responses of those that loved this episode I am left shaking my head. Are you the same people keeping that abomination of a show The Walking Dead on air? :stillsick:

A few examples:

- Glowing about Chapman's acting as Tommen. People, all he did was sit in his bed and look shy. Really, that's not Emmy award winning stuff there.

- The scene at Caster's was brutal. Nimm's response (a few above mine) is bang on. It was way too much and the brutality was not necessary. Unless this plot arc has huge implications that we don't know of we didn't need to see all that.

- The chemistry between Pod and Brienne. I must have missed something there, they were together all of about 15 seconds and the only interaction between them was Pod calling her "sir" (or "sire", or whatever). I'm sure they'll be great but let it happen first :)

- Littlefinger, the man who is constantly scheming behind the scenes decides to tell Sansa - the person he's done his best to show he's a conniving weasel - that he murdered the king. People, Petr didn't get to were he is by flapping his gums and bragging. He works in the shadows, he keeps his true intentions hidden. He doesn't tell some 13-year-old (or she 14 now? 12?) his whole master plan. I'm glad they dealt with the mystery of Joff's murder in one respect but this scene didn't make any sense.

On the plus side the surprise ending with The Others was, well, a surprise. Though I would be much happier if we got an update on the army of them that's been strolling south since S2. They could probably use Google Maps. :)

Littlefinger has almost the same exact conversation with Sansa in the books. It's like really almost verbatim so how's that for making sense?

Chapman did a fine job. He was a recast and people were concerned about his acting ability, but moreso that a 16 year old kid could seem so naive and innocent. He conveyed that very well without saying much, which isn't exactly easy. No one is saying he's the best actor in the world, just that they were pleased with his performance.

Pod is just happy to be a squire and people are happy that he called her Ser, my lady like he does in the books because it was funny. So far Pod hadn't shown to be completely at a loss for words so it was nice to see a little call on the books.

You have a legitimate gripe with Craster's scene.

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I just don't like that Bran was revealed last episode by Theon and this time by himself. I was also hoping the warg tunnel vision effect was not going to be standard for those instances. It is cheesy! And....THEY STABBED HODOR who was chained up! Terrible!

On the flip side....Marg was brilliant with Tommen. I loved the scene with Jaime and Tyrion. Agreed that Dany was rushed, but I thought it was effective. I wished we saw more of her and Sansa. I love show Littlefinger.

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Strong 8 bordering on 9. I like that they had Dany at the beginning to get her out of the way. I hate it when you look the clock and realize that it's 45 minutes past the hour and you just know they're going to close out with Emilia making some boring diatribe with that stupid smug look on her face...

The violent stuff at Craster's was pretty lame, IMO. I hate caricatures like Karl who are evil for no reason other than 'because they're evil'. GRRM knows how to build a true character, D&D still have no freaking clue.

Everything outside of Dany and Craster's was top-notch.

how is he evil for no reason? He's not necessarily evil at all, he's just reveling in the fact that for the first time in his life, he's the one giving orders rather than taking them.

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how is he evil for no reason? He's not necessarily evil at all, he's just reveling in the fact that for the first time in his life, he's the one giving orders rather than taking them.

He's drinking from the skull of his former commander, ordering his men to rape women 'till they're dead, sacrificing babies to ice monsters, feeding a giant direwolf for no apparent reason, and braging about how he can kill anyone.

If that's not a cardboard villain I dunno what is.

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Most people seem to be complaining about the Bran plot above all else. Well what did you honestly expect? Bran has literally two more chapters from the book that have not been put on tv yet. I assume you all thought they would just air those final two chapters and never show Bran again, until George finishes the next book.............which is still likely years away if A Dance with Dragons is any implication. This is not how tv works.



If George wants to ignore Bran for most of his 5th book he has a right to, if he wants to ignore The Others/White Walkers for that book, he has that right too. On tv however you can't just ignore your main characters and plot points for an entire season or 2 and expect your audience to remember who they are. This is why we had Theon on tv last year, unlike in the books where he was written out of the story for two entire novels.


Edited by sifth

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8/10.I found the role of Jamie become more&more moving,From the kings layer to the goodman,there's so much charism on him.Although this episode less shocking than '[email protected]',It's pretty good.One more thing,I think the details of White Walker in the series too little.

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I'll give it a 7. Jaime and Tyrion's scene made the episode for me , the rest I found good except for the NightWatch mutineers which I found cliched. I also liked that we saw more of the Others ( it has been three seasons, so as far as lil'ol' me is concerned, it's about time).

Also, no Alex Graves as director. I do believe that he knew that that was a rape scene that he directed last ep but apparently, it was rape meant to be shrugged off.

Ass.

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Most people seem to be complaining about the Bran plot above all else. Well what did you honestly expect? Bran has literally two more chapters from the book that have not been put on tv yet. I assume you all thought they would just air those final two chapters and never show Bran again, until George finishes the next book.............which is still likely years away if A Dance with Dragons is any implication. This is not how tv works.

If George wants to ignore Bran for most of his 5th book he has a right to, if he wants to ignore The Others/White Walkers for that book, he has that right too. On tv however you can't just ignore your main characters and plot points for an entire season or 2 and expect your audience to remember who they are. This is why we had Theon on tv last year, unlike in the books where he was written out of the story for two entire novels.

Yeah, but the Theon stuff was at least extrapolated from the books -- Bran's scenes were just low-grade fanfic. I'm not objecting to D&D adding stuff that fits with the story if they need to give the actors screen time, but what we got was (IMO, obviously) garbage. I'd have rather seen the scene with The Little, maybe some mention of The Knight of the Laughing Tree, but getting stupidly captured by the new crew at Craster's Playhouse was lame.

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Yeah, but the Theon stuff was at least extrapolated from the books -- Bran's scenes were just low-grade fanfic. I'm not objecting to D&D adding stuff that fits with the story if they need to give the actors screen time, but what we got was (IMO, obviously) garbage. I'd have rather seen the scene with The Little, maybe some mention of The Knight of the Laughing Tree, but getting stupidly captured by the new crew at Craster's Playhouse was lame.

So you'd rather just have Bran, Hodor and the Reed's sit around a camp fire telling stories, who only book readers would understand the deeper meaning of. Remember tv and books are two very different beasts as most people seem to forget. I have a lot of friends who watch the show and don't read the books and they have a very hard time keeping track of every character. I doubt any of them would remember who Bran's aunt was; though as a book reader I suppose you'd be able to laugh at the tv for being able to understand the deeper meaning of the story, while the causal viewer would wondered what the point of the story was.

Many of my friends wondered the same thing when Robert, Jamie and Barristan were telling war stories to each other in season 1.

Also if you view any scene that D & D write that George did not as fan fic, well you must also view nearly half the show as fan fic at this point.

Edited by sifth

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He's drinking from the skull of his former commander, ordering his men to rape women 'till they're dead, sacrificing babies to ice monsters, feeding a giant direwolf for no apparent reason, and braging about how he can kill anyone.

If that's not a cardboard villain I dunno what is.

Joffrey and Ramsay are cardboard villains too*, but of course anything D&D-invented gets hate.

*Not hating on the characters; Joffrey is one of my favorites

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So you'd rather just have Bran, Hodor and the Reed's sit around a camp fire telling stories, who only book readers would understand the deeper meaning of. Remember tv and books are two very different beasts as most people seem to forget. I have a lot of friends who watch the show and don't read the books and they have a very hard time keeping track of every character. I doubt any of them would remember who Bran's aunt was; though as a book reader I suppose you'd be able to laugh at the tv for being able to understand the deeper meaning of the story, while the causal viewer would wondered what the point of the story was.

Many of my friends wondered the same thing when Robert, Jamie and Barristan were telling war stories to each other in season 1.

Also if you view any scene that D & D write that George did not as fan fic, well you must also view nearly half the show as fan fic at this point.

I'm not a book purist if that's what you mean. I've liked a lot of what's been added or modified to make the books fit, especially Theon's arc last season. I specifically don't like the "new" scenes in Ep04, and I think they are horrible because they suck, not just because they aren't in the books. I think the book scenes I mentioned were skipped for a good reason (they wouldn't make for good tv), just that *even so*, they would have been better than the schlock we got.

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Said this before - 10/10. I gave last episode a 5/10.



I loved everything. Every scene was gripping. Even Dany's scene was great.



Loved everything North.



Even tolerated Littlefinger. Loved his "my friends" cut to the Tyrell ladies.



No Ramsay giggling and mustache twirling. No "sexy" Eric Bana Daario muttering and winking.



And of course....Ser Pounce.

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He's drinking from the skull of his former commander, ordering his men to rape women 'till they're dead, sacrificing babies to ice monsters, feeding a giant direwolf for no apparent reason, and braging about how he can kill anyone.

If that's not a cardboard villain I dunno what is.

I get that, they're using a bit of shorthand because they dont intend to develop him beyond this short little filler arc, but they did give him a raison d'etre albeit a cliche one. Just be glad that they're beefing up what was otherwise a rather boring travelogue for Bran north of the wall.

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Joffrey and Ramsay are cardboard villains too*, but of course anything D&D-invented gets hate.

*Not hating on the characters; Joffrey is one of my favorites

Joffrey is one of your favorites.

Undoubtedly this caricature mutineer is not.

Thank you for proving my point.

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Joffrey is one of your favorites.

Undoubtedly this caricature mutineer is not.

Thank you for proving my point.

That's because Joffrey has been around longer and was the first psycho in my GOT life. That said, Karl was highly-entertaining, though he is obviously not in any position to keep it going.

And which point was that? I wasn't responding to you, so I'm confused.

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Not quite sure why some people are saying the Walkers haven't proven themselves to be evil or bad in any manner. The very first scene of this series they beheaded some NW guys, and they seemingly enjoy mutilating bodies and such.


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It was the best episode of the season so far. I gave it a strong 8/10.



The last scene was a highlight for me. It answered some questions while inviting some new ones. I love to be surprised as a book reader.


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After several rewatches I am NOT un-tenning this episode (to coin a...word). The Jaime material was really well-handled, particularly his farewell to Brienne. And the last fifteen minutes or so were perfect in creating and sustaining a level of audience dread and discomfort. And then the payoff came completely out of left field with that awesome WW ending. They've sure livened up Bran's storyline and found a decent way to add material to Jon's.


Edited by Konradsmith

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