Jump to content

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

aameen

[BOOK SPOILERS] a blue rose cures things?

Recommended Posts

I wonder what this means. D&D wouldn't put such a particular thing in for no reason. But they haven't shown Lyanna at all. they had a Wall at the end of season 2 but refused to put a blue rose there. So, they've declined the connection till now.

If we assume that they've started to develop that motif, what does the curing thing mean? Could it be a huge symbol for Jon getting Dany pregnant later on? As in 'curing' her of her barren-ness?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's a pretty far stretch to equate that to Jon or anything that far in the future...



Also, he said it can "Cure a fever" not inability to get pregnant.



I do think the inclusion of the "dusk rose" was a definite nod to book readers and possibly the other two flowers though I'm sure there's going to be hundreds of interpretations (or misinterpretations). They love to do that and it's great fun for book fans.



Edit: Also, if you remember from Lyanna's lore (and the usual symbolism of the blue rose) - she died of a fever in a "Bed of blood." so that may be the reference to curing a fever but even that's more mystery than answers!


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jon/Dany endgame CONFIRMED...Kidding, kidding. It did make me wonder, though.



The fact that the "dusk rose" was blue could just be propmaster shenanigans. "Dusk" sounds like more of a purplish colour, really.



The idea that the rose cured fever did remind of Lyanna's death, since she supposedly was suffering of fever when she died.



..."Dusk rose" first made me think of the "dusky woman," now that I think of it.


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well on top of that Oberyn did mention Lyanna vaguely in his aside with Tyrion. Not specifically at all, but enough that any further elaboration could bring up the subject easily. Might be that now that they know most of the ending for sure, they may be starting to reference smaller details like that to prepare the show to bring them up effectively in these next three or so seasons the show has left.



Not enough of an indication to suggest that this is the case, but not too far from possible.


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When he offered the rose and it was blue I left the room screaming. I missed the other flowers stuff. Somewhere here said that the white flower was "Lady's lace"? Because that's a known contraception and it's also known as "False Queen Anne's lace". The seeds should be eaten after coitus and it works as a Morning After Pill.



. Wiki also says helps in treatment of vitiligo and psoriasis. Maybe something for the grayscale?


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Daario = Rhaegar confirmed! ;)

OMG, it JUST occurred to me.

Daario offers Dany a blue rose

Blue rose = Lyanna

Lyanna's brother = Benjen

HOLY SHIT DAARIO IS BENJEN. IT'S AS WE ALL SUSPECTED. :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My post from the other thread:





Okay... I've been reading through the thread and saw some speculation about the symbolism of Daario's flowers.



An alternative to the dragon head theory is that they could be referencing Little finger's three queens (two of the flower names have obvious female connotations: 'lady's lace' and 'harpy's gold'). If they are referencing the queens then the 'dusky' rose would obviously be Sansa (or possibly Arya), Harpy's gold is for Cersei, and Lady's lace is probably Margaery.



I can't help but also notice that both Sansa and Margaery had scenes involving getting a necklace while Cersei (the only one who is already a queen) was wearing her big gold lion.



That's all I've got. It was super weird to see Daario suddenly producing a blue rose. It seemed like heavy handed, enigmatic symbolism of some sort.


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Daario = Rhaegar confirmed! ;)

OMG, it JUST occurred to me.

Daario offers Dany a blue rose

Blue rose = Lyanna

Lyanna's brother = Benjen

HOLY SHIT DAARIO IS BENJEN. IT'S AS WE ALL SUSPECTED. :D

Wait: Rhaegar = Daario, Daario = Benjen....

Super gross Lyanna!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The fact that the "dusk rose" was blue could just be propmaster shenanigans. "Dusk" sounds like more of a purplish colour, really.

The idea that the rose cured fever did remind of Lyanna's death, since she supposedly was suffering of fever when she died.

Well see that's the point I maybe failed to make. The fact that he makes a point of saying the dusk rose is known to 'cure a fever' which is exactly what killed Lyanna (and her favorite flower could have saved her life) makes the irony and sadness of the story all that more poignant.

Also, things are likely named much differently on that side of the world than in Westeros so calling it a dusk rose instead of a winter blue rose is not that unusual.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Daario = Rhaegar confirmed! ;)

Now the 3-heads thing make sense', Damn Barristan, he knows about Mormont and Rhaegar and keeps his mouth shut because he wants to get into Dany's riding pants

Wait: Rhaegar = Daario, Daario = Benjen....

Super gross Lyanna!

More wincest!!, George and D&D know what people want.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My blue rose post from the epi thread.

Lots of spoilers here about the blue rose.

For those who were wondering... The blue winter rose is grown in the glass gardens at Winterfell. It was Lyanna Stark's favorite flower, apparently. At a tournament at Harrenhall, Rhaegar Targaryen wins and shocks everyone when he crowns Lyanna, not his wife Elia, the Queen of Love and Beauty with a crown of blue roses.

In Ned's dreams, narration, etc., he recalls Lyanna with blue roses.

Daenerys sees a blue flower growing from a chink in a wall of ice, spreading its sweetness around, in her visions at the House of the Undying in the book.

Theon Greyjoy later has a dream about the dead in the crypts of Winterfell which includes a woman in a gore spattered white gown and a crown or "laurel" of blue winter roses that Theon deduces is Lyanna.

People have theorized that Lyanna didn't exactly die in childbirth (even if R + L = J), but from a fever. So this mention of the "dusk rose" being used for fever is great for theorizing too.

It is always possible that the dusk rose was brought over to Westeros and cultivated in the north in glass gardens, eventually becoming the blue winter rose of the north .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My interpretation (utter bollocks ofcourse, so take it as such):



Dany is the fever that will hit Westeros (Fire and blood), Jon (the blue rose / Ice & fire) is the antidote that will rid the continent of her disease (the dragons).


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think it's a clear nod to the vision Dany sees in the HOTU.



Everything she saw in HOTU (Daughter of Death, Slayer of Lies, & Bride of Fire) relates to Dany, whether is a Dnay/Jon endgame or Dany finally finding family (non romantic) it has to do with her.



Even though in the books the rose is from the North of Westeros, the fact that they decided to to make it Essosi )or Essosi as well as Westerosi) in the show, signal at least to me that the symbolism of the rose will be important to Dany.



ETA:


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, if Daario is Benjen it explains why the show will not need Coldhands. I think Benjen plays a role and if he does that from the Daario role then he need not do it as Coldhands.


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If the third flower is red and gold - and poisonous, are we looking for a rotten Lannister for the third head, and might one appear in the next few weeks?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok there were 3 Lyanna/Raegahr/Elia references in ONE SINGLE EPISODE, after 3 seasons when this has been barely alluded to. That was not an accident. It seems like they are now shoving this story onto the viewers.



(1) The blue rose - a favorite of Lyanna's


(2) The actual explanation by Oberyn


(3) And rifling through the book of the Kingsguard. When they got to Arthur Dayne I was holding my breath wondering if they'll mention "The Tower of Joy."



Who knows what sorts of things Jamie will find in the show by rifling through that book!! Oh gee I wonder why the Kingsguard was guarding this ONE TOWER and not their boy king Viserys who fled to Dragonstone. Hmmmm...


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I do think the inclusion of the "dusk rose" was a definite nod to book readers and possibly the other two flowers though I'm sure there's going to be hundreds of interpretations (or misinterpretations). They love to do that and it's great fun for book fans.

Edit: Also, if you remember from Lyanna's lore (and the usual symbolism of the blue rose) - she died of a fever in a "Bed of blood." so that may be the reference to curing a fever but even that's more mystery than answers!

I think the rose/mention of curing a fever was definitely more of a nod to book readers than anything else. Lyanna liked "blue winter roses," so it's unlikely the glass gardens of Winterfell used "dusk roses" from deserts in Slaver's Bay. Mayhaps though...

I also think we need to be careful not to misinterpret or apply too much meaning to it. D&D may have wanted to at least give subtle winks to R+L=J, but I doubt they were introducing us to the "3 heads of the dragon" or foreshadowing Jon curing a fever Dany will get or something. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong, but if I'm going to over-analyze something, I'd rather focus on Martin's text, not the show.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I wonder what this means. D&D wouldn't put such a particular thing in for no reason. But they haven't shown Lyanna at all. they had a Wall at the end of season 2 but refused to put a blue rose there. So, they've declined the connection till now.

If we assume that they've started to develop that motif, what does the curing thing mean? Could it be a huge symbol for Jon getting Dany pregnant later on? As in 'curing' her of her barren-ness?

Oh I was really happy with all the Rhaegar/Lyanna/Elia references. But the only thing it made me wonder about whether we might get a flashback this season or next. After all, the Rhaegar/Lyanna/Elia back story keeps popping up throughout the books, thus must be of relevance, yet it hasn't been mentioned, let alone shown on the show much so far. We are at season 4 after all, and if something plot relevant actually evolves out of the whole Rhaegar/Lyanna/Jon business, it's time they started adding it drop by drop to the show as well. And so I think the blue rose means nothing more than an element of building up the Rhaegar/Lyanna motif and symbol system.

I think, to associate the blue rose with Jon in the first place, we should know for a fact that Jon is Lyanna's son, which we do not know for a fact. Thus I have the impression that considering the blue rose a symbol of Jon getting Daenerys pregnant is a little bit far fetched.

Daario being Rhaegar or Benjen... Daario is just Daario.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

×