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paulh_85

SOS part 2 - first 2 chapters

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SO have moved on, and had to re-read these two brilliant chapters on the train on the way to work.




Have a few questions i hope someone can shed some light on for me, im not fussed about spoilers, perhaps if there are any, use the spoiler tag so others dont read it.Anyway, ive tried to be more attentive to the little details since coming on here, and realising that there is a world beyond the main stories.



In the first Dany chapter (the one where she meets with the sellsword captains and takes Yunkai) she summons Whitebeard to talk to her about Rhaegar. He mentions something about a cloud hanging over him, and Summerhall. Have i missed something here from an earlier book? what does this refer too?



The more i read about him, and especially from the type of characters such as "whitebeard", i cant believe that he held Lyanna captive and raped her, there must have been something more in it.



So anyway onto chapter 2, Arya (where she gets taken by the hound) Summerhall gets mentioned again, this time by a 12 year old squire named Ned. he says that both him and Jon had the same Milk nurse? and that his (jons) mother was Wylla. (a name i think that has been mentioned previously)



id like to clarify somethings about Summerhall if i could.



Its where Ned fought(?) Authur Dayne and took Jon from?


its where Rhaegar was born? and where he liked to go often?


its where Ashara threw herself to her death?



i learned today that Ashara jumped from the tower AFTER her brother was killed, meaning there is a chance that she was Jons mum right? (though i know that r+l=j is a popular concept on here) it seems strange that she and Ned met at the tourney in harrenhal, obviously fell in love, but then she didnt jump for what was probably a few years later, AFTER Ned had married Catelyn and AFTER the war, so there must be something else going on in this storyline right?




Any discussions really (really!) welcome lol


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FIrst of all: bonus points for reading everything in so much detail!



1. nope, Ned fought Arthur Dayne (and two other kingsguard) at the 'Tower of Joy', which is where Rhaegar held Lyanna. This is clarified in the first book in Ned's dream.



2. Yes, Rhaegar was in deed born at Summerhall, and he did go there from time to time.



3. Nope, Ashara threw herself to her death at Starfall, which is the castle of house Dayne.



Concerning Ashara:


After ned and co. killed the three kingsguard at the Tower of Joy, Ned took the ancestral greatsword of house Dayne (Dawn) to Starfall. Also, he kinda went there to give Ashara the news of her brother being killed. So Ashara threw herself from the tower at Starfall out of grief (presumably). This all happened a few months after Ned had left the Tower of Joy and a dead Lyanna. When Ned left Starfall, he went to Rivverrun to pick up his wife and his son Robb, but he took Jon Snow with him from Starfall. This could indeed mean that Ashara is the mother, or maybe the dornish wetnurse Wylla was. Or maybe there's a third possibility. It's for yourself to figure this one out ;)

.



Concerning Raeghar:


When he was very young, he learned about a prophecy. He learned about a Prince who was Promised, and he believed that he was that prince. After that, he became a tad emo. I think that is the cloud that you were referring to).



Apologies if I have given any incorrect information, but i think I got most of it right :P. Anyway, you should look up a timeline for RR (or just the wiki). That should make things a little clearer.


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interesting. Thanks.



the squire Ned made reference to Summerhall and Jon having Wylla as his milk nurse though. Or rather she was boy Neds wet nurse and Jons mother (from boy neds POV)




where geographically is the Tower of Joy?



Boy ned is referred to having blue, almost Purple eyes in the book. He is also the nephew of both Authur and Ashara, but i thought the Targ had the purple eyes?




i respect the view that Ashara was indeed in love with Brandon, and with the news of his death, coupled with the death of her brother and (didnt she also have a still born?) its quite easy to see why she would have thrown herself from the tower.



im still perplexed at how Ned would have killed Dayne, considering he is considered by everyone to be the greatest knight there ever was. Not only that, but there was 3 of them.




Lastly, does anyone know if there will be a spin-off book/tv series about the war and sack of kings landing? i assume GRRM doesnt have the time, but id love a book starting with the Tourney at Harrenhal and ending with Ned bringing jon to Winterfell


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Also i forgot to mention, when the old dwarf lady is talking to Arya, she mentions something about Summerhall as well. Do we find out who she is? is she in the books more often?


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hmm let's see if i can answer all the questions.



Yes, Edric (Ned) Dayne beliefs that Wylla is Jon's mother, because that's the story he has been told. It could be true of course, but it could also be a cover up story



The tower of joy is located in the mountains of dorne. This map shows you where it is. You can also find summerhall and starfall on there.



Purple eyes isn't nessecarily a targ feature, it's a valyrian feature. Interestingly, the Daynes are the only non-valyrian family we know of that also have purple eyes. If i'm not mistaken, the Daynes are first men, meaning they have lived in Westeros for thousands of years.



The fight at the Tower of Joy was between the three kingsguard members and Ned's group. Ned's group consisted of i believe 9 people. After the fight, Ned and his buddy Howland Reed (Meera and Jojen's father) were the only two left standing.



To know what the ghost of high heart was talking about, you should take a look at the wiki: http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Summerhall#Tragedy_at_Summerhall.



Lastly, I think everyone would love that. It could reveal to many things though, so I doubt that we'll ever get it. At least not before the series is done.



EDIT: If you have more questions, just keep 'em coming :)


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the ghost of high heart then, so i assume she was there when Rhaegar was born? what other event could she be referring to? does that make her a Targ or relation?


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This is background info that is given in ADWD, so I'll put it in spoiler tags.



The ghost of high heart is a profetic character. She told king Jaehaerys that from the line of Aerys and Rhealla (his children) would come 'the prince who was promised'. Jaehaerys believed her and therefore had Aerys marry his sister Rhealla.



The event she is referring to is the Tragedy at Summerhall, where king Aegon V, his son Duncan the Small and the Lord commander of his kingsguard Duncan the Tall died from a big fire.



I had forgotten it at first, but Rhaegar was actually born on that same day at Summerhall.



Yes, it is assumed she was there at summerhall at the day of the tragedy, and thus was there for Rhaegar's birth. She is not a targ (as far as I know), but she was a friend of Jenny of Oldstones, who was the wife of prince Duncan the Small.


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