(BOOK & SHOW SPOILERS) An Early Look At Episode 3

[TheWhiteRabbit]

Is there a separate thread to post end of season stuff ATM? I know some people have posted episode ten/season 4 as a whole stuff here so I'd like to voice my thoughts and questions as well but if they can be moved am all for that.

I think everyone's in agreement that the battle for CB/Stannis' arrival will occur in Ep. 9. That makes logical sense, as Jon can be elected LC still either at the end of that ep or the start of 10 before Sam, Gilly, Aemon and co. leave for Oldtown.

For episode 10, as a few people have pointed out, we'll (hopefully) get Dany chaining up her dragons, Bran arriving at the cave, Stannis asking Jon to be Lord of Winterfell, Sam and co. sailing off, Arya heading off to Braavos, if we haven't already seen it Lysa heading out the Moon Door (probably ep. 8 I'm thinking) and of course Tyrion and Tywin in the privy.

Which brings up the question of Lady Stoneheart. As much as I'd really, really like to see this scene, I think it has a good chance to be cut. I'm praying this isn't the case but I feel that they're going to cut most of the Brotherhood stuff out since in the grand scheme of things they are not overly important. The logistics of it presents a major problem too; after having a char like Tywin get killed off, pulling off zomb-Cat immediately afterwards will be tough. I think they can do it if they arrange the episode correctly though, like having Tywin die 2/3rds of the way through or something. Which would leave the weak Dany scene as a strong choice for last one before LS reveal.

Regarding season 5 though, I highly doubt they'll cut out the Ironborn stuff. The way the Game of Thrones works in general is that new players are constantly being shuffled through and I feel that D&D and the writers could easily sell Season 5 as a "new players" season after the original war is basically over in Season 4 (i.e. all of the original 5 kings die). So I'm sure in Season 5, since the material from AFfC and ADwD isn't as good as ASoS but is still interesting, we'll see players like Euron, Victarion, and Quentyn quite early while the subplot/B story will be the Cersei-Margery feud as well as Riverlands stuff.

About Lady Stoneheart: I brought up the idea of D&D not including her in another thread (mainly because I dislike the character), but I was blasted by most people. The main argument was that Lady Stonheart had to be included because she was the plot-driver of the Jamie and Brienne storyline, and I don't disagree with that. However, if they didn't include her D&D would just find some other way to drive Jamie and Brienne's storyline. Personally, I just believe it cheapens the story to have someone come back to life that you thought was dead for an entire season, and while I love me some Stark vengeance, I'd rather see it from characters that are actually alive not a mute zombie.

[Father of Dragons]

My thoughts on the LS situation is that we won't see the scene with Merret or another Frey. Brienne will likely have her "brawl" with Rorge and Biter (if it's them) in episode 8, and she'll be taken by the brotherhood to meet LS on episode 10.

[Konradsmith]

^She could always witness LSH and the BWB hanging a Frey and then have a cliffhanger once LSH turns her attention to her.

[iheartseverus]

I keep thinking back to that interview John Bradley (Sam) did sometime back. When he revealed there would be no Coldhands in the show, he also added that another book character fans will be expecting, isn't going to be in the show. I immediately took that to mean LS, but who knows?

[six]

They wouldn't bother to send Brienne on her quest, if LSH wasn't to be included. I'd bet on Uncat making an appearance, not sure when, but if that wasn't the case Brienne's quest would have been left out entirely.

[HairGrowsBack]

They wouldn't bother to send Brienne on her quest, if LSH wasn't to be included. I'd bet on Uncat making an appearance, not sure when, but if that wasn't the case Brienne's quest would have been left out entirely.

Yeah I'm pretty sure LS will make it ; even if she doesn't end up doing much in the long run, she's pivotal for Jaime and Brienne's respective arcs, and I don't see who could plausibly replace her.

I'm also really looking forward to the Marg/Cersei 'banter'.

[Konradsmith]

I don't think LS can be cut. Keep in mind they kept the scene where Cat says she'd never ask anything of Brienne that would compromise her honour. As nice a scene as it was, the real reason to include it is as set up for what's to come.

[Bear Claw]

If they are cutting LS then why even introduce Berric D?

[TheRatCook]

I don't think the TV series is going to pursue the Ironborn storylines that are in the book. I think Yara is going to get captured and flayed (I know in the books some woman gets flayed by Ramsay, but as I think they are going to close the Ironborn storylines out of the TV series, I predict they'll end with Yara's capture and flaying. Perhaps, Reek will get to kill Ramsay in the end somehow, but who knows.

Well that would depend on how central the Victarion/Dany arc is the ending. I don't see how they can cut the Iron Born out entirely unless its not important.

[Lord Bored]

Well that would depend on how central the Victarion/Dany arc is the ending. I don't see how they can cut the Iron Born out entirely unless its not important.

Maybe it might be important in its own right but less so than most other existing storylines.

[Wouter]

I keep thinking back to that interview John Bradley (Sam) did sometime back. When he revealed there would be no Coldhands in the show, he also added that another book character fans will be expecting, isn't going to be in the show. I immediately took that to mean LS, but who knows?

Assuming this is quite likely to be another character of the northern storyline (which Bradley is a part of), Val is also a possibility.

[King Tommen]

Sansa specifically stated in the S4 premiere that they had cut Cat's throat and thrown her in the river. Not sure what more of a hint you would require...

[JonDunn]

Aha! I may have worked the Greyjoy situation out!

When Yara unsuccessfully attacks the Dreadfort, Ramsay takes her as a prisoner. Balon or the captain of Moat Cailin will return only return it for Yara. Ramsay, in a deviation from the books, hands her over and lets her return to the Iron Islands. At this point, show-Ramsay has not been legitimised, and this is all that he wants, as D&D, George and Iwan have constantly reminded us of, so he'll do anything to "impress" his father. Remember what Roose said: "Take the Moat for our family, and I'll reconsider your position." Yara arrives home either just after, or just before Balon's death, setting up the Kingsmoot for next season.

Apologies if anyone else has already thought about this and I've just stolen it.

Nailed it.

[jons nissa]

About Lady Stoneheart: I brought up the idea of D&D not including her in another thread (mainly because I dislike the character), but I was blasted by most people. The main argument was that Lady Stonheart had to be included because she was the plot-driver of the Jamie and Brienne storyline, and I don't disagree with that. However, if they didn't include her D&D would just find some other way to drive Jamie and Brienne's storyline. Personally, I just believe it cheapens the story to have someone come back to life that you thought was dead for an entire season, and while I love me some Stark vengeance, I'd rather see it from characters that are actually alive not a mute zombie.

i agree. i also agree that jaime an brienne could get a new story line to keep things moving for them but i think stoneheart will appear because of that dream bran has where cat has a green skin tone and is very angry. they couldn't foreshadow her arrival any better than that and i fully expect that clip to be shown in the "previously on games of thrones" segment when she is revealed.

[Zombies That Were Promised]

She's the epilogue to the most climactic installment in the series so far, and you're fathoming cutting her....

[Bib Fortuna]

The BWB are in this season, so why else would they be here if not to find and resurrect Cat's body?

[LordStoneheart]

I will stop watching the show if Lady Stoneheart doesn't show up this season. I swear it by the old gods and new, on my honor as a Tully, on my honor as a Stark.

[aFeastForDragons]

She's the epilogue to the most climactic installment in the series so far, and you're fathoming cutting her....

I agree. I struggled to pick my jaw up off the ground after that one.

[Hath4]

Yara being captured by ramsay would be extremely repetitive. I think she will attack the dreadfort loss and retreat to deep wood Mott where she will be captured next year.

[Zombies That Were Promised]

Since Balon is still alive in the show, I think the Kingsmoot and Yara's presence there is all the more likelier so this is how I would do it:

Ep 6: Yara attacks the Dreadfort and fails to rescue Theon (Gemma Whelan was interviewed and said she filmed scenes with Alfie Allen)

Ep 7: She retreats to Moat Cailin where she hears about Balon's death, leaves Ralf Kenning in charge (just like her uncle Victarion did in the books)

Ep 8: Ramsay catches up to Moat Cailin, Reek parlays with the Ironborn, the Ironborn are all flayed to death

Ep 10: Ramsay and Roose armies reunite (my only problem is the finale is suppose to be one hell of a ride, so maybe the flaying won't happen until this ep)

Season 5 Kingsmoot. Probably Episode 1, since Victarion needs to start sailing to Dany ASAP. I don't know if Deepwood Motte makes the cut, but she does need to get captured by Stannis after the Kingsmoot. She'll at least run away from Euron and the husband she's forced to marry.