[Book Spoilers] EP402 Discussion

[pantouflas]

 

This was the single best episode of the series to date. Masterpiece

 

This!

[Lady Baela Targaryen]

Yeah, that was add to. Theon never told anyone about it. So, I'm guessing, they'll remove the whole part of the fake Arya.

The Boltons know that Bran and Rickon are alive in the books.

[Hrafntýr]

I know that writers now avoid this line because of the Terminator reference, but I really, really wish Dontos had actually said "Come with me if you want to live" instead of whatever variation on that he used.

Yes!

[Syrio.Forel]

Got a 70 not that size matters to a guy or anything, but mines bigger, it's bigger, hahaha seriously my tv is huge. Sometimes I have to watch stuff twice because it's so big I can only watch half the screen at one time.

@$$#0!3

[Stannis I]

The Boltons know that Bran and Rickon are alive in the books.

I don't recall that... Theon never tells that, if I'm not mistaken. He even thinks he's clever for that.

[Alayne's Shadow.]

I know that writers now avoid this line because of the Terminator reference, but I really, really wish Dontos had actually said "Come with me if you want to live" instead of whatever variation on that he used.

I thought he said exactly that.

On-topic: Great episode! Some nitpicks though:

1) Not enough Sansa. Though her non-verbal scenes were great. I wished she had mentioned about Ice to Tyrion, though I hate her talking anything with Tyrion.

2) I don't understand Margaery 'Princess of the People' Tyrell. Just seems anachronistic.

All in all, great episode. Dianna Rigg and Jack Gleeson killed it, and was that dragons in King's Landing? Might we now know something about TWOW?

[Frances Bean Corbray]

FAT WALDA~!

MACE~!

Well, now we know how/why Locke is going to The Wall. Looks like he'll be taking over the undercover/mole among the crows role instead of a King's Landing Agent. Locke and Ramsay acting like BFF's and Ramsay being truly happy/congratulatory to Locke for unhanding Jaime was a nice little nugget. And oh, Myranda, ignorance is bliss. Hunting your ex-tag team partner through the woods, as though this is the first -- or LAST -- time that's happening.

Papa Bolton is Not Amused with Ramsay. And so it begins.... :)

[Ramsay trolling Reek about Robb was glorious.]

Is Tywin and Olenna hanging out canon? No. Is Charles Dance and Diana Rigg doing a scene together so awesome that I don't care? YES. Love her shutdown of Lord Oaf (it's the only time we hear his name, too).

Sorry Bran, your scene was merely Very Good this week, which means it's the low point when everything else is Pants Shittingly Awesome (and Dany takes the week off).

Shireen: still adorable. And she's not afraid of Melisandre. You Go Girl.

Queen Selyse: Still Bugfuck Crazy, never change.

Stannis The Mannis: can even take a seagull dinner and leave folks saying WIE ROMANTISCHE.

Was not initially a fan of Loras moving on and not being "the sun has set no candle can replace it". However, trading bedroom eyes with Oberyn? I *knew* the Tyrells and Martells didn't really hate each other :D And besides, Loras is a pastiche of all three book brothers. Bit of Willas coming out there. Also loved Loras spilling that burnsauce on Jaime. About time we saw Loras show off some of his cockiness and his spine. Loras ain't afraid of no kingslayer.

Jaime's secret is safe with Bronn. But not because of Tyrion. Given his account of Shae's departure, I think The Imp has been outbid for his services. And/or it's time to remember that Tyrion's money is ultimately really his dad's money.

"In some parts of the kingdom bastards are shunned. In other parts, the murder of children and the raping of their mother are considered somewhat distasteful. It's a good thing your daughter is in the latter sort of place." XD XD XD XD XD XD XD XD XD XD Love Oberyn so much. And people doubted Pedro Pascal when the casting was first announced.

Brienne and Pycelle learn that Cersei is literally incapable of not being a complete raging bitch for more than a minute. Lena is amazing.

Show's Dwarf Joust > Book's Dwarf Joust. That was some pro-wrestling heel level shit from the wrestling heel counterpart on the show, King Joffrey. Midgets dressed as your rivals and behaving like jackasses and getting squashed. Renly "taking it in the ass", Stannis being portrayed as a total pussy taking one arrow and running, and Robb saying "I'm the king in the north" in a slow drawl over and over again before getting his wolf-head knocked off. Didn't notice anything about Balon but I'm sure it was in spirit. Loved Loras storming out in rage at the offensive portrayal of Renly (squealing as he was repeatedly stabbed in the butt). Was hopeful Sansa would deduce where the Valyrian Steel came from and give the line about "what did they do to my father's sword?" BUT Sophie had the dead-stare working overtime.

And then we have the money shot.

'Twas glorious. Everything I hoped for, everything I saw in my mind's eye in the years since first reading the book. A Golden Crown. Dracarys. These are the "money shot" scenes I've been anticipating most since this show came to air. And once again Game Of Thrones hits it out of the park. Jack Gleeson retires a champion. Can't remember Maester Cressen's death from season 2 so I don't know if they repeated the symptoms, but this was wonderfully bloody and I love how ONLY Jaime and Cersei run to the king's side.

Horrified reaction shots during the wedding of everyone else at Joffrey's outrageous behavior. Loras storming out, WTF looks from Mace and Olenna, Margaery looking to see how Sansa reacts to the worst stuff, even Tywin looks unhappy. Only Cersei is amused by this parade of offensiveness. And thus while Tyrion is arrested immediately, the show has effectively set up what I hoped they would, a "who shot JR?" style mystery and cliffhanger over who REALLY did it. Already the reaction from the Unsullied is entertaining me as they speculate wildly (and even cleverly, sometimes. One show only fan that I saw has already fingered Olenna, though they did not notice the significance of her fucking with Sansa's necklace). The early leading culprit is actually Dontos, as his reappearance in the show seemingly "makes no sense" unless it's to set him up for this. And of course he smuggles Sansa to safety at just the right time. My favorite (somewhat joking) guess so far is that everybody wanted Joffrey dead and gave him a slow acting poison that would take days, but because so many people. were independently trying to poison him he O.D.ed and died immediately. Sansa, Dontos, Oberyn and his suspicious nickname, Margaery, and Olenna have all been fingered; Tyrion being accused of it, of course, eliminates him in people's minds as a potential Real Killer.

And now I need a cigarette (even though I don't smoke)

:devil:

[NightStark]

I don't recall that... Theon never tells that, if I'm not mistaken. He even thinks he's clever for that.

Ramsay was the one who flayed the bodies in ACoK.

Edited April 14, 2014 by NightStark

[rmholt]

It's not a case of what else happens in the episode. It's more down to the fact that the PW portrays Balon as dead and buried when we know fine well that in the show he isn't at this point. If these scenes were filmed far apart, any change to the script and any minor mistake (like this) could have went unchecked. That's my opinion on the matter anyway. You can chalk it down to forshadowing or w/e if you want, but why distinctly mention dwarves in your reply? I can't help but feel that was some sort of veiled insult- suggesting i'm somehow prejudice against dwarves?

The dwarfs were the ones re-enacting the winning of the war, and one of them said he was drowning. No offense meant

[jobmartell]

Just seeing Ice made this another great episode. Too sick.

[Frances Bean Corbray]

Oh and does this mean BALON GREYJOY has won the war of five kings by default because he's still standing?

LOLOLOL

I love it.

[pantouflas]

Did anyone notice if, during QoT and Tywin's chat, they said anything that might be re-construed as planning this together? I know this is crackpot, but Tywin seems awfully passive during the whole wedding...

I wouldn't mind seeing a breakdown of Bran's vision too. Did it include the Snowy Throne Room from Dani's vision back in Series 2, or were my eyes playing tricks on me?

Edited April 14, 2014 by pantouflas

[MyLittleDirewolf]

I'm at page 14 of this thread and so far, no mention of Jaime's golden hand knocking over the wine? Right as they sat down, I was all "Yeah! He's going to knock over the goblet of wine!" and then he did and I burst out laughing so much I had to pause it. My husband (non-bookreader) just looked at me like I was crazy.
Now someone can make an updated GIF to replace this one http://24.media.tumblr.com/ebf17af964572105747b7a562dbffe39/tumblr_mzkxlhlZ3w1qjj95xo1_250.gif

[nara]

Maybe she'll become a more empowered FAyra. I doubt it though...wondering her purpose

Didn't D&D eliminate Ros because the actress didn't want to do anymore nude scenes? At least, that was the rumor. Perhaps she is the new "random woman we can show nude and act as though that's part of the plot." Giving her a role as Ramsay's henchwoman might be a set up for that...

She's ok now. Paramedics got her home with her family. Apparently, she wasn't eating very well these days.

Glad to hear it. I hope she stays healthy.

Also, am I the only one unhappy that apparently Selyse and Stannis were already married during the siege of Storm's End? It doesn't really matter since they already got rid of Edric Storm in the show, but I always liked how angry Stannis was that Robert bedded their cousin in his marriage bed and caused him not to have sons.

Edited April 14, 2014 by nara

[Lady Baela Targaryen]

I don't recall that... Theon never tells that, if I'm not mistaken. He even thinks he's clever for that.

When Ramsay was posing as Reek in Winterfell, he killed the miller's boys and convinced Theon to pass them for Bran and Rickon.

[Onna Lewyys]

I don't recall that... Theon never tells that, if I'm not mistaken. He even thinks he's clever for that.

Ramsay was the one who killed the miller's sons in the books, so he knows they weren't Bran & Rickon.

And in the show Theon did tell Ramsay that he never found the Stark boys.

[Newstar]

Show's Dwarf Joust > Book's Dwarf Joust. That was some pro-wrestling heel level shit from the wrestling heel counterpart on the show,

Yes, although I guess you could say that the TV joust was offensive to everyone in so many ways, whereas the book joust was more pointedly offensive to Tyrion. It was definitely an improvement on the books, though.

Now someone can make an updated GIF to replace this one http://24.media.tumb...jj95xo1_250.gif

Ha! That was what I thought of when I saw that scene. Classic.

Edited April 14, 2014 by Newstar

[rmholt]

I don't recall that... Theon never tells that, if I'm not mistaken. He even thinks he's clever for that.

Book Theon has to have Ramsay shove a sackful of clothes including a wolf pin into his hands to get the concept. Ramsey knew the whole story and Roose totally pwns Ramsey. And all his men.

[MyLittleDirewolf]

If they went that route, I guess Bronn's betrayal would hurt more than Shae's (that's me personally, tho), but the whole Oberyn-Ellaria-Cersei-Tywin exchange..... Best scene in the whole episode, IMO.

I never thought that Bronn betrayed Tyrion. Tyrion asked Bronn to be his champion. Bronn was like "Dude, you pay me well, and you're cool and all, but that's the fucking Mountain. I'd die." and Tyrion basically is like well, thought I'd ask and doesn't seem to see it as a betrayal. Later when Bronn messes with them and names the baby Tyrion, I took that as a sign that he's still on Tyrion's side.

So, IDK what to make of the show changes here. If they have Bronn outright betray Tyrion, I'll be annoyed. I do wonder if Tywin got a hold of Shae, he could have nabbed her on the ship. Or what Varys's role in all this is, if he never was going to help her get to Pentos.

[Newstar]

It seems to have been lost in all the discussions about Joffrey and the PW, but Alfie Allen gave good Reek in this episode.

...although I cackled at the transition from Theon shuddering to Tyrion digging into a long sausage. Never gets old. :D

Although I liked the Tyrion/Jaime scene and the Jaime stuff in Episode 1, I really missed Jaime and Tyrion seeing each others' injuries. (I guess "handless and noseless" doesn't really work when Tyrion still has his nose, though.)

Edited April 14, 2014 by Newstar