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[Book Spoilers] EP403 Discussion

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I think D&D want some people to get that vibe, at least. More suspects the better until they reveal whodunnit.

They clearly confirmed in the first sequence that Littlefinger was behind it, so I don't think they're really portraying this as a mystery. The Tyrells' involvement has yet to be revealed, sure, but that's it.

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Yeah, that was a... strange dialogue. LOL

Pity TV Tommen has to be older, since the fun about him is that he was childish.

He still seems fairly young, and I imagine that much like TV Sansa, the character will wind up being much younger than the actor looks (TV Sansa is 14, e.g.).

That's one problem in making Tommen, what, 12 or 13 instead of the 9-or-10-year old I think he was supposed to be at Joffrey's death; it will be less believable that Tommen, as King, will still act in a childish way. This boy looks a bit too old to be outlawing beets and getting pleasure banging down the royal seal and playing with his kittens.

Tywin wasn't wrong, necessarily, but he came off as rather self-serving, as if he was practically directing the kid to shut up, appoint Grandpa Hand, and do what the Hand/Council says forever.

Yes. They could leave off the kittens, the beets-outlawing, etc., and still make Tommen a credibly pliable puppet. Tywin seemed to have him in hand in this episode with just a few shrewd words. Tommen need not be hopelessly childish, just sweet, trusting, and easily manipulated, like Sansa circa AGOT.

He didn't steal it, he paid the iron price :)

Did the Hound kill the guy? I thought he just clubbed him.

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Could Orys be a substitute for Aenys? He was followed by Maegor the Cruel.


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About Tommen's age and his marriage to Margaery...

Did anyone notice that as Tywin and Tommen were walking away, Tywin was telling Tommen about the need to marry and continue the family line?

The rest of the conversation went like this:

Tywin: To continue the family line. Do you know how that happens?

Tommen: Yes.

Tywin: Has anyone explained the details to you?

Tommen: I don't think so.

Tywin: It's all relatively straightforward...

Hmmm. Sansa and Tyrion never wound up consummating their marriage, either, but Tywin giving Tommen the talk? I wonder.

TV Tommen is...interesting. Despite being older, he still seems easily manipulated by Tywin...although, to be fair, Tywin was not wrong in anything that he said.

i did notice that and thought they were warming the audience up for another wedding. that conversation follows olenna telling margeary get ready for marriage number 3. whew! all these weddings must be exhausting for the poor girl.

the wildlings have all gone mad! Very disappointing.

i was wondering if i just didn't remember them being so brutal. i mean ygritte seems to be out of control. all that just because she was dumped? sad. really sad.

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Littlefinger pretty clearly demonstrated that all the other stones are just made of glass or whatever, I thought, based on that.



Though that raises problems of its own, since that necklace doesn't seem to have a "front" or "back", so Sansa could easily have put it on with the poisoned one on the other side.




I thought Lady Olena in the show fixed both sides of Sansa's hair so perhaps she just grabbed whichever stone came off easily. The other stones looked firmly fixed.



In the book Sansa still has the hairnet so maybe the show is wrapping up the speculation that Sansa will poison LF using a stone in tWoW.




I LOVED Tywins speech to Tommen and of course the entire Arya/Hound relationship. Honestly I was kind of hoping to see Ser Jorah walk though the sewers to get into Mereen but I guess we wont find out about his betrayal until later (if at all)


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really dug this episode. the jaime thing was kind of meh, but i dont mind that much. i think they're doing his arc differently, so i'll let that play out before judgement


littlefinger seriously sounds more and more like batman every season


tywin/tommen was amazing. loved it


stannis cracked me up. i think that was a really good scene for him. and nice shout out to the gc.


arya/sandor was fantastic as usual. when she said "father!" when the hound interupted the guy, i was literally rotflol. how she said it was sooooo funny. and i was fist pumping for the tully love


i usually hate dany, but i really liked her scene. the duel was cool and i really liked the broken collars.


sam and gilly are sooo cute. love them


and are we supposed to know that the qot poisoned joffers yet? i was kind of confused about that.


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I haven't seen the episode yet, I'm going on what's been reported here -- that a "King Orys" was mentioned as being killed by his brother.

There's an unexplained gap in the Royal Targaryen House tree at http://awoiaf.westeros.org/images/c/c6/House_Targaryen_Family_tree.jpg

There was a Great Council after Jaehaerys to decide the successor and Viserys was chosen.

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Hate that they had the Hound steal, after he said he wasn't a thief and hated that Jaime raped Cersei.

Me too. But "You are the worst SHIT in the seven kingdoms!" Was great. I love Arya

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Why not? King Thanduil rides an (Irish) elk in The Hobbit movies.

Think of the logistics of it in the show, they can't show the direwolves for more than 2 seconds because of the budget and people expect a guy riding an elk.

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The opening scene was pretty bad too. Like instantly everyone knows Sansa has run off. Completely implausible that Cersei and Tywin would be aware of that so soon. And the fact of their knowing makes it implausible that Sansa would successfully get away.


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Something doese not feel right, if Tywin promised red vipe the let him "have a conversation" with Mountain, then why would red vipe want to be Tyrion's champion? He did this in the novel exactly because Tywin refuse to sacrifice Mountain


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Think of the logistics of it in the show, they can't show the direwolves for more than 2 seconds because of the budget and people expect a guy riding an elk.

It doesnt really matter though because the character isnt in the show. So, its highly unlikely that was his mount.

Even moreso since he rode an elk and not a horse.

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Could Orys be a substitute for Aenys? He was followed by Maegor the Cruel.

Hah, could be they changed Aenys' name because "Aenys" makes people snicker. (We were talking about that on the "strange names" thread recently.)

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Something doese not feel right, if Tywin promised red vipe the let him "have a conversation" with Mountain, then why would red vipe want to be Tyrion's champion? He did this in the novel exactly because Tywin refuse to sacrifice Mountain

He wouldn't want to be called a murderer, trial by combat gives him an excuse to kill him.

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Something doese not feel right, if Tywin promised red vipe the let him "have a conversation" with Mountain, then why would red vipe want to be Tyrion's champion? He did this in the novel exactly because Tywin refuse to sacrifice Mountain

Oh I'm sure Tywin will double cross him at some point.

Or Oberyn will get SMOKING GUN evidence that Tywin gave the order.

Several episodes away, but I'm sure we'll get a moment like that to set it up.

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The opening scene was pretty bad too. Like instantly everyone knows Sansa has run off. Completely implausible that Cersei and Tywin would be aware of that so soon. And the fact of their knowing makes it implausible that Sansa would successfully get away.

The timing of that thing was so completly stupid.

It felt like a training montage with randomly mixed shots and no sense of time.

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That stannis scene was shit why is he threatening davos at times like this I wish they could keep him offscreen till he saves the watch instead of adding this bs filler.

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"Some think the sky is blue because we live inside the eye of a blue-eyed giant..."



Named Macomber? :)



I did find it odd that S4 Tywin suddenly believes in the rumours of Dany and her three dragons when he was so damned certain before that it was all malarkey....




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