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[Show and Book Spoilers] A Balanced review of Stannis.


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Shireen rides on horseback into battle, throwing leather-bound books at the wildlings. She then vaults off, landing cat-like on Harma Dogshead. Putting a knife to her throat, Shireen utters You wanna know how I got these scars?

"Davos, are they booing me?"
"No, my lord, they're saying "Boourn them... Boourn the wildings".

Haha, love the reference.

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The "Stannis!" moment is his real crowning moment, actually. I think is the breaking point for Stannis in the books and it might be the same during the show. IF they play it well. If that moment can't bring Unsullied into Stannis's camp, then the character is really lost. We'll have to wait.

Basically this.

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I just watched the episode again and they are really portraying the WIldlings as marauding savages that will rape, kill and eat everything in their path. They are also really downplaying Castle Black's strength so Stannis's arrival is going to be epic.



It also looks like Davos will get his triumphant moment when he gets the Iron Bank on their side or he convinces Stannis to just through his meagre forces at the Wildlings.


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Been following these threads since the beginning of the season. I'm a bit of a show apologist, but I'm more sympathetic to the other viewpoint now having gone through these threads.

As for him being changed from a "morally complicated man who ultimately tries to do the right thing...," you're not wrong. I think part of the reason is it's a more visual story for the time they have for Stannis. How the show allots time is another discussion. That type of complexity in a character takes a long time to develop as it has to be done visually by nature of the medium. In the books, Davos does all the heavy lifting in his head for us. Stannis has some Walter White complexity going on, and as much as I would watch an entire hour of Stannis and the gang, he just doesn't have as much time to grow as someone like Walt did.

And as to the 'him still being around,' that's why a few of my Unsullied friends have started to take interest. They said that with even Robb Stark not making it, this grumpy guy with a fire witch is still here...

I do think they're setting Stannis up for a choice: KL or The Wall, and his being more whiny and prickly and glum and villain-ly will make his decision that much more attention getting.

I have read many posts on Stannis on this thread, and this is one of the best. I really hope this is where its going: The CHOICE of Stannis between glory or duty.

For instance, the Iron Bank of Bravos will either (a) turn Stannis down but Davos will manage to rummage up a few thousand troops somewhere or (b ) give Stannis some cash to hire sellswords. Stannis will then say "To King's Landing to claim my rights to the throne!" but Davos will then refuse and "remind him of his Duty and not his rights. Save the kingdom to become king line....." Stannis will become angry and throw Davos in a cell and the scene will end. Based on Stannis' unfavorability at this point of the show, most unsullied will think Stannis is going to King's Landing. The Battle at the Wall will resemble the darkest moments of the Battle of Helm's Deep with a frantic Jon Snow rallying a losing Night's Watch against foes from both sides. Just when Jon Snow finally kills the Magnar and the last of the southside Wildlings, Mance's troops start breaking through the tunnel (climbing the wall???). It appears all hope is lost with a wounded Jon Snow and Company (Janos is cowering somewhere I bet) resign themselves to death when a single warhorn blows in the East and Stannis' troops enter the fray.

I know this sounds like lame fan fiction, but Areo's post got me thinking as to the big picture of Stannis arc so far. If what I wrote above is in any way remotely close to what actually happens, its going to melt both my own and the Unsullied's faces.

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I have read many posts on Stannis on this thread, and this is one of the best. I really hope this is where its going.

For instance, the Iron Bank of Bravos will either (a) turn Stannis down but Davos will manage to rummage up a few thousand troops somewhere or (b ) give Stannis some cash to hire sellswords. Stannis will then say "To King's Landing to claim my rights to the throne!" but Davos will then refuse and "remind him of his Duty and not his rights. Save the kingdom to become king line....." Stannis will become angry and throw Davos in a cell and the scene will end. Based on Stannis' unfavorability at this point of the show, most unsullied will think Stannis is going to King's Landing. The Battle at the Wall will resemble the darkest moments of the Battle of Helm's Deep with a frantic Jon Snow rallying a losing Night's Watch against foes from both sides. Just when Jon Snow finally kills the Magnar and the last of the southside Wildlings, Mance's troops start breaking through the tunnel (climbing the wall???). It appears all hope is lost with a wounded Jon Snow and Company (Janos is cowering somewhere I bet) resign themselves to death when a single warhorn blows in the East and Stannis' troops enter the fray.

I know this sounds like lame fan fiction, but Areo's post got me thinking as to the big picture of Stannis arc so far. If what I wrote above is in any way remotely close to what actually happens, its going to melt both my own and the Unsullied's faces.

Man you are getting me excited now.

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Well, they will have Jon treat with Mance because we have that shot of him riding through the tunnel under the Wall with a torch and also a shot of Mance running through his camp while horsemen charge (from one of the TV spots posted on the GoT youtube channel). Since Qhorin made no mention of it, I doubt they'll include the Horn of Joramun now but they've still made the wildlings outnumber the Watch greatly. This means that Jon won't have much negotiating power and that Mance will be wanting things on his terms and disregarding the concessions the Watch would have him make. That will definitely cast Stan's arrival in a positive light.


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I think Shireen having such a large role this season bodes well for her character in future books.

*insert Queen Shireen speculation.*

Here's some actual speculation: http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/98515-queen-shireen-and-the-shaggydog/ .

A Queen Shireen is currently my best guess for who sits on the Throne when the series is done. Martin won't pick any character who has been front and center so far, but he also wants a character who makes sense.

Plus, pair her with Rickon and you have a great power couple.

/speculation

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Here's some actual speculation: http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/98515-queen-shireen-and-the-shaggydog/ .

A Queen Shireen is currently my best guess for who sits on the Throne when the series is done. Martin won't pick any character who has been front and center so far, but he also wants a character who makes sense.

Plus, pair her with Rickon and you have a great power couple.

/speculation

i love this speculation. i love shireen and i hated how the book really spelled doom and gloom for her. the show is so completely opposite. gives me hope...

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Here's some actual speculation: http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/98515-queen-shireen-and-the-shaggydog/ .

A Queen Shireen is currently my best guess for who sits on the Throne when the series is done. Martin won't pick any character who has been front and center so far, but he also wants a character who makes sense.

Plus, pair her with Rickon and you have a great power couple.

/speculation

I like it. I think the fact that Davos is looking to retrieve Rickon as well makes it somewhat poetic - the hand of the king looking for the Princess' potential future husband.

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i love this speculation. i love shireen and i hated how the book really spelled doom and gloom for her. the show is so completely opposite. gives me hope...

My theory is Val made that up to get Dalla's baby out of there

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I'm hoping that the series motivates GRRM to better flesh out Shireen in the same way as he plans on doing with Osha.

i see it a little differently. i'm hoping the series is fleshing out shireen better because they know her endgame.

My theory is Val made that up to get Dalla's baby out of there

i got the worried feeling about shireen before val got on the scene. :frown5:

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i see it a little differently. i'm hoping the series is fleshing out shireen better because they know her endgame.

i got the worried feeling about shireen before val got on the scene. :frown5:

All my theories are crackpottish.

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Anyone wondering if HBO is feeling sorry? I got a Stannis shirt from the mail, which is odd since I ordered one over a month ago and it has already arrived. So now I have two Stannis shirts and I only paid for one. Maybe they'll send me another by the time of episode 9, because then it would be Stannis, Stannis, STANNIS! Has anyone else gotten free stuff from HBO?


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Anyone wondering if HBO is feeling sorry? I got a Stannis shirt from the mail, which is odd since I ordered one over a month ago and it has already arrived. So now I have two Stannis shirts and I only paid for one. Maybe they'll send me another by the time of episode 9, because then it would be Stannis, Stannis, STANNIS! Has anyone else gotten free stuff from HBO?

Oh my God, a few minutes ago I laughed about this and thought "Ooh, cool!... Cripes! I have also two Stannis shirts (one from HBO, one from redbubbe), but I've had to pay both *pout*" and "Haha, a third STANNIS! shirt for episode 9 would be very funny :lol: " (Although I REALLY hope, they won't give any reasons for apologies with this Ep.)...

...but now, a few minutes after your post I got a packet from "HBO Shop Europe" (I'm from Germany, and always order by HBO UK), and in this packet: A "Brienne of Tarth" shirt (with the Tarth sigil), which is cool - I like Brienne very, very much (my mother loves her, so maybe I will make her a present of it. I already have too many fan shirts XD) - but I DIDN'T order it! :stunned: I have no idea, why HBO did this...

Is that some sort of marketing strategy? Or an apology, like "Oh well, sorry guys for Jaime-raping-Cersei, Stannis-burning-infidels, the-not-really-good-third-Episode, Tyrion-being-Saint-Tyrion, Dany-probably-continue-to-be-Ms. Jesus-forever,..."?

I mean, free stuff, that's fine by me, I'm just wondering about it, too :dunno:

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Yeah because there is anything to debate with a stubborn person such as yourself. You've already made your mind up about D&D "fanfiction". I've let my opinion be known about Stannis and the show adaption in other threads and I don't feel like re-hashing the same arguments over and over again with a person as deluded as you and your coven of fellow circle-jerk reactionaries. I'll leave the lynch mob to it.

Oh man. I've never heard that one before. Priceless. Lol

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Oh my God, a few minutes ago I laughed about this and thought "Ooh, cool!... Cripes! I have also two Stannis shirts (one from HBO, one from redbubbe), but I've had to pay both *pout*" and "Haha, a third STANNIS! shirt for episode 9 would be very funny :lol: " (Although I REALLY hope, they won't give any reasons for apologies with this Ep.)...

...but now, a few minutes after your post I got a packet from "HBO Shop Europe" (I'm from Germany, and always order by HBO UK), and in this packet: A "Brienne of Tarth" shirt (with the Tarth sigil), which is cool - I like Brienne very, very much (my mother loves her, so maybe I will make her a present of it. I already have too many fan shirts XD) - but I DIDN'T order it! :stunned: I have no idea, why HBO did this...

Is that some sort of marketing strategy? Or an apology, like "Oh well, sorry guys for Jaime-raping-Cersei, Stannis-burning-infidels, the-not-really-good-third-Episode, Tyrion-being-Saint-Tyrion, Dany-probably-continue-to-be-Ms. Jesus-forever,..."?

I mean, free stuff, that's fine by me, I'm just wondering about it, too :dunno:

This can't be a coincidence can it? :stunned: Mine came from HBO shop Europe as well. My dad (who watches the show) was like: "dah faqs that?" I wouldn't blame the show this time because my dad didn't even know Tyrion's name after over 3 seasons.

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This can't be a coincidence can it? :stunned: Mine came from HBO shop Europe as well. My dad (who watches the show) was like: "dah faqs that?" I wouldn't blame the show this time because my dad didn't even know Tyrion's name after over 3 seasons.

Very strange :blink: ...Tcha, but if they're really free, I wouldn't say no, would I?

Haha, my mother was for a long time just the same. She always only said "The protagonist's little daughter", "The king's wife's twin brother", "The black haired / fat / small /... guy", aso. Luckily, that has changed now :-)

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or not. the scenes in the north are really stannis' time to shine. it might be best to strip him of a buddy.

That'd be cool. Lose the really heavy Angel/Devil dynamic and show what Stannis is like without people whispering in his ear constantly, so people can get a sense of what he's really like when he's not suddenly leaning one way, and then the other.

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