drayrock Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 DB and Benioff really articulated something well in the Vanity Fair article. They said they'd heard somewhere this concept of someone being in the Air Traffic Control Tower of a story, meaning, they really enjoy when they read/watch something and it feels like everything has its place for a reason and from the beginning there was a clear plan and ending, and each piece had a part to play in that ending. Someone is in the tower, seeing all the planes from start to finish and orchestrating their arrivals and departures appropriately. This is exactly why I love ASOIF. All the foreshadowing and hints from day one. That being said I think for all Db and Benioff's appreciation they are really blowing it on utilizing things Martin already planted to give this feel. 1. They have now twice failed to include the blue flower on the wall (house of undying and Bran's vision) Choosing instead more dull hints in dialogue like Oberyn's discussion of Rhaegar leaving Ellia "for another woman". They could have done that if they wanted to and in addition, just as easily thrown the image of the blue rose on the wall. And maybe next season included a bit where someone with knowledge of Lyana referenced it (say when all the north is gathered at Winterfell). Instead they include straightforward iron throne with snow on it, doesn't take much depth to get the multiple meanings there. 2. They completely eliminated the story of the frog knight. Would have been a great way to set up howland and give some hints as to the backstory of robert's rebellion and everyone's roles in it without giving away too much. It functioned great like that in the books and would have translated easily. Not to mention give the reed's some screen time and character development.3. They refuse to include any prophecies or at the very least dreams. It was these subtle hints they made me love GOT. I want them to include them. They can redeem with Bran. They need to...It's part of what makes the series great and what makes a great show. Just look at BB... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
averde Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 Maybe these "hints" aren't actually hints at all then and mean nothing. D&D know how the books wrap up so maybe their cutting some red herring foreshadowing or stuff that we as fans read into too much and in the end actually means nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moët Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 Maybe these "hints" aren't actually hints at all then and mean nothing. D&D know how the books wrap up so maybe their cutting some red herring foreshadowing or stuff that we as fans read into too much and in the end actually means nothing.This. Peter Jackson & Co cut Tom Bombadil because while he's a great character on the page, he doesn't drive the plot forward in any way, and time is precious in a visual medium. Oberyn talking about Elia and her kids gives us a lot more info about Rheagar's story than a blue rose would at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Zee Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 Maybe these "hints" aren't actually hints at all then and mean nothing. D&D know how the books wrap up so maybe their cutting some red herring foreshadowing or stuff that we as fans read into too much and in the end actually means nothing. 10,000 likes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bold Barry Whitebeard Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 Maybe these "hints" aren't actually hints at all then and mean nothing. D&D know how the books wrap up so maybe their cutting some red herring foreshadowing or stuff that we as fans read into too much and in the end actually means nothing. *clap clap clap* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chebyshov Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 Bloodraven's been cast for this season, meaning Bran's going to be in treeform earlier than we expected. Exposition is coming. There's time for them to drop the "hints." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strong Belwas! Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 I am hoping that Bran's extended story line will include some of the prophecies and symbolism. Bran's greenseer vision in episode 2 was pretty cool. I would imagine shooting the dream sequences could get complicated and expensive which could be a reason why they have not been included. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkash Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 Yeah, that's I always thought : except if they go straight to Winds' territory for Bran next season, they'll have a lot of free time and room (not to mention the perfect way) to show those symbolic images and those hints at the past ! I'm really looking forward to Bran's story arc this season and the next ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natalie Underfoot Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 I just always assumed that the way they do Bran's story will involve that type of information. Also, it would work better to have it in a more concrete form, than the way it's dropped throughout the books. So much happens on this show and the avg viewer will get lost in the muck. This is all my hope. I think we also will have to be prepared for stuff we deemed as important not coming to fruition and finding this out on the show vs the books which just kinda sucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northbound2.0 Posted April 22, 2014 Share Posted April 22, 2014 While I agree with the OP; regarding all the dreams and visions, there is still ample time for these events to occur. Bran's story arc has been sped up for this reason IMHO. Of course D&D, could have brought some of these events in to play much earlier. But I feel this was done on purpose. Why would they want to show these ideas and visions so early on and have viewers set them aside or forget them all together. I think, when they start going in to these moments, they want them as fresh as possible, in the minds of viewers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drayrock Posted April 22, 2014 Author Share Posted April 22, 2014 *clap clap clap* This.Peter Jackson & Co cut Tom Bombadil because while he's a great character on the page, he doesn't drive the plot forward in any way, and time is precious in a visual medium.Oberyn talking about Elia and her kids gives us a lot more info about Rheagar's story than a blue rose would at this point. This.Peter Jackson & Co cut Tom Bombadil because while he's a great character on the page, he doesn't drive the plot forward in any way, and time is precious in a visual medium.Oberyn talking about Elia and her kids gives us a lot more info about Rheagar's story than a blue rose would at this point. Maybe these "hints" aren't actually hints at all then and mean nothing. D&D know how the books wrap up so maybe their cutting some red herring foreshadowing or stuff that we as fans read into too much and in the end actually means nothing.I will laugh at you all when the reveal happens. The blue rose is the one I think that is basically fact. So well done, so subtle. What do you guys not believe R+L=J?While I think your foolish not to, there is literary backing as well. It's literally an allusion to the Illiad and the start of that war being over a woman...and george just elaborated making his hero the result of this allusion. Genius. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drayrock Posted April 22, 2014 Author Share Posted April 22, 2014 I just always assumed that the way they do Bran's story will involve that type of information. Also, it would work better to have it in a more concrete form, than the way it's dropped throughout the books. So much happens on this show and the avg viewer will get lost in the muck. This is all my hope. I think we also will have to be prepared for stuff we deemed as important not coming to fruition and finding this out on the show vs the books which just kinda sucks. That is my hope. I think it will be a way to get these in, along with history, and also stall getting into too much winds material. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Zee Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I will laugh at you all when the reveal happens. The blue rose is the one I think that is basically fact. So well done, so subtle. What do you guys not believe R+L=J?While I think your foolish not to, there is literary backing as well. It's literally an allusion to the Illiad and the start of that war being over a woman...and george just elaborated making his hero the result of this allusion. Genius. When I was a kid i read a short novel about a bastard son of a king who didnt know he was the bastard son of a king . He had a number of adventures and then became king himself. He never did learn that he was the son of the king. I personally suspect that's what GRRM is going for. The reader will know, but the characters probably never will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drayrock Posted April 25, 2014 Author Share Posted April 25, 2014 When I was a kid i read a short novel about a bastard son of a king who didnt know he was the bastard son of a king . He had a number of adventures and then became king himself. He never did learn that he was the son of the king. I personally suspect that's what GRRM is going for. The reader will know, but the characters probably never will. That's be cool in it's now right but I think it will be revealed in some way to more than just the reader. Maybe not to Jon but to someone....perhaps Danny. And she won't tell him for some reason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBucket Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 When I was a kid i read a short novel about a bastard son of a king who didnt know he was the bastard son of a king . He had a number of adventures and then became king himself. He never did learn that he was the son of the king. I personally suspect that's what GRRM is going for. The reader will know, but the characters probably never will. I like this and think you could be on to something. I'm not that interested in theories tbh but R+L=J is fairly unavoidable. I think the theory itself is probably correct but the relevance of it has always bothered me. As far as I'm aware (and please correct me if I'm wrong) but Howland Reed is considered to be the only, high-ranking, person who knows the truth? Given Howland Reed is the lord of the frog men who hasn't left Greywater Watch since the end of the rebellion, why would anyone care about or believe what he has to say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Desmond Wine's Bane Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 I like this and think you could be on to something. I'm not that interested in theories tbh but R+L=J is fairly unavoidable. I think the theory itself is probably correct but the relevance of it has always bothered me. As far as I'm aware (and please correct me if I'm wrong) but Howland Reed is considered to be the only, high-ranking, person who knows the truth? Given Howland Reed is the lord of the frog men who hasn't left Greywater Watch since the end of the rebellion, why would anyone care about or believe what he has to say? I suspect once Bran transmits it across the Weirnet it will gain credibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CyvasseMaster Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 Are D&D foreshadowing Leyton Hightower ... :uhoh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drayrock Posted April 25, 2014 Author Share Posted April 25, 2014 I like this and think you could be on to something. I'm not that interested in theories but R+L=J is fairly unavoidable. I think the theory itself is probably correct but the relevance of it has always bothered me. As far as I'm aware (and please correct me if I'm wrong) but Howland Reed is considered to be the only, high-ranking, person who knows the truth? Given Howland Reed is the lord of the frog men who hasn't left Greywater Watch since the end of the rebellion, why would anyone care about or believe what he has to say?I agree. I struggle to find it's relevance if the real threat is WW. I think the point is that it is just the plain fact that ice and fire came together by fate/love/rhaegars premonition to create Jon, the one person who by happenstance or the gods ends up staying comitted to defending the wall (I'd rather him not get some power that helps as AA, I think his normal ness makes the prophecy cool--it is his decisions to resist temptation of leaving and instead to face the real threat that makes him a hero), which ironicAlly only occurred Bc he was viewed a bastard AND not the king. That being said, I do think it was structured and planned too well to not be revealed in some way. Just subtle enough that not everyone gets it but enough hints that he leaves it there for the reader to figure out. It should have some bearing. Even if it's just Danny discovering, and that being the straw that allows her to forgive the Starks and take the WWs on as opposed to sitting the iron throne. I don't think it will be howland. Perhaps bran in some way....or the ghost of winterfell lolz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cold Crashing Waves Posted April 27, 2014 Share Posted April 27, 2014 R+L=J is pretty much a lock but there's less room for subtlety in television. Little hints like the blue rose aren't as easy or effective to pull off like they are in the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boojam Posted April 27, 2014 Share Posted April 27, 2014 Peter Jackson & Co cut Tom Bombadil because while he's a great character on the page, he doesn't drive the plot forward in any way, and time is precious in a visual medium. I hated Tom Bombadil, I hope that is also why Peter Jackson cut him! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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