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[Book Spoilers] EP404 Discussion


Ran
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Don't think so, those are the real Others, the Great Other is a god, like the Stranger, the Red God etc... Everything else appears to have been just undead. The dead guys on the horses look like raised dead, who had been mummified. But they look like dead mummified humans these guys look like a different race which the Others are and there is more than one of them, there was a whole line of them.

But how do you know that? In the Red God mythos, the Great Other is a god, but we have never been told the story from a WW's perspective. To them, maybe this 'Great Other' is just their king and they don't have a 'God' per se.

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The ending was shocking, for sure. Book six spoilers? I would not have imagined this at all, but I am not disappointed. I love new stuff... I didn't think I would, but I loved being shocked. The lack of hair, lack of major wrinkles, and thorns on the head make me think this might be the Night's King.

I absolutely loved the Sansa scene. She's a critical thinker, she's analyzing LF's actions and the mechanisms of the game.

Jaime's palpable longing for Brienne was touching. Great acting in that scene.

Margaery talking to Tommen - I hope they don't sexualize this situation, he's only 12 in the book. But the cat was cute, Tommen is adorable, and I love Marg.

Not enough emphasis on the taking of Meereen. I feel like they could have dragged that out for a few episodes to kill some time.

Poor Bran. Jojen is so sick. Will he die sooner rather than later?

I really hope the show doesn't lose viewers after this amazing episode. If anyone quits watching after this, I question their taste. :)

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Yes. So doge. My brain is so doge right now i cant even.

Yeah it was all so different i was like "what are they even doing?" But i think theres a reason despite my rage at Ghost being chained up. I...just...Other...

My mind is Other.

Craster's Keep stuff was among the darkest shit on this show so far. Something about that was just...dark. Moreso than even the Sept scene. It almost looks like the Others are doing those babies a favor. Thats the creepiest thing about all of this. *chills*

Craster's Keep stuff gave me the creeps. You had Karl drinking from Joers Skull, which is creepy. Then you had rape, which always disturbing,then you had Karl tossing the foot or whatever at Rast. plusthe stuff with Bran and the Baby.

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Just am wondering how they are going to expand this in TWOW, and also wonder how they are going to show "The Others" in the future of the show now that they have given it away already!

They gave it away in the first scene of the pilot, man. What's the issue?

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I think too much is being made of the changes to Bran's story. This is clearly a case of needing to keep the character busy for a couple of episodes since he does not have much material to work through. Nothing consequential is going to come of Bran's capture, which is precisely why Meera was not raped, Hoder was not killed, and so forth.



As book readers, this amounts to empty calories, so it does not really work for us. That said, the grand majority of television viewers are not book readers, so they really do have a stake in this storyline and do not know what will come of it.


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This, the more the show starts to surpass the books, the ore watchers will be interested to tune in and catch the new, unspoiled developments.

this is true - I watch with a friend who has also read the books and she said it was so weird to be watching like a non-book reader and not knowing what was going to happen

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  • This was an episode that had lots of changes from the books. I am a book purist, but I felt that a lot of the changes worked.

I really liked the expanded role of Grey Worm in causing the slaves to rise.

I liked Barristan’s advice to Dany, which of course she ignored. Was it just me or does he seem to have some doubt about Dany as a ruler?

Jaime’s getting quite good with the left-hand sword. And I have to say that NCW looked really handsome in this episode!

I love Bronn as Jaime's conscience and I like the reminder that Tyrion wanted Jaime has his champion during his first trial. One of the things I find interesting is that Jaime is never really there when his siblings are counting on him (I am especially bitter about Cersei’s letter in AFFC)

I’m glad that there was a convo between Jaime and Tyrion but it looks like “she’s been fucking Lancel, Kettleblack and Moonboy” will not happen.

I love this foreshadowing: “Sansa is not a killer—not yet, anyway”

Petyr and Sansa –I thought I was going to vomit when Petyr stroked Sansa’s arm while talking about what he wanted. I did like her faith in Tyrion and vice versa. Perhaps that’s foreshadowing a future rapprochement between Sansa and Tyrion.

How much do I love Olenna the Sex Goddess? However, I hate that she's leaving KL

I’m not sure if I like Olenna’s confession so soon. People were really enjoying their theories about who killed Joffrey.

As many people predicted, the little boy from Mole Town is a good archer. I think he’s a Satin replacement. They got rid of Satin because they were concerned about Jon/Satin shippers, and no one will think about sex between Jon and this mentee!

Locke has made it to the NW! I really thought he would pretend to have fought for Robb. I think that’s a missed opportunity to play on Jon’s sympathies.

I literally clapped at the mention of Ser Pounce!

I actually liked Marg’s seduction of Tommen. Now the aging up of Tommen makes sense. I may have a filthy mind, but I was really afraid she was going to perform a sex act on him. Really glad that did not happen. The actor looks 14!

Oathkeeper was awesome and there were definitely a few moments between Brienne and Jaime—clearly foreshadowing a future between the two. I am not a Jaime/Brienne shipper, but I hope people who are enjoyed the fodder.

I’m glad they cut out the part about Pod following Brienne—this was much easier. Is this the first time we’ve seen Pod smiling? I loved it, and the fact that he got Tyrion’s axe.

Jon knows about Bran! I really like this change, but I would have liked to see the celebration/conflict in Jon when he found out. I feel we’re really being robbed of some good opportunities for real emotion in the show. I really hope that Jon actually meets Bran at Craster’s Keep. I am a book purist, but if they’re going to make changes in the show, this is one I’d love to see. I’m afraid that Summer getting caught just when he found Ghost was a prediction that the brothers’ reunion would be thwarted at the last minute.

I really loved the charismatic Jon during the call for volunteers!!! It really reminded me of “I have my swords, and we’re coming for you, bastard!”—which is my favorite Jon moment. It was great foreshadowing of the future vote, but I kinda preferred when that vote was out of the blue.

When I realized that Gin Alley Guy was drinking from Jeor Mormont’s skull, I wanted to jump through my TV screen and murder him myself. I really want him to die horribly!

Was it just me, or was anyone else disgusted with them actually showing the raping on screen?

I actually felt sorry for Rast with that guy threatening to rape him…until he threw away water when Ghost was thirsty. I want him to die horribly too! I also want them all to die for hurting Hodor.

I liked the baby boy and the reminder that Craster sacrifices his sons to white walkers. I was hoping that Summer would somehow rescue the baby. Not sure what Bran and Co, would do with him…

Finally a Ghost sighting! I’m glad they had a real reason for not showing him.

I was confused at the end. I thought that guy on a horse was an Other, not a wight. If so, to whom was he sacrificing the baby? Are they making the Others victims to some darker force?

He wasn't a Wight..., he was riding a wight horse, but he was a White Walker, perhaps making a sacrifice to the Great Other or something similar.

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It makes no sense that the mutineers would keep Ghost alive when by their own admission they don't have enough food.



It's weird that, despite making TV!Margaery much more of an active schemer than Book!Margaery, she wasn't involved in the assassination, even though the book version really had to have been at least passively aware of it.



Ser Pounce! Okay, I'll forgive the show a lot for that.


Edited by Colonel Green
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I wonder if that ending was a sign that the 6th book is coming out sooner rather than later (relatively speaking).

Plenty of book readers watch the show and if they stop watching because of the shows speed....

I can dream.

Anyway, I just hate the entire Craster's Keep storyline.

Just an unbelievable waste of time imo.

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Pardon me if this has already been discussed. Ive read most pages and did not see anything.



Pardons also if I sound like a newb, I admit I am not a GoT Master Scholar.



But, I know of rumors about Benjen being Coldhands. Was that cold hands in the last scene? The camera seemed to have lingered on his hands. I know one show of course was with the child, but the other seemed to have lingered on the opposite hand holding the chain. Then from the posterior view of him his hair seemed to be fashioned like they had Benjen's in season one.

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I think too much is being made of the changes to Bran's story. This is clearly a case of needing to keep the character busy for a couple of episodes since he does not have much material to work through. Nothing consequential is going to come of Bran's capture, which is precisely why Meera was not raped, Hoder was not killed, and so forth.

As book readers, this amounts to empty calories, so it does not really work for us. That said, the grand majority of television viewers are not book readers, so they really do have a stake in this storyline and do not know what will come of it.

Agreed. It's a harmless addition.

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