(Book Spoilers ) - Queen of Thorns

[Tyrion Hand of the King]

Because it suggested something else.

Doesn't it suggest that she also fiddled with Sansa's necklace and took the stone at that moment? I feel like you're reading into it too much. Sometimes the show has to spell things out for the viewers a little more than the books do. I really didn't find it to be that "over-done" anyway.

[Envie]

Doesn't it suggest that she also fiddled with Sansa's necklace and took the stone at that moment? I feel like you're reading into it too much. Sometimes the show has to spell things out for the viewers a little more than the books do. I really didn't find it to be that "over-done" anyway.

Yeah I agree - they did that to 'spell it out' more for viewers who probably missed the clues before and during the wedding feast. Sure, Littlefinger goes on to admit the necklace was poisoned but a lot of viewers aren't going to connect Littlefinger to the Tyrells as conspirators unless they make it blatantly obvious. They don't want her to 'say it' (that's why she shushed Margaery) - but they want the audience to have their "A-ha!" moment. I think it worked fine. It was probably only 'over done' to those of us book fanatics who already know it all and don't feel the need to be bashed over the head. Unsullied don't have that prior detail.

[Hangover of the Morning]

I am going to miss her but I feel that she has already exhausted her repertoire of witty one-liners and any more would just be too much. All she does is take leisurely strolls through the very same garden and suck IQ out of anyone she has conversation with.

[Roose Seal]

I'm glad she's gone. While I liked the actress, I thought her dialogue was terribly overwrought, broke the fourth wall too often and was not nearly as clever as the writers thought it was.

[Mad Monkey]

cool idea! I always wondered how the poisoning could be done without risking Margaerys life!

[teemo]

She'll probably come back for Tywin's funeral.

[anizzle]

It was LF's plan. He just made Olenna think it was her idea.

I didn't get the impression that Olenna had any problem with the 'Kill Joffery' Plan, or that LF had to do any real heavy lifting to get her on board with it.

[Envie]

I didn't get the impression that Olenna had any problem with the 'Kill Joffery' Plan, or that LF had to do any real heavy lifting to get her on board with it.

Right, that's always been Littlefinger's tactic - find willing partners who already have motivation to do what he wants. He even says that to Sansa in their talk on the ship when she's questioning his motives and calling bullshit on him. He tells her that he doesn't want clever friends (though I would argue Olenna is quite clever), he wants easily manipulated friends who are good and happy with their reasons. He capitalized on the fact that Sansa confessed Joffrey's true personality to Olenna and Margaery and arranged to have Joffrey disposed of before he could do the same to Margaery. As Olenna tells Margaery - there was no way she was going to allow that monster to put his hands on her the way he had Sansa.

Olenna's motives are not only for her granddaughter's safety but also so that the Tyrells can move forward in power. She's basically the female version of Tywin Lannister.

[Iralius]

I will miss her like hell. I wonder if she'll take on Willas' or Garlan's role in the future, when Euron attacks the Reach

I wasn't even thinking that but now that you mention it... I have an image of Ironborn storming part of the Reach and Olenna back in a camp, in a suit of (mocked-up, foam and etc.) armour watching with pursed lips. "This wouldn't have happened if we were something other than a rose."

[CandleWisps]

Yeah I agree - they did that to 'spell it out' more for viewers who probably missed the clues before and during the wedding feast. Sure, Littlefinger goes on to admit the necklace was poisoned but a lot of viewers aren't going to connect Littlefinger to the Tyrells as conspirators unless they make it blatantly obvious. They don't want her to 'say it' (that's why she shushed Margaery) - but they want the audience to have their "A-ha!" moment. I think it worked fine. It was probably only 'over done' to those of us book fanatics who already know it all and don't feel the need to be bashed over the head. Unsullied don't have that prior detail.

This ^^

[Skore]

I'm actually surprised they left out Littlefinger asking Sansa if she remembered anyone coming to adjust her necklace (hairnet) in their little chat. Would have been quite a good comeback for Petyr to give Sansa when she called him out on his BS.

[VladimirDulud]

I hope. But I'm going to miss her dearly. The One True Queen :bawl:

Also, a bit off-topic, but this thread is as good as any. It seems they're setting up some kind of alliance between LF and the Tyrells, but in the books I always got the sense that he merely used them to kill Joff and that they had no secret contact with one another. What do you think?

It seems odd that as a single agent, LF has the range and flexibility that he does, within a relatively strict power structure.

Or perhaps it's because he's backed by no one that he generates that dexterity?

The Tyrells seem opaque to me. More light is shed on them in the show than in the books, and we're all the better for it.

[VladimirDulud]

It cues that Olenna did it, sure. But that was well established with her line, "but I do". The chain tug was extraneous and I think, misleading. Someone who was only a show viewer would've had to take note and remember Olenna playing with Sansa's chain at the wedding to place that connection. Otherwise, they would have to know from the books or from a book reader.

It's called a visual echo. Many filmmakers do it, especially film noirs, to draw subtle parallels between objects and actions in a film. It's a neat little trick that should jog the audience's memory on a subliminal level.

[Good Guy Garlan]

I wasn't even thinking that but now that you mention it... I have an image of Ironborn storming part of the Reach and Olenna back in a camp, in a suit of (mocked-up, foam and etc.) armour watching with pursed lips. "This wouldn't have happened if we were something other than a rose."

This would be great! I hope we get something like this in TWoW, like the perspective of Euron's attack of Highgarden from Olenna's POV. We could see HIghgarden and Willas at last, and maybe even know more about the past, like who was the Targ Olenna was supposed to marry and other interesting tidbits. And it would be hilarious, I bet

[Lord Damian]

Since the show does not have Willas or Garlan existing at all and the iron born seemingly in the opening stages of a full scall invasion of the Reach, it possibly suggests willas and garlan are expendable which is a big clue as to the fate of highgarden in the near future books.

[FNF]

Honestly, I don't see the Ironborn-Reach conflict amounting to much before any possible intervention from Dany or Aegon, although I can see the Tyrells being wiped out at some point just like the Gardeners.

[Hippocras]

Honestly, I don't see the Ironborn-Reach conflict amounting to much before any possible intervention from Dany or Aegon, although I can see the Tyrells being wiped out at some point just like the Gardeners.

Either wiped out or becoming Norther refugees like the Manderlys.

One possibility I have been entertaining is that Loras found out about the threat in the North when he took Dragonstone and discovered them mining dragon glass. I do not think he is injured, I think the Tyrells are plotting their next move, so needed to give Loras an alibi to stay away from KL. Their next move might be a move on the North with LF but against Stannis.

That might result in them being around for the fight against the Others. That in turn might win them some northern concessions just as they are losing their holdings in the Reach.

[Mrs.Grumpy]

Since the show does not have Willas or Garlan existing at all and the iron born seemingly in the opening stages of a full scall invasion of the Reach, it possibly suggests willas and garlan are expendable which is a big clue as to the fate of highgarden in the near future books.

GRRM said they have roles to play, and it will create an another butterfly effect. So I doubt that they will just die? Especially Willas, I mean I expect big things from this dude, he is a cripple remember? Cripples are bamfs.

[Dany's Silver]

Either wiped out or becoming Norther refugees like the Manderlys.

One possibility I have been entertaining is that Loras found out about the threat in the North when he took Dragonstone and discovered them mining dragon glass. I do not think he is injured, I think the Tyrells are plotting their next move, so needed to give Loras an alibi to stay away from KL. Their next move might be a move on the North with LF but against Stannis.

That might result in them being around for the fight against the Others. That in turn might win them some northern concessions just as they are losing their holdings in the Reach.

I liked the idea of the Tyrell's learning about the threat at the Wall, but I suspect that Margaery would have wanted Loras to be her champion. Loras pretending to be near-death puts his sister at risk, which does nothing to strengthen them.

GRRM said they have roles to play, and it will create an another butterfly effect. So I doubt that they will just die? Especially Willas, I mean I expect big things from this dude, he is a cripple remember? Cripples are bamfs.

This! I missed seeing Garlan in KL, so I wonder if Olenna will be the one rallying the troops and kicking some Ironborn ass. :)

[LSM]

Either wiped out or becoming Norther refugees like the Manderlys.

One possibility I have been entertaining is that Loras found out about the threat in the North when he took Dragonstone and discovered them mining dragon glass. I do not think he is injured, I think the Tyrells are plotting their next move, so needed to give Loras an alibi to stay away from KL. Their next move might be a move on the North with LF but against Stannis.

That might result in them being around for the fight against the Others. That in turn might win them some northern concessions just as they are losing their holdings in the Reach.

And then Jon marries Margaery and they take a blue rose as their sigil. Ehh? Ehh?