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A Character you don't understand why the fandom/forum likes and hates?


TheBadboy

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Oh ok my apologies for the mix up then. I obviously don't know Martin's feelings on him, it's just speculating on my part.

No worries, my post did look quite confrontational.

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Because varys fucking sucks

I don't dislike Varys as much as I dislike the people who think he's some omniscient god. As of right now, we don't have a reason to believe that other people aren't playing the game just as well as he is, if not better.

I'll really dislike Varys though if (when) something happens to Tommen :(

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-helped Aerys into an early grave

-made no attempt to save Elia and her son (he mentioned that his little birds witnessed the scene of her death)

-raised a kid to believe that he is the son of a dead prince in order to start a war

-sold a young girl to a horselord (letting her to be raped)

so, do you only like characters who are moral virgins?

I don't think people like the characters they like on the basis of the characters' being good people. I like Varys (a lot) and don't give a shit about any of those things you mention (as it pertains to my reasons for liking him, which relate to how I like the way he thinks and the design of his strategy).

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Nowhere near 90% against her. I'd say it's about an even 50-50 on here, while in the broader public, she's the favorite of nearly everyone.

The broader public are show watchers, I'm talking about book readers. And yes, 90% was an exaggeration, but not by much.

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I figured you'd like Varys since he's the one person we can say with certainty doesn't have a bigger dick than Stannis. Being as how everything always comes back to how Stannis' dick measures against everyone else's in your view.

So cold.

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Nictarion, Martin is making Stannis fight Lannisters first, and then Bolton and Freys. How can you say Martin is not expecting love for the character? He delivers a red wedding, and later puts Stannis against this guys.

If it was not enough, he is making Jon to cheer for, advice, and help him.

Well he was fighting Tyrion in ACoK (Martin's fav) who is much more loved then he is.
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so, do you only like characters who are moral virgins?

I don't think people like the characters they like on the basis of the characters' being good people. I like Varys (a lot) and don't give a shit about any of those things you mention (as it pertains to my reasons for liking him, which relate to how I like the way he thinks and the design of his strategy).

Not truly. Most of my favourite characters are grey. There gradations of evil though; I have a penchant to dislike the worst.

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Like: Sansa.

I know she's getting smarter, but I still don't get how people can love her.

Hate: Arya.

Maybe that explains why I don't care for Sansa. Maybe the ones who love Sansa don't like Arya. :dunno:

I absolutely love her. <3

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I will never understand the over the top hatred for Dany and Cat.

I can understand why people like pretty much all the characters as most of them are so great. That being said, I don't think GRRM really wrote Stannis to be so well liked, and I have a suspicion it's probably similar to how Alan Moore was so surprised by people liking Rorschach.

I am not judging you on your stand, you like who like, but Martin says Stannis is a hero, if wasn't D&D would have to work so hard to demonize his character.
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Not truly. Most of my favourite characters are grey. There gradations of evil though; I have a penchant to dislike the worst.

But then is it that inconceivable that others find something appealing in those characters, since "grey" means that there's good and bad?

I'm sorry to have isolated your posts; others are making the same sort of arguments you were in putting this into morality terms, and I responded to yours simply because I wasn't under the impression that Varys evoked strong feelings in most posters.

At any rate, I'm willing to bet morality plays a very small role in why readers like the characters they like, but for some reason, discussion always comes back to those terms. Maybe because it's the most quantifiable to explain. But I think it's probably totally inaccurate in getting to the bottom of why people like who they like.

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Well he was fighting Tyrion in ACoK (Martin's fav) who is much more loved then he is.

And people liked Tyrion even though he was fighting the Starks, and it's pretty clear that Martin wants the readers to like both the Starks and Tyrion. BTW currently among book readers I think Stannis is more loved than Tyrion.

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Huh, someone hates the gruesomely exploited slaves? Or is it just the concept of the Unsullied that people think a bit far-fetched or over the top?

I think The Santa of House Claus was referring to the Unsullied: people who watch the show but have never read (and probably never will read) the books.

I can see why some characters are liked (even loved) or disliked, but I don't understand the rage against some of them like Dany. Cat gets too much flak over one incident with Jon, according to GRRM that was the only time she was mean to him. I don't get the extreme Rhaegar and Lyanna hate either. They're dead, and we hardly know anything about them. And people make Elia out to be a saint and we know even less about her than we do about R and L.

I suppose the whole concept of truly feeling hate for a fictional character is baffling to me.

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