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[Book Spoilers] EP406 Discussion


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In the books and show, Berric Dondarrion and crew knew she was alive and looking to go to Riverrun (before the Red Wedding)..

Because one of the BwB was a former Stark guardsman Harwin who knew her quite well. IIRC Arya also revealed herself to him immediately, thinking that she finally found somebody who was unreservedly on her side.

In AFFC, Brienne hears rumors that The Hound was with a high-born girl (whom she assumes is Sansa) when she is looking at the Saltpans. .

Rumors coming from the same source - the BwB, who knew very well that Sandor stole Arya from them.

So, yea, the mere knews that Sandor was travelling with some ragged girl wouldn't have had anybody thinking of Arya.

They did some odd stuff in season 2, where it looked as if Littlefinger recognized Arya when visiting Tywin in Harrenhal, but there was no follow-up on his part whatsoever, so it seems like itwas just a quick way to ratchet tension a little.

If Varys had known Arya's whereabouts, he would have grabbed her for future use, or tried to.

Edited by Maia
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The TV show has its own canon but in the books, there is a very interesting theory that Cersei tried to poison Tyrion with the pigeon pie but Joffrey came and ate it. So, Joffrey died before the Tyrell plot was played.


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The TV show has its own canon but in the books, there is a very interesting theory that Cersei tried to poison Tyrion with the pigeon pie but Joffrey came and ate it. So, Joffrey died before the Tyrell plot was played.

Then what would all of Sansa's dealings with Ser Dontos and LF been about?

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And I say there is no reason that Varys would not get a full report, and no reaons that Varys would not speculate who the girl with the Hound was.

We can disagree, that's cool.

PS Westeros is way bigger than Latin America! GRRM says it's roughly the length of South America.

I don't know if anyone already pointed this out, but I'm sure you meant that Westeros is SMALLER.

Latin American comprises all countries in the Americas were Roman languages (derived from Latin) are principle. It includes countries starting in North America and every country from Central and South America (start at Mexico and move all the way down to Brazil), as well as most islands on the Caribbean and some in the Pacific.

South America is comprised by those countries South of Panama (starting with Colombia) all the way to Brazil. It is a bit over 3 million km2 smaller than Latin America.

Not saying this to give a Geo lesson, just so you get a better grasp of the actual size of Westeros. :)

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Best episode so far! Surely of the season and probably of the whole series. I mean when Tyrion demanded the trial by combat I saw it was 49 minutes already and I was like wow that went quickly!



Loved Bravoos in the opening and the Titan but I pictured Bravoos more like foggy!



Then that Yara/Dreadfort thing. It took her long enough to get there didn't it? And correct me if I'm wrong but, is there sea near the Dreafort? From the credits I think not! Anyway good filler: it gives some screen time to Yara, it pictures how badly changed Theon is already which is good because we don't get his POVs and it shows how mad Ramsay is, I mean, going to battle without any shirt and with this cuts all over his chest! My only doubt is: was that the girl or the actual fight?? haha



I liked how Daenerys was handling the audiences and all but my only complain was Hizdahr. I mean why is he asking for his father? If you make him look like a nice guy who has nice feelings for his father, then it will not have the same effect when she marries him. In the books he seemed to me a total asshole who only cared for money and power. In the episode he was almost begging for his poor father who had not done anything to be buried... Nonsense!


Also I think everyone saying how whitewashed Dany was didn't have much excuse this episode. They clearly showed how she had punished some innocent men and how she didn't liked it but anyway did it.



Liked very much the small council meeting! Oberyn makes up for Littlefinger and Mace is such a bootlicker!



The whole trial was perfect I think. We can see how well Cersei has manipulated the witnesses so that every little thing Tyrion had done was tergiversated. Also it was clear how wounded he was when Varys confessed. I admire your good intentions Jaime but I think the little combat bit ruined your little plan! Oooh and the Shae! I mean, the look in Tyrion's face when he saw her!! And then how everything she said was just a lie with some bit of truth and how Tyrion just completely looses his head and starts shouting! That was greatly done! And of course the "I demand trial by combat".



So very very good episode, enjoyed every bit


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I think it was a wrong move to let Yara see Theon already. It would've been so much better to save it for later like in the books. Also, I somehow miss Theon, haha, because I thought the actor played Theon really well. But yeah, he is doing an amazing job as Reek too. Now that I am watching this after reading it, I really want Martin to eventually let Theon kill Ramsey, there is no way around it!!



Anyway, the episode was GREAT but the Braavos scene... TOP NOTCH. Can't wait for the battle!


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In the books there is so much chaos on the country side that , as George paints it, and I don't remember them running into any high born, so it is not surprising that Arya goes unnoticed.

Well actually , you know, Arya has only three chapters in Feast and only 2(!) in Dance.

(I am not counting Mercy yet.)

Those 5 chapters were my favorites in novels 4 and 5.

They are not short, but I was intrigued every moment, everything seemed off center, and Arya was growing and changing.

The show could do well with Arya's Braavos stuff.

Hear, hear! For me, as well, by far the best parts of Book 4 and Book 5 were the *sob* few Arya chapters, especially as Dany's went rapidly downhill and Tyrion's meandered.

As for the episode itself, I agree with everyone who said that the Dreadfort scene was ridiculous. Ramsay is in a swordfight shirtless and doesn't get a scratch on him? (He has scratches from the rough sex with Myranda beforehand, methinks.) Ridonculously bad. Then it just turns into farce when the Iron Born run away from dogs! Sheesh.

But Peter Dinklage tore up the scenery in the trial scene, I'm still rooting for Charles Dance to get an Emmy. I don't think he has had a bad scene in the show, EVER. The look on Jaime's face when Tywin says quickly "Done!" is PRICELESS.

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late to the party, but just had to say how much I loved the trial. Pycelle was giving me life with his "noble child" line!! Also the sheer bitchy SASS in meryn trant's eyes when he walked pass Tyrion was hilarious. So. good.

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Here is my theory, with less big-ticket unseen backstory, more King's Landingish treachery, and preserves the show's stupid whitewashing of Shae:

Bronn delivers the goods to Shae and tells her she should GTFO, courtesy Tyrion Lannister. What she thinks of this doesn't matter, although probably shocked/appalled/etc., considering how she acted (unreasonably, petulantly and unlikeably and with a bad accent) the last time she even thought he tried to buy her off, although by this time Tyrion has at least breached the notion.

Bronn promptly runs to Tywin (unlikely but quick-acting) or one of Cersei's little birds (much more likely but one degree of separation) to report that Tyrion still has a whore and she accepted a bag o' dragons to make like a tree and leave. Ambitious Bronn is seen as being useful to Top Lion Tywin, who seizes the hooker with the bag of gold and sees a brilliant closer for his show trial. Bronn knows Tyrion's value in KL is dropping fast, even before Joffrey's murder, and makes his move.

Well, I like it, anyway.

Oh, p.s. Looked for Bronn at the trial and could not find him, although his presence may not have been necessary. Still, it was weird.

If this was true, Bronn would not be able to go with Jaime to the Riverlands. And I am pretty sure that Bronn will gonwith Jaime. They have to give Bronn something to do in season 5. Plus Jaime and Bronn are great together.
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If this was true, Bronn would not be able to go with Jaime to the Riverlands. And I am pretty sure that Bronn will gonwith Jaime. They have to give Bronn something to do in season 5. Plus Jaime and Bronn are great together.

^ this is one of my greatest hopes

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I think it was a wrong move to let Yara see Theon already. It would've been so much better to save it for later like in the books. Also, I somehow miss Theon, haha, because I thought the actor played Theon really well. But yeah, he is doing an amazing job as Reek too. Now that I am watching this after reading it, I really want Martin to eventually let Theon kill Ramsey, there is no way around it!!

Anyway, the episode was GREAT but the Braavos scene... TOP NOTCH. Can't wait for the battle!

agreed, but i hope overtime Theon's appearance gets worse to the point where Yara would not even recognize him later...i wish they at least started making him go grey :frown5:

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Great episode.

Theon/Ramsey bath scene was utterly horrific. Great acting by both, especially Alfie Allen. The sexual undertones were really uncomfortable... Especially the way Ramsey smiles at Theons ken doll patch.

I never picked up on a sexual interest Ramsey had in Theon in the books but others did and it seems like D and D did as well.

Tyrion was amazing. The whole trial was brilliant.

Oberyn owns every scene he is in.

I'm not so sure about Mace Tyrels portrayal. He seems extremely incompetent and I never got that impression from the books. He's an oaf. A bit of a buffoon. But he's not any bodies lap dog. I'm not bothered so much though. Different canon.

I cannot wait to see The Mountain.

With a name like 'prince of newcastle', I can safely say we would be at war if we were in Westeros... I'm from Sunderland :devil:

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With a name like 'prince of newcastle', I can safely say we would be at war if we were in Westeros... I'm from Sunderland :devil:

:commie: :commie: I'm from slap bang in the of Newcastle, Sunderland and Durham or thereabouts :lol: (Also, the are Newcastles all over the World, it could be Australia)

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agreed, but i hope overtime Theon's appearance gets worse to the point where Yara would not even recognize him later...i wish they at least started making him go grey :frown5:

I don't think Alfie's going down the Christian Bale path anytime soon, though I'm not certain Reek should have such huge biceps. Someone should tell him to ease up on the weights...

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Varys knows about the girl travelling with the Hound, and he isn't an idiot. And he is certainly omnipresent with his little birds regarding what happens in KL.

PS Littlefinger likely knows as well.

I doubt anyone knows except the crow that has followed them. Really there is absolutely no evidence anyone knows and many think it's a boy. Only Elder Brother, Hound, Arya, and BWB know and they aren't telling, for obvious reasons. If someone knew they'd be after her. Viz - one guy knows about Rickon. Sudden manhunt. (Books)

At least one person might know about Sansa. Or will soon.

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I don't think Alfie's going down the Christian Bale path anytime soon, though I'm not certain Reek should have such huge biceps. Someone should tell him to ease up on the weights...

I'd find it exaggerated for an actor to go through negative physical changes for a TV show - especially when the show doesn't even bother to highlight the Lannister's hair...

My understanding is that with movies there's a lot more money involved, not just for the actor to make their loss worth it; the whole production has a gain if a famous name actor takes a certain part rather than a no-name with more appropriate physique.

Edited by 7th-key
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