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Señor de la Tormenta

Books 5-6 Spoilers: How does Stannis early wealth will affect his further dynamics?

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It gives him some extra money to keep Saan's support, maybe buy some ships, but thats about it. He still has no support among the noble families of Westeros and a paltry fighting force compared to other major players. His story still remains the same even if he has a couple thousand extra soldiers.


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Stannis might start to become a little more flamboyant. Perhaps by purchasing a gilded, jewel=encrusted sword with a naked woman carved on its hilt, or obtaining lots of purple hair dye from Lys.

Next time he smiles he'll have a golden tooth, its part of his master plan to win Daenerys to his cause.

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He might take bigger casualties at the Wall though. HBO viewers guide and Inside episode seem to confirm that Stannis got money from the Iron Bank. It might have just been a token of trust and a possible future relationship. Something along the lines of: "If the Lannisters refuse to pay we'll give you all the gold you need. As a token of friendship take this chest."


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Next time he smiles he'll have a golden tooth, its part of his master plan to win Daenerys to his cause.

One might say he becomes a true flamer.

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Clarifying:



- Stannis claims to have 4000 men ( This might include squires, peasant militia, guards, free-riders, the men who maintain his 32-ship fleet, Storm's End garrison, some of the Storm Lands, etc.)



- The Wildling army is approximately 100000 strong (2.5 times bigger than in the books)



- If the Wildling army is larger by 2.5 compared to the books, then Stannis's cavalry should also be upgraded accordingly. (1500*2.5 = 3750)



- Note that 4000 - 3750 = 250 (Enough to defend Dragonstone)




Negotiation analysis:



The show has not revealed how much gold the Iron Bank is providing Stannis or the details of the negotiation. Do you really think that a bank is just going to lend any rebel Lord money just because his advisor believes he is a good leader ?



Remember the letter that Stannis receives at the end of Season 3? In the books, the Iron Bank is well aware of the White Walker threat, although it is not explained how. Several winters have passed since the Iron Bank started lending the Westerosi crown gold, and Westeros has not been invaded by the undead. So, I assume that , on the show, Stannis told Nestoris about the letter and also that Tywin Lannister is not moving a finger to aid the Night's Watch. Probably, Nestoris decides to give Stannis enough gold to hire ships to travel north as fast as possible to ensure that Westeros is not eradicated ( If Westeros is invaded, no one is paying back).




Conclusion:



We will have to wait until episode 9 ( or 10) to find out exactly how things went down. But, if my analysis is correct, we will probably see Tycho Nestoris going to King's Landing to talk to Cersei next season ( as a last attempt to ask for repayment).




However:



If I am wrong, and the Iron Bank is truly supporting Stannis 100% , then we will probably see the following changes:



- No Mountain Clans.



- Stannis is much more of a threat to the South ( This makes the story more interesting for a TV audience)



- Perhaps Davos's visit to Lord Manderly will not be needed, and the show will alter his storyline completely.



-The Roose/Stannis conflict will be solved much faster ( probably before the end of next season).



-Stannis will use his gold to repair the castles and help the Night's Watch (opposite to the books where he is in a desperate situation, and needs Jon Snow to feed his men).




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Here is Stannis loan application with the IBB:

http://imgur.com/BczzwRc

:lmao: *they should've listed 2 smoke babies

I guess it could maybe have repercussions much later. Like, I assume that while they were in Braavos they hired some sellswords to take to the Wall, as Davos suggested in an early episode (about the sellswords, not the Wall part)

So I think maybe later there won't be any reason for Massey to go back to Essos. If Massey even makes the cut, that is

One ramification about the early loan is that at lot of people speculating on how Arya ends up back in Westeros are going to have to change their theory. Many thought Arya would hitch a ride back with Massey. Now, we know that is not going to happen.

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...

-Stannis will use his gold to repair the castles and help the Night's Watch (opposite to the books where he is in a desperate situation, and needs Jon Snow to feed his men).

This was also a thought... Since IB already made deal with Stannis before coming to the wall... In the books, IB comes to the wall to seek Stannis, giving LC Snow the opportunity to get a loan for funds to feed and keep the NW and wildlings alive through the winter. Doubt we'll see that scene now. Wonder if the show will even depict the dire straits the NW is in. Kinda reminds me how the southron lords ignore the pleas from NW. Now the show is doing it too. :ohwell:

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ok. As OP I like to clatify two things.

I dont think Massey will betray him. I was just adressing that it was a topic always discussed.

About the amount of the loan, we dont know just yet, but if it was a token loan, would they had expend it hiring a pirat and paying old debts? Whats the use of Saalador in a fight against wildings? He already does have 34 ships.

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2) We dont know how much gold the IB gave Stannis, I was surprised that he said 4000 men, I thought he had virtually nothing of how they played it in the show. However lets say he gets another 4000 men. Thats 8000 men against 100 000 Wildlings, thats still an impressive victory regardless.

I remember in the book, Stannis had 2000 men and about 100 crows from East watch, they defeated ten thousands wildlings, killed 1000, and captured another 1000, considering Stannis has calvary, better armored and better armed, and the wilding were caught unawared, this victory, ghough impressive,did make sense

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This was also a thought... Since IB already made deal with Stannis before coming to the wall... In the books, IB comes to the wall to seek Stannis, giving LC Snow the opportunity to get a loan for funds to feed and keep the NW and wildlings alive through the winter. Doubt we'll see that scene now. Wonder if the show will even depict the dire straits the NW is in. Kinda reminds me how the southron lords ignore the pleas from NW. Now the show is doing it too. :ohwell:

It is still possible, we do not know how much gold IB gave Stannis this time, I do not think IB has decided to abandoned Lanniser's cause, since Lannisters are their biggest investment, and until now at least, they did pay the money back. What IB did in the last episode was just what we call investment diversity, they may just gave Stannis enough gold to enable him to sail to the wall

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Will non book readers think he's got enough gold to go attack the Lannisters again?



I'm being forgetful. Has there been any indication that Stannis is going to the Wall on the show yet? The trailer for the next episode has Stannis' wife and the Mellisandra looking into the flames for a vision.


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Will non book readers think he's got enough gold to go attack the Lannisters again?

I'm being forgetful. Has there been any indication that Stannis is going to the Wall on the show yet? The trailer for the next episode has Stannis' wife and the Mellisandra looking into the flames for a vision.

Yes, in episode 10 last season, Davos shows him the scroll from Castle Black, Melisandre reads it and looks into the flames, realizes the Great Other is there, and tells Stannis that death is marching on the Wall, he is the only one who can stop it, and the War of Five Kings means nothing. Stannis decides he'll go, but needs to wait for Davos to raise enough men and ships.

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I'm not sure if it changes much or if it does I'm not sure I mind (depends how it plays out).

I think it actually nicely sets up a moment of surprise as people can assume that he would probably have the forces to attack King's Landing again. So his decision to go to the wall doesn't come of as "he had no other choice anyhow" but as a deliberatly made decision against King's Landing and for the wall.

Good point. While having more men makes his victory against the wildlings less impressive, it does make his decision to go to the wall more admirable and surprising. Considering Stannis could use some positive PR, so to speak, with unsullied viewers I think this could have some benefits.

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He might take bigger casualties at the Wall though. HBO viewers guide and Inside episode seem to confirm that Stannis got money from the Iron Bank. It might have just been a token of trust and a possible future relationship. Something along the lines of: "If the Lannisters refuse to pay we'll give you all the gold you need. As a token of friendship take this chest."

I like this idea.

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Yes, in episode 10 last season, Davos shows him the scroll from Castle Black, Melisandre reads it and looks into the flames, realizes the Great Other is there, and tells Stannis that death is marching on the Wall, he is the only one who can stop it, and the War of Five Kings means nothing. Stannis decides he'll go, but needs to wait for Davos to raise enough men and ships.

I think that they should/will remind us of that scene before episode 9, because many of the Unsullied probably don't remember it.

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Thanks acosta for the reminder and I agree with Guard of the RainKing, viewers will need a reminder. Stannis got another urge to go claim his birthright after Joffrey died and at the Bank they talk about who is best fit to rule. So we're being pointed towards King's Landing before they pull a switch on us and he goes to the Wall. Perhaps to keep the element of surprise they won't give a solid reminder until he arrives.


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Thanks acosta for the reminder and I agree with Guard of the RainKing, viewers will need a reminder. Stannis got another urge to go claim his birthright after Joffrey died and at the Bank they talk about who is best fit to rule. So we're being pointed towards King's Landing before they pull a switch on us and he goes to the Wall. Perhaps to keep the element of surprise they won't give a solid reminder until he arrives.

Maybe a scene on a ship with Stannis and Davos talking about where they should head next. Stannis might argue that they should sail for King's Landing since winning the throne would give him more resources to fight the threat in the North. Davos could disagree, and would want to sail to the Wall right away. Then leave Stannis' choice as a cliffhanger. However for Stannis wanting to attack KL to make sense they need to have the Iron Bank's support, and if you read my earlier post you'll know how I would like the IB situation to go down.

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