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The King Of Cooked Steak

The Trial - How did you feel?

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Unfortunately, I can no longer see Pycelle without realizing he's the Nazi archaeologist from Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade. As long as he isn't on screen, I'm good, though.


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Top-notch performances by all performers. Even the extras and non-speaking characters looked like they were "on" the whole time.

I definitely think that if Tyrion had gone to verdict he could have been acquitted. The prosecution's case didn't really make any sense. They overreached by trying for the conspiracy charge with Sansa; if Tyrion had poisoned Joffrey in a fit of spontaneous anger during the wedding, it would have made sense. But the idea that he drugged the wine and then just stood there knowing that he was guaranteed to be arrested and put to death doesn't make any sense and I think that Oberyn and Tywin at least would have seen that.

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If anything, I thought there would be more anger in his speech after reading it in the books, whereas as Dinklage had more of a hissing tone. It still worked for me as he and Dance were on top form as usual.

Ya, I figured someone would say this. But it's a very short speech in the book - much, much shorter than show version. There are no moments of "he shouted," no description of outward anger, and no exclamation points; it's all "...he said," very rational as I read it, until the moment when he demands trial by combat, which is in italics and has the exclamation point (and which, funny enough, in show version he states rather plainly).

I see Tyrion as a person whose sole claim to superiority over these people is his wits, and I don't think of him as outwardly very emotional, even if he is seething inside. Books vs film/theatre/TV though: Again, stage drama needs this precisely because the audience doesn't get to see what's going on inside, whereas books allow us to interpret characters in ways that aren't over dramatized - that is to say, because not everyone is.

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Unfortunately, I can no longer see Pycelle without realizing he's the Nazi archaeologist from Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade. As long as he isn't on screen, I'm good, though.

He's also General Veers from The Empire Strikes Back.

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i am having a hard time believing that people actually believe Sansa killed Dontos with a crossbow.

If questioned, Cersei will probably find a witness that says that Joffrey and Sansa went hunting in the Kingswood many times and that he showed her how to use it. He even had a new type of crossbow with a special crank that made it much easier to load for a girl. The beauty of perjury is that you aren't constrained by anything other than your own imagination. If one of your lies stops making sense, just make up a couple more to keep it company.

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If questioned, Cersei will probably find a witness that says that Joffrey and Sansa went hunting in the Kingswood many times and that he showed her how to use it. He even had a new type of crossbow with a special crank that made it much easier to load for a girl. The beauty of perjury is that you aren't constrained by anything other than your own imagination. If one of your lies stops making sense, just make up a couple more to keep it company.

Even simpler, she had one or more henchmen, retainers loyal to her traitorous father.

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i am having a hard time believing that people actually believe Sansa killed Dontos with a crossbow.

4 years into this and still waiting for Sansa to do.... something.

Well, at least we know Tyrion is one character that won't be killed off.

... right?

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I absolutely loved it.

Peter and Charles did both an awesome job and nailed their parts with bravour. Every mimic, every gesture - everything in the end. Every word of it.

The setup was brilliant.

Like I said in another thread, I'm kind of torn with my sympathies - I really like Tyrion, but I also like Tywin.

Lannister fan to the last.

It was really nice to see the motto of their house - in this trial. Because both kept snarling, growling - shouting. And roared.

Tyrion was on a tear alright, he ditched the wit that has been both shield and weapon for so long, and bared his claws and snarled and roared. And the old lion took notice, and was both furious and surprised. No more deference from Tyrion, no more hope of approval, he was challenging Tywin with everything he had. We haven't really seen Tyrion enraged before, at least not such a deep, dark, personal rage.

It was marvelous.

I remember that the scene that really showcased Dinklage's skill the most in Season 1 (in my opinion) was the one between him and Dance, when Tywin told Tyrion he was sending him to King's Landing as the acting Hand of the King, because "you're my son" - Dinklage conveyed their relationship so perfectly, with just a flash of emotion on his face, hesitation yielding to hope and an almost disbelieving joy that his father was finally giving him a chance to prove his worth big-time, that his father trusted him.

And in this scene, all that goes to hell; that brief moment of trust is gone and it's war.

I wish that Charles Dance could get an Emmy for his role in this show as well...

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It's certainly up there as one of the best episode endings in the show; even better than the closing shot of Season 2's finale, in my opinion.



Dinklage and Dance were great (of course), but you have to give it up for the rest of the supporting cast in the room also - Nikolaj and Lena's restrained frustration and sadness, Pascal's amusement at the entire affair and his interest at Tyrion's demand, Dormer's "These people really are fucking insane" expression... even Kekilli stepped it up with her mixture of regret, fear, and hurt at Tyrion.



Fantastic scene, very happy with the end result.


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I felt like it dragged for a little while when they put all of the evidence against Tyrion. I know it was needed to get across the point that it was not a fair trial, but it just felt like it dragged on.



The second half more than made up for that however. "I should have let Stannis kill you all" was such a fantastic moment.


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Made up immensely for the rest of the ep (but not the season so far). All the Lannisters were riveting to watch right from Jaime closing his eyes as Tyrion demanded trial by combat to the self-satisfied look on Cersei's face and the glaring contest between Tywin and Tyrion.

I also wouldn't mind Margaery stating her (true) thoughts about the trial at some point.

One thing though, as with the book, I have a hard time believing that Kingslanders weren't happy that Joffrey's dead and at least some of them weren't proclaiming Tyrion a hero. I know that may be dangerous but that are always some foolhardy enough to risk such things. And whIle it made for a great dramatic moment, particularly on tv, I've always thought Martin overstated how reprehensible the people of King's Landing are and how far they were willing to blame Tyrion for their troubles.

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There was another heartbreaking and plot shaping look-into-each-others'-eyes scene:

When Jaime asked so very kindly and seriously "Do you trust me?" and Tyrion looked up to him and, full of trust and confindence, said "yes". This was heartbreaking, loving, the little brother to the older one, counting on him to chase the bullies away.

And the next moment Tyrion's look to Tywin, full of suspicion.

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One thing though, as with the book, I have a hard time believing that Kingslanders weren't happy that Joffrey's dead and at least some of them weren't proclaiming Tyrion a hero. I know that may be dangerous but that are always some foolhardy enough to risk such things. And whIle it made for a great dramatic moment, particularly on tv, I've always thought Martin overstated how reprehensible the people of King's Landing are and how far they were willing to blame Tyrion for their troubles.

You have to remember those in the throne room for this mock 'trial' were all nobles or related to the court / castle in some way and so they absolutely must be bought in 100% (even if fake) to the Lannisters and that means to Tywin as the defacto ruler and Cersei as the Dowager Queen. Speaking out against them would be treasonous and so of course they are all too willing to blame Tyrion. These are the same idiots who were at the wedding, enjoying the crown's coin in wine and food while watching Joffrey be a total ass just before he died. They witnessed the whole thing and stood around like the sheep that they are. Despicable but not a one of them has any power to speak out against the true evil.

I imagine among the small-folk there's a bit more appreciation for Tyrion and a lot more hatred for Joffrey - they did riot and throw shit at him in the streets remember.

It's the toadies of court who are 'bought and paid for' which isn't an uncommon theme in many historical royal courts.

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I thought it was a great scene and wonderfully well-played, as stated many times upthread.

The one thing I didn't quite take from the books, which was made abundantly clear here was how Tywin was using the threat of Tyrion's execution against Jaime to put Jaime in the position of having to come to him and beg for his brother's life. Exactly what Tywin wanted, when you think about it. It allowed Tywin to set the conditions, which of course were that Jaime quit the Kingsguard and take his rightful place at Casterly Rock and AWAY from Cersei.

Does anyone else remember this point being made in the book(s)?

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Pretty simple: everybody in KL despises Tyrion because he's a dwarf. Doesn't matter that he saved the city, nobody even noticed that.

Not everybody only those with power or those who want power small folk probably know and hated Joffrey with a passion the soldiers who fought also know and they were witness to Joffreys cowardice when he left the battlements. None of those two faction were brought in court only those nobles and lords bought and paid by Lannisters who will speak ill of him simply cause tywin says so

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No one will sympathize with Tyrion in open court. In the books there was one man who praises Tyrion during his testimony and it was ignored; in fact, Cersei uses that to damn Tyrion further, saying that even someone who admires Tyrion personally is giving evidence of his guilt.

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The more Lannisters that die, the better. Clearly Tyrion will be around to the end and that's fine with me:-)

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