[Book Spoilers] EP408 Discussion

[MoIaF]

well it was pretty much gore in the book as well. But this was a bit extreme... I think it did need to be done but I just wasn't gonna look I have the hubby for that he looked and even he said it was ack.

True, but just hearing it was enough for me.

There is going to be some serious killing next week. M

[johndance]

Loved every part of the episode. Loved the Sansa stuff. She's playing the game now, and seems like she'll fair pretty well. So well done. It makes sense too. She's been surrounded by liars , com artists, etc for how long now? She had to catch on eventually.

Epic trial. No one can say they weren't faithful to the books here. Bravo to D&D for taking such a great part and transferring it so amazingly well to the screen. Brilliant stuff.

[NightStark]

Would you happen to have a link to this? i would like to see it. Thanks.

The ending was well done. I knew it was coming, but DAMN I hated to see my boy go out like that. My GF was almost in tears.

:)

http://web.stagram.com/p/703820290286423499_352398842

[OccupyHarrenhal]

I wondered why the Hound's wound hadn't festered yet. Now I know why.

Oh, I think it is going to happen. I commented earlier in the thread. I think, the way this season and the writing is going, that the Hound and Sansa at least get a glimpse of each other. So probably ep. 9 and then they leave the Vale and he collapses on the road and she does leave him under the tree.

Not sure if Arya and Hound get a glimpse of LF or SW. Also, not sure if Sansa sees Arya and Hound. Might be one-sided. But it would fit with the whole Sansa id revealed early. Or, Arya and the Hound find out it is her there, never see her, but are thwarted TRYING to get to Sansa.

I wonder if maybe Littlefinger will be the only one who sees Arya/Hound and Sansa doesn't notice them. It wouldn't be the first time in the show he's recognized Arya and not said anything.

[MoIaF]

I loved the image of Daenerys not even being able to look him in the eye.

That was very well done on Emilia's part. Her best friend, probably the only friend she's ever truly had just betrayed her in the worst possible way.

[briantw]

I don't like gore. I wish they'd be more subtle, sometimes it works best to leave it up to the imagination.

That scene wasn't remotely subtle in the books either. The Mountain crushes Oberyn's face with a couple of punches. It's brutal and violent.

The show did pretty much the same thing, and it worked. The only downside in my mind was that they changed the Mountain's lines a bit at the end. I really loved how he yells "THEN I PUNCHED HER FUCKING FACE IN...LIKE THIS." I wanted to hear that.

[thetitansbastard]

I'm more inclined to think that the show is going to catch up with the books now. Sansa revealed to the Vale lords already??

Can't say I am a big fan The Hound and Arya showing up at the Eyrie. I suppose to excite the fans about a Sansa/Arya reunion only for it not to happen, which may be OK for non-readers I guess. Are they just going to be turned away and leave? Do the guards know about Sansa? Will they kill the Hound?

[teej6]

Honestly, did we need to hear 3 mins of that beetle story. And why the Missandei/Greyworm subplot? Is there a purpose to that?

[TheReal_Rebel]

There are elements in this season which makes me believe that Benioff did not use only the begining of AFFC and ADWD and the last half of ASOS to make the show, they gave us some of WOW

Very much agree!

[Dio Westeros-X]

Well there was the pic of her gouging out Pedro Pascal's eyes which has turned out to be connected to the show so I'm just going to take the stone heart as a hint:P

ahhh well i like that!

[Mistress of Lemon Cakes]

Honestly the only things I really remember from the episode were ...

Alfie Allen's acting

Jorah's banishment

Everything in the Vale

And the final scene

Sansa may have revealed herself to the Lords Declarent but they made a point of having them promise not to reveal her identity. I think the scene at the end was her reverting back to Lord Baelish's "niece." She had the black hair after all.

The duel was amazing. I covered my eyes at the end. It was so brutal. I can't even right now ...

Twitter is EXPLODING btw. It's glorious.

[YouWinorYouDie]

Sorry I haven't read the whole thread and might have missed this but did anyone catch Oberyn's comment to Tyrion about the fighting pits?

[Darth Pipes]

Wow. Not a lot on TV disturbs me that that last scene sure as hell did. I was wondering how they would pull that off...mission accomplished!

Another great episode. A little slow on some parts in the beginning and Tyrion's beetle conversation just wouldn't end. But you had some really impressive scenes and some terrific acting.

Sophie Turner was amazing. Her confessing she was Sansa Stark legitimately surprised me and was a great move on her part. Gave her character a lot of agency. I'm very curious where things will go from here with that storyline.

Speaking of unexpected, Arya's laughter which was hilarious.

Fantastic work by Alfie Allen as always and Moat Cailin's design was very cool. Liked the twisted Roose and Ramsey scene and they seemed to be playing an altered, twisted version of the King of the North score.

Add Iain Glen to the list of standout performances. I'm surprised we never got Jorah kissing Dany on this show but I thought the betrayal was very well-handled.

Fantastic trial by combat and I'm going to miss Pedro Pascal.

[TheReal_Rebel]

A question!, Ramsay's finale scene showed the ruins of Winterfell???

That's what I thought I saw.

[Booknerd2]

I wonder if maybe Littlefinger will be the only one who sees Arya/Hound and Sansa doesn't notice them. It wouldn't be the first time in the show he's recognized Arya and not said anything.

Why not? Or he becomes aware they are around and sends them on their way somehow and with no drama. But I can't see that opportunistic fiend not trying to get Arya (2 Stark girls) for his own gains. Like, maybe, this is why the Hound doesn't get work if they allude to the books.

[NightStark]

That scene wasn't remotely subtle in the books either. The Mountain crushes Oberyn's face with a couple of punches. It's brutal and violent.

The show did pretty much the same thing, and it worked. The only downside in my mind was that they changed the Mountain's lines a bit at the end. I really loved how he yells "THEN I PUNCHED HER FUCKING FACE IN...LIKE THIS." I wanted to hear that.

Show Gregor says 'Then I smashed her head in like this' so close enough.

[joaozinm]

talking about being loyal to the books a lot of things bothered me.

First Jorah wasnt begging pardon he was demanding.

Second Arya seemed a sadic child, really...what about that laugh? The fact that she will be in the future a cold murderer dont mean she is scary and creepy.

Third. The vale Scene... really what the hell? Littlefinger looked like he is a fool that put too much trust into Sansa, and the lord declarants even fooler to buy it. Really the Vale isnt that close to the starks and they dont really care about that feeling theater.

Fourth what about all those Starks revealing themselfs?This will be so odd in the future.

Five... Lyn Corbray part on the book was one of my favorite... it was great to see how far Littlefinger had thought, and we saw a Sansa being smart enough to understand

[Rockroi]

For all those people upset about Obyren Martell, I have this to say:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48H34ukFe8g

And that’s what happens to overrated men who speak when they are not spoken too.

I loved a lot about this episode. It was great.

What I liked:

The Queen of Thrones: The transformation of Sansa Stark from the dove that Cersei picked on at Winterfell to the dark, brooding figure oozing through the Vale has been an epic success; one of the highlights of the show. D&D should be very proud of that. The show slowly, carefully and with great pain and pressure made Sansa the power broker behind Petyr Baelish and not the other way around. Even the way she surprised him, and the way she used the truth to manipulate everyone was epic. They made Littlefinger reliant on Sansa and not Sansa reliant on LF. They made her ….

They made Sansa Stark the one who knocks…

Watching Sansa grow- even WITH her foibles, imperfections, scars and insecurities – is tremendous because each step along the way has been believable. She knows now what is so important to playing the Game of Thrones: know what motivates other people. Once you know that you can work with it. Ned never learned it, Robb forgot about it, Renly was blind to it so they all lost. Sansa knows what motivates LF and she can work with that; she can work with Robyn, and she can win the game of Thrones. The show has- masterfully- brought that truth to the forefront of the show.

The Blast From the Past: I never liked Obyreyn Martel for a simple reason: he was a loudmouth who was more style than substance, talked a big game and never backed it up; a man whose reputation far exceeded the man he was, and who seemed preoccupied with being right more than he ever was occupied with winning. So, he lost. He lost because he could not keep his mouth shut; he lost because he wasn’t as good as he thought, he lost because he underestimated a man who’s reputation BELIED underestimation; he lost because he thought he was touched by gods, when, in fact, he was just touched by a Mountain.

And he lost because he thought he had one up on Tywin. Yeah… no.

I cheered, just like I did in the books, just like I knew I would watching it. The fight and the buildup were perfect (the fight could have been longer, BUT … getting two actors who have LIMITED sword/spear fighting abilities to choreograph a fight is … really fucking hard- anything more would have been greedy). Plus, the show’s ability to switch around from the books left us all wondering…. Hey could Oberyn win this thing?

And he didn’t; it was fucking amazing.

Sad clown faces for everyone!

Oh, one more thing… he screamed like a girl…. HA!

The Brothers Kin(g)slayers: I love Tyrion and Jaime, my two favorite characters (along with Stannis). Watching then poke fun at a “simple” relative was fantastic- gallows humor for a man who was actually facing the gallows. And Tyrion’s preoccupation with a relative who squashed bugs was eerily similar to Jaime’s relationship with a King who killed people for by-in-large the same reasons – because he could. Listening them try to keep up their own spirits was touching and equally morbid; like laughing at a funeral. And it worked.

The Laughter of the Girl with Nothing to Lose: Arya’s reaction to her Aunt’s death was picture-fucking perfect. At that point, how could you NOT laugh? No, seriously, whose alive at that point?!?! Fuck it, just sail to Braavos and start life over as a monk who kills people. Oh… wait …

The Mother of The Friend Zone: Dany’s reactions to both Melassandi and to Jorah Mormont were very good, wise and emotionally charged. She trusted Mormont, she loved him, and she wanted him to be by her side all the days through. But he was a spy; he did lie to her and she had to throw him out. I wish they had delved more into Dany’s conflict about the episode and how it hurt her to make him go and how she almost tried to keep him, but she didn’t. While I think that Emilia Clark did a lot of that with her face at the end, its at best ambiguous as to whether or not TV-Dany is that conflicted. I would have liked to see her at least upset over it. Her acting with Mel assandi was also very good as she asked the questions that we probing and tough and showed a deft hand.

Honorable Mention to Selmy who seemed to fit nicely in the whole episode.

On the Fence On:

The Most Deep, Meaningful and Beautiful Love Story I Don’t Give a Fuck About: Melassandi and Grey Worm’s emotional love story, its depth, honesty and beauty – even the beauty of their two bodies in the water, the unflinching charm of both a man and a woman admitting that they are pleased with seeing the other and how the gruesomeness of Grey Worm’s mutilation makes Mel wonder about him; even the way they speak to each other- it was deep, rich, and I don’t give one fuck at all about it, not even a little.

They are third-level characters in a single sub-set of a story and they are utterly uninteresting to the overall story arc. I don’t care about them; I find it hard to believe anyone would care. IT was beautiful and rich and well done and extremely tasteful- fuck, we even had a very tasteful nude scene that did not make me want to question the mental health of the people making this show- And I could not possibly care any less nor give less fucks. If I had a fuck I would not give it to learn more about them or their love story.

Dude, we don’t care.

Still, it was touching and rich and bored the fuck out of me.

I am Ygritte, the Killer, but … Oh, Look, Babies… : I get why Ygritte didn’t kill Gilly, but the place was- literally- flowing with blood. Ygitte is like Darth Vader- she can kill whomever she wants, but “there is still good in” her. I don’t get that, but I can see why they needed to have it there. I kind of like her being a steely eyed-killer myself. I don’t know- how come GIlly and the baby deserve her mercy but not the girl whose throat she slashed just a few seconds before? So, she’s still good while being a fucking terrible person? Really? Is that the message?

Rhymes with Tweak: THeon’s and Ramsey’s scenes were 100% … satisfactory. They were definitely scenes; there was an opening and then a final cut; dialog was spoken, and heck, there was actual plot development and story advancement. Yeah. That was entirely … okay.

And nothing really of interest. We saw everything we had seen before at Winterfell (Ironborn turning on their own) and with Ramsey (he goes back on his word because he’s a fucking asshole). Reek is scared of his own shadow and Roose Bolton is great when he is talking. It’s not anything we had not seen before … very … mediocre.

What I did Not Like:

Arya Stark is Alive…. Okay… Hello….? Anyone? Is anyone Listening That She’s Alive? Anyone? No? Hello? …. : So, one of the great unanswered questions in Westeroes for the last 2 years has been: ”Whatever Happened to Mr. Garabaldi Arya Stark?” Then- predictably one might argue- she turns up at Lysa Aryn’s Home. There she is. She introduces herself to everyone and everything. This… THIS IS HUGE NEWS!!!!! The very next scene we see LF and Robyn and Sansa and … and … NOBODY MENTIONS THIS!!!! WTF?!?!?! A few scenes earlier Roose was talking about his power when he was reminded that the two youngest Starks are still alive… so he … does fucking nothing! But here- we HAVE ARYA! And … and … nothing.

Yeah, because that’s realistic; because LF would not want to know; because the realm would not want to know. Why would you do that? Why would you put that scene in? Yes, I know- the pay off was great- Arya laughing the absurdity of it all. Got it! But… holy hell… people now know Sansa is alive and… nothing!?

Yeah, Fail.

Anyway, this was an incredible episode. Yeah, it had a few uneven parts that were very “meh” but the high-points were exceptional. This is a great segue into the final two episodes.

And the King both Beyond the Wall… and the one who will end up there.

Stannis. Is. Coming.

[Hotpie Targaryen]

I loved the image of Daenerys not even being able to look him in the eye.

I thought she did calmly furious really well.

[White Harbors Wrath]

That's what I thought I saw.

Yeah, He even says to Reek, they're going to their "new" home.