Ser Uncle P Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 9/10. The Moles Town scene was crap. Roose/Ramsey was excellent. Grey Worm/Missandei could have been crap, but I thought it had dignified pathos. Viper/Mountain duel was too short, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashas Globetrotter Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 I thought Tyrion's story fucking dragged on, though. And I really didn't appreciate him and Jaime bonding over mocking a mentally handicapped person. Tasteless and uncomfortable to watch. Oh my god.. you are watching a show where innocents are killed, raped, tortured and generally fucked over in every way, and you find this tasteless. After watching 4 seasons (and maybe read 5 books?), and seen what the characters are capable of, one wouldn`t think you excepted a personae of high moral standing. This universe strives to be realistic in terms of characters and actions, and I do not think, sadly, people in the middle ages had very high regard for the mentally challenged. Have you ever heard the term "the village idiot"? This type of double standard, sanctimonious political correctness is tasteless and uncomfortable to listen to. And very Amercian, I am sad to say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ran Posted June 2, 2014 Author Share Posted June 2, 2014 Though, I do admit, I did find the "I love mocking disabled people, makes me feel better about myself" a bit at odds with his first season "I have a fondness for crippled, bastards, and broken things." One can of course be a hypocrite, and they're talking about when he was younger, but I wouldn't have minded if he made it plain that his feelings have matured a bit since he used to stare and laugh at Orson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ground_control Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 Though, I do admit, I did find the "I love mocking disabled people, makes me feel better about myself" a bit at odds with his first season "I have a fondness for crippled, bastards, and broken things."One can of course be a hypocrite, and they're talking about when he was younger, but I wouldn't have minded if he made it plain that his feelings have matured a bit since he used to stare and laugh at Orson.To be fair, many of this season's writers seem not to have read other scripts from this season, so expecting them to be familiar with material from season 1 is unrealistic. GOT is an episodic television series, not a movie, and the show goes to great lengths to make sure that we viewers do not need to remember details from previous shows (like character names). Had Tyrion's previous behavior been deemed relevant to his actions in this episode, I'm sure it would have been covered in a "previously on game of thrones" intro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Girl Arya Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 (edited) I'd say 9.5, so I rounded it up to a 10. I thought the fight scene was perfection. Ellaria's and Oberyn's screams hit me damn near as much as Cat's during the RW. Oberyn calling out Tywin in front of the entire court...I think it's the first time we've seen Tywin look genuinely nervous, which was priceless. I, personally, enjoyed the Grey Worm/Missandei scenes. I'm almost certain this is setting up inevitable heartbreak, but I can see why it would feel out of place. The Jorah banishment scene was excellent overall but could have used some better editing (hence the .5 drop). My heart broke for Arya. I could totally tell that it was either laugh or have a complete mental breakdown at that point (nervous laughter is a thing). I'm sure the ramifications will be handled accordingly, but I don't think they could have just had Arya and/or the Hound just randomly say "eh, eff the Vale". It was a thread they needed to tie up and I'm sure they'll handle it fine. Ygritte showing mercy to Gilly was freakishly uplifting and this episode needed that. Holy crap, has Sansa come into her own! Plotting better than LF, making her dress her own, she is totally stepping into her role as a force to be reckoned with and it's going to be good. For those saying LF was lax in this episode, would never let Sansa do this, that or the other, well, think of Oberyn and what overconfidence got him. The same thing happened to LF with the Lords Declarant, only LF's consequences were less deadly (for the time being). I think this "coming into her own" has actually been set up very nicely this season. Not to mention she can always point out to LF how she got the Vale lords to her side and she could probably turn them against him if she so wished. That dynamic is going to be incredible next season. The beetle speech I'm still pondering but I didn't dislike it. To me, it was more Tyrion wondering of why such awful things can happen and it could just boil down to it amusing some higher power or the other. It seemed appropriate, given what was on the line for him. On the whole, everything was pretty much spot on for this episode. Some minor things could have been tweaked but on the whole, definately near the top! Edit: Oh man, how could I have forgotten Alfie! He was amazing, as he has been pretty much the whole time. The Roose/Ramsay dynamic took on a whole new level as well. Everyone brought their A game this episode. Edited June 2, 2014 by Wolf Girl Arya Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ran Posted June 2, 2014 Author Share Posted June 2, 2014 ground_control, Yeah. Can't blame Benioff and Weiss for not remembering scripts some other guys wrote in the first season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relic Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 ground_control,Yeah. Can't blame Benioff and Weiss for not remembering scripts some other guys wrote in the first season.Yeah its crazy to expect the writers to read and *gasp* remember shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Carson Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 (edited) wrong thread :bang: Edited June 2, 2014 by Lord Carson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ground_control Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 ground_control,Yeah. Can't blame Benioff and Weiss for not remembering scripts some other guys wrote in the first season. Yeah its crazy to expect the writers to read and *gasp* remember shit. I thought my sarcasm and contempt for the quality control was obvious, so I didn't put a </sarcasm> tag, and I left out citing Battlestar Galactica Season 3 as the high point of effective writing for episodic tv. So seriously -- I totally agree that the beetle scene just felt out of character, and that the showrunners (even if they aren't credited as writers for a specific episode) should have somebody checking for continuity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearQueen87 Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 I gave it a 7/10. I thought the duel was very well done, but it was left to the final 10 mins or so and before then was a very long talk about beetles. I understand the philisopicial questions behind the beetle conversation, but still it chugged on and on for too long. There was a lot jam packed into this episode and it felt like we jumped around almost too much. I didn't need more Ramsey, Roose and Reek (not necessarily a problem with the show because I have the same issue with the book--Theon should have died at some point to spare us this storyline). The wildling attack and the Wall bit was neccesary, I know, but stil took time away from other stuff. While I knew the Jorah/Dany scene had to come at some poit (though I was praying it wouldn't) I was shocked that it came this episode, when more time should have been devoted to the duel and Tyrion's fate. However, Iain Glen is great as wounded Jorah. I'll be upset if there was no posion on the spear. That's a missed oppertunity. The Grey Worm/ Messandi scene felt out of nowhere. While I like their character generally, they are not why I tune in each week. It's problem ASOIAF has in general--too many characters and threads trying to be tied together. Finally, I gained a bit of respect for Sansa this episode, who has always been one of my least favorite characters. I enjoy the fact that she might have the upper hand over LF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pure Guava Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 Heh. Funny stuff. This is the only place I can come to where I've felt pretty "meh" about an episode and everybody here is raving, then I'm pretty stoked and everybody here is...well...fuckin' beetle-hating. Only thing which really bothered me is the "Welp, it ain't 'Rains o' Castamere' so it MUST be 'The Bear and the Maiden Fair' the only two goddamn songs in the history of Westeros!" and I'll admit I'm a bit perplexed as to what the heck they're going to do with Arya and the Hound from here...though I'd imagine something happens where they're threatened with captivity, they fight, get away, Hound gets injured, etc. Definitely loved seeing Sansa In Charge 2.0, as this was a storyline in the books which I'd admittedly skim and am conversely wicked-excited about watching develop on the show. the showrunners (even if they aren't credited as writers for a specific episode) What are you talking about, dude? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ground_control Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 What are you talking about, dude? Read the last 10 or so posts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pure Guava Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 They are always specifically credited. So again, what are you talking about? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaqen H'gcarl Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Did you guys actually like how Gregor practically squished oberyns head like a watermelon? It felt extremely unrealistic. I mean, I can understand someone getting their face smashed in by a gauntlet, but squishing someones head to watermelon? come on... really? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ground_control Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 They are always specifically credited. So again, what are you talking about? Writers are not credited per-scene, that's what I said, and that's what I meant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearQueen87 Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Did you guys actually like how Gregor practically squished oberyns head like a watermelon? It felt extremely unrealistic. I mean, I can understand someone getting their face smashed in by a gauntlet, but squishing someones head to watermelon? come on... really? Unrealistic yes, but it was the climax to the whole scene, each moment getting more andmore intense. The squishing was a sort of literal release from the tension that was building for the last few mins. I admit, I had to look away during that part. I knew Oberyn was going to die but once I realized what The Moutain was doing and that they were really going to show it, I had to look away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SweetJeyne Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 A very impressive 9, literally inches away from a 10. Everything in the Vale was outstanding. I know some people will complain that they're rushing Sansa's change, and muddling the character a bit, but I don't. That last scene with her coming down the stairs was one of the moments of the season. Tyrion's beetle story was great. Emilia Clarke handled Jorah's expulsion very well. Not yet sure how I feel about the whole Grey Worm romance. Dialogue still just leaves that little bit to be desired... 10 This is the episode when the producers told us they know what happens in book 6 and we don't. And don't think they are messing with the plots on their own. GRRM is part of the team and the series is a lot better edited than the books are. The most important part was the reveal on Sansa which is clearly a plotline that is from book 6. Sansa is not going to be Baelish's toy. Will she turn into Arya II or Cersei II though? This handling of Lyssa's murder is much better than the books. In the books we only find out about the venom after the duel. So I think we will find out about that next episode. when the Mountain does not heal. Having Arya arrive somewhere too late makes a lot more sense than the pointless meanderings of the book. It also takes her in the direction of the sea and on to Bravos. Much more logical than the books again. Next season the whole Sansa plot line will be new. And they will be drawing in part from Book 6. Meanwhile other parts are still finishing book 3. Looks to me like we are looking at more than 7 seasons... I would guess 9. And thats not counting the fact there are likely 9 books as well. I agree that this episode gave us intriguing indications of where Sansa's character is headed. And seeing a glimpse of the woman she'll become---which is what we see as she comes down the stairs---was chilling, in the best sense. I do hope Sophie Turner is recognized come awards season, as well as Pedro Pascal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaqen H'gcarl Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Unrealistic yes, but it was the climax to the whole scene, each moment getting more andmore intense. The squishing was a sort of literal release from the tension that was building for the last few mins. I admit, I had to look away during that part. I knew Oberyn was going to die but once I realized what The Moutain was doing and that they were really going to show it, I had to look away. When he put his fingers in Oberyn's eyes, that was awesome (gruesome and horrible to watch - but that's the point). But when he squished Oberyn's entire head in.. that was just ridiculous in my opinion. Ah well.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khal-a-bunga Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 (edited) Though, I do admit, I did find the "I love mocking disabled people, makes me feel better about myself" a bit at odds with his first season "I have a fondness for crippled, bastards, and broken things."One can of course be a hypocrite, and they're talking about when he was younger, but I wouldn't have minded if he made it plain that his feelings have matured a bit since he used to stare and laugh at Orson. Isn't it clear enough simply from the way we've seen his character behave these past four seasons? Isn't it clear based on the fact that the vast majority of us mature from when we were children? Also, it's funny that Tyrion has a moment where he appears not to be a 'white knight', and people on the boards attack him for it. Because, you know, threatening to rape your nephew (even as a jest) or having someone murdered are so much more palatable than a young Tyrion deflecting criticism against himself by doing the same thing to another person with an unfortunate disability... Anyway, I thought it was a great episode. I don't run here and vote right after I've finished an episode, simply because I haven't given it any time to digest, and I find that I have to re-watch an episode (and consider it within the context of the season) in order to come to any conclusion regarding how I feel about it. Even someone who is as big a fan of the show as I am has a hard time completely separating what I see on-screen from what I've had in my head for such a long time. After said reflection, I have to say that this was possibly the darkest episode the show has done, or at least on par with Garden of Bones. Even Arya's laughter - something I had initially laughed about along with her - can be seen as a very dark moment, given her situation: Once again arriving at her destination, only to find that the family member she had been heading towards was dead. And between our first good look at a flayed man, and Oberyn's death, it was also one of the goriest. Looking forward to next week. @ Jaqen H'gcarl Having worked in an emergency room in a fairly large city, I've seen some pretty disturbing stuff (not that you have to work in a city hospital to see that kind of thing). If one was strong enough (as The Mountain is), it isn't at all unrealistic that they could crush someone's head in such a manner. It has more to do with the structure of the human skull than anything else, but applying pressure in the right way could definitely lead to results similar to what happened to Oberyn. Edited June 3, 2014 by Khal-a-bunga Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Knight of Grasses Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 9 out of 10. I liked everything except for Missandei and Grey Worm, which I found pointless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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