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Arya in TWOW Arya is in BIG trouble... (Mercy chapter spoilers)


Mdoggy

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Sorry if discussed already, I didn't read the entire thread. Commenting on the 1st point that Arya is in trouble with the Faceless Men because she killed without instruction or direction

I know that Jaquen (spelling?) killed for Ayra without direction from the Faceless Men, so I use this as a standard in that Ayra is not in as much trouble as we think.

And you're sure he isn't rogue?

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Didn't Jaquen kill Pate the pig boy? If you can change your face and name then how could you be held to murder etc if you have taken on a new ID etc? It seems to be the case


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Every once and a while I like to come back to this and similar threads and repeat what I have previously said. Arya is not in any trouble. The first rule of being a Faceless Man above all other is "Lie". Everything that people are saying are rules are Lies. FM give the gift of death and do it efficiently and covertly. Arya was never punished for killing. She was rewarded. Those statements against killing people you know and killing that is not necessary for the mission describe how best to kill. Surely you do not want to kill someone known to you, you may be a suspect. Killing unnecessarily may lead to your detection. FM worship death. Arya is not just a little girl. She is a magical creature with a stronger relationship to death than any other character in the series. I am going to go out on a limb here and say the FM love her. They may even come to worship her. She may prove to be their champion in this game and I am not talking about the Iron Throne but the larger game with the Others. The bigger question is what side are they on? Or even if there are sides?


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Every once and a while I like to come back to this and similar threads and repeat what I have previously said. Arya is not in any trouble. The first rule of being a Faceless Man above all other is "Lie". Everything that people are saying are rules are Lies. FM give the gift of death and do it efficiently and covertly. Arya was never punished for killing. She was rewarded. Those statements against killing people you know and killing that is not necessary for the mission describe how best to kill. Surely you do not want to kill someone known to you, you may be a suspect. Killing unnecessarily may lead to your detection. FM worship death. Arya is not just a little girl. She is a magical creature with a stronger relationship to death than any other character in the series. I am going to go out on a limb here and say the FM love her. They may even come to worship her. She may prove to be their champion in this game and I am not talking about the Iron Throne but the larger game with the Others. The bigger question is what side are they on? Or even if there are sides?

I hope you're not lying. I like Arya. :)

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I've wondered if the kindly man knows about needle. He seems to have eyes and ears outside the temple. Arya can keep secrets and lie well. The FM have to know that Arya is not going to be a normal member of their society (being a warg, a noble, set on vengeance). I don't think they really expect total obedience outof her. Just compliance, after all, she is a wolf. I don't think she will be punished at all for her killings, I think they are somewhat expected.

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I haven't read all the posts in this thread yet, so I may be repeating someone else.

I think that in the final two books, Arya returns to Westeros and kills some of those on her longstanding list. I also think a faceless man kills her in the epilogue of A Dream of Spring for betraying the purpose of their order.

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I don't think Arya's just desserts will be to die, I think it will be living on with all of her targets dead and all of her vengeance did not buy her back her life or happiness.

She's fairly heavily foreshadowed to die. I don't want to see her dead, since she is my favorite character, but I am resigned to the fact.

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I just hope she doesn't experience was Varys did (I think the "cold cup" the Kindly Man mentioned is actually the numbing potion they gave Varys before they cut off his genitals)

I don't really need the series to include female genital mutilation on top of everything else *shudders*

But male genital mutilation is somehow below that boundary?

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But male genital mutilation is somehow below that boundary?

:lol:

I don't think that's what was meant at all. It's just that we already have so much brutality up to and including male genital mutilation so to add female genital mutilation is too much.

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I don't think Arya's just desserts will be to die, I think it will be living on with all of her targets dead and all of her vengeance did not buy her back her life or happiness.

My theory on how people leave the Faceless Men:

They provide an offering, to serve as their replacement. When Jaquen gave Arya that coin and recruited her, he was basically offering the House of Black and White Arya as a replacement for himself.

Giving up the coin of course meant giving up the protection of the Iron Bank and the FM order for himself.

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I ,too, believe she was there to cause trouble for Swyft's mission. She expects her rape and murder, but there's no sign of her character's murder in what we know of the play...etc, etc..



The "gift" is that Raff is one of the guards. She can kill him without stepping beyond her instructions ( his identity is just one more of her secrets , like needle and the cat)... and I'm not sure the blade she uses is Needle. Although Needle's small compared to other swords, it still seems like it should be too large to be hidden in her sleeve.



I doubt Varys was a FM trainee.. and I think it could be off-track to look outside of Braavos for who's behind the mission. I'm much more suspicious of the factions looking to replace the Sealord. I have a feeling that the political stances he's taken are no longer popular , or thought ( perhaps by the IB and perhaps by the HoB&W itself ) to be in the interests of Braavos in the very dire times they find themselves in.


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Martins choice of the word Blade intrigues me to be honest, he does't refer to the hidden weapon as a knife, a dirk or a stiletto and yet a blade is an edged weapon, which Needle isn't. As to the pages and pages of ridiculous debate about sleeve length and whatnot, Arya draws the blade from her sleeve it says nothing that the secret compartments are up her sleeve.


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Martins choice of the word Blade intrigues me to be honest, he does't refer to the hidden weapon as a knife, a dirk or a stiletto and yet a blade is an edged weapon, which Needle isn't. As to the pages and pages of ridiculous debate about sleeve length and whatnot, Arya draws the blade from her sleeve it says nothing that the secret compartments are up her sleeve.

:D I haven't been following all those pages and pages , and maybe that's a good thing for me .. but excuse me if that means the following has been done to death , already :

It seemed to me that her secret pockets / compartments were in her cloak ? But more importantly...

One thing that tickles my antennae is the mention of "Mercy" having to check the prop knives to make sure there wasn't a real one among them - and the anecdote about a mummer previously having been killed because of a real knife substitution .. What about a mummer who has to do a killing hiding her weapon there in plain sight until needed ( especially if it's her job to take care of them ) ? She would only know that she was to kill a guard and the circumstances or location would be flexible, depending on the guard and her ingenuity. In this case , she definitely wouldn't use Needle.( Castle forged steel.It would stand out)

So the knife comes into the theatre in her cloak, lies inconspicuously among the prop knives and is later hidden in her sleeve once she assesses the situation and decides on the method of the kill ...???

Edit; clarity

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  • 1 month later...

Also mind these quotes from this chapter:

"When Mercy glanced at the faces beneath the gilded, lion-crested helm, her belly gave a quiver."

"Give it up or go ahead. She could not give it up. She wanted him so bad."

These lines describe reactions and thoughts of Arya and definitely not "no-one". Should she was an FM on a mission she would have felt nothing at all cause "no-one" doesn't want so bad to kill someone.

My interpretation of that was it was a means of working her Arya anxieties and desires into her Mercy character, so she didn't slip entirely out of character and could play the "boy-crazy girl" character more convincingly. Notice how all those thoughts are obviously about her desire to kill Raff, but can be read as sexual desire. She even talks about her attraction to Raff to one of the other girls, something she would not be doing if she was trying to keep those thoughts secret.

She's really clever and has figured out an interesting way to stay in character and retain her inner self...what she can't suppress she re-interprets. The upper layer of her consciousness may not even be fully aware that she's not a girl with a crush on the cute foreign guy, but Arya is under there, steering Mercy where she needs her to be.

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I don't know if people assume that Arya was on an assasination mission because she took Needle with her but I don't agree with that.



First of all, the Needle belongs to Arya Stark who has no place in HoB&W. It does not make sense to use that as an assasination weapon. The KM would never agree to it and as far as he knows, Arya should have dumped it into the canal long ago.



Second, although Arya is heavily immersed into the Mercy persona in this chapter, we see that some of her thoughts belong to Arya Stark, not Mercy. (i.e. the gods have given me a gift upon seeing Raff. Who is this me? Arya Stark, not Mercy. And who is the girl who wants to see the dragons, Mercy or Arya?)



And given that Bran is desperately trying to reach her, I think this chapter shows that Arya is still struggling to be no one. Arya Stark is showing up through the false identity.



I think Arya will soon leave or be expelled from the House.



I think


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I don't know if people assume that Arya was on an assasination mission because she took Needle with her but I don't agree with that.

First of all, the Needle belongs to Arya Stark who has no place in HoB&W. It does not make sense to use that as an assasination weapon. The KM would never agree to it and as far as he knows, Arya should have dumped it into the canal long ago.

Second, although Arya is heavily immersed into the Mercy persona in this chapter, we see that some of her thoughts belong to Arya Stark, not Mercy. (i.e. the gods have given me a gift upon seeing Raff. Who is this me? Arya Stark, not Mercy. And who is the girl who wants to see the dragons, Mercy or Arya?)

And given that Bran is desperately trying to reach her, I think this chapter shows that Arya is still struggling to be no one. Arya Stark is showing up through the false identity.

I think Arya will soon leave or be expelled from the House.

I think

I don't think it was ever stated she had needle was it? Just that she had a skilky sword or something along those lines.

Also Bran is trying to reach Arya? I must've missed that. Where does the text say that?

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I don't think it was ever stated she had needle was it? Just that she had a skilky sword or something along those lines.

Also Bran is trying to reach Arya? I must've missed that. Where does the text say that?

I assumed that the blade belonged to Arya but probably I am wrong. Still the point about multiple personalities in that chapter is valid.

Arya/Nymeria in her wolf dreams was being chased by a weirwood tree, which is most probably Bran.

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