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How would you rate episode 409?  

896 members have voted

  1. 1. What's your rating from 1-10, with 10 being the highest/best

    • 1
      33
    • 2
      13
    • 3
      13
    • 4
      21
    • 5
      36
    • 6
      45
    • 7
      80
    • 8
      139
    • 9
      215
    • 10
      298


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A 9 from me, though I suspect I many have liked it more if I hadn't read the novels. For once, they finally have an episode that is set solely in the one location, and though I'd have preferred they'd done this with the Purple Wedding episode, which I still feel was an overhyped missed opportunity, I think they did the right thing here. The main problem with the episode for me is that it didn't surprise me. I've had more grievances and nits with this season than any other, but it's developed through the last few episodes into something truly fine, a real high water mark in the series, and I expected this to be a strong episode in keeping with that rise in quality but without the punch of the last few episodes. Some reservations about pacing aside, however, it was very well handled. I can't picture too many people going lower than an 8, because diversions from the novel (San's 'nothing' speech, Tormund injuring Allister, then being captured) were actually minor and judicious. The main change here is that Jon sees Ygritte being killed, though along with the fact we see a lot of her in this episode, this is actually for a change stronger than what was actually in the books. We won't hear any more the lovely Ygritte's sexy Yorkshire tones, and here she gets a proper send-off. Among the character omissions, though, I still think Rattleshirt's could prove to be quite problematic later: c'est la vie.



A few points of minor interest unconnected to my rating: - Ygritte's use of the word 'minge'; although it's mostly used in England, it is actually an old Scottish word, meaning 'drizzle', so apparently Westeros does have its equivalents to the cultural transactions between the old English and the Scots. Also, unrelatedly, the first chapter (for non-readers' sake) after Oberyn's death is actually a Dany chapter - I believe the one where she exiles jorah Mormont - so although the chronology in the series is not exact, they've started following it a bit more closely than in the last few seasons, I think, before.


Edited by The Killer Snark

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4. On the one hand, it was definitely fun and enjoyable as a battle episode, but on the other hand, it's the worst episode in the season for my money.



I guess big battles are such a financial black hole that it really requires a HUUUUUGE amount of money to make them look good, because this still looked kind of cheap and small scale, despite the undoubted tons of resources they must have put into it. There just isn't a sense of 100,000 being on the other side (even though this was just a test skirmish) - they could have done with more CGI "filler crowd" down at the forest, or perhaps some made-up scene down with Mance, showing the masses hanging back. Also, I can't remember if "100" was the number of NW left in the books or not, but the way this was played, too many NW were falling in relation to Wildlings, one felt that surely most of the 100 NW must be dead by now, after the "scale" of that battle.



Also, where the hell is you-know-who? It looks like they're just going to jump to Jon doing the thing with the wildlings. Might have been better to end the episode with you-know-who riding to the rescue, mirroring the end of the Blackwater episode when Tywin comes in.



Overall, certainly well done and a great effort, with some great 1v1 fights and some emotionally moving sequences (and Ygritte's death is heart-wrenching, as well as Pyp and Grenn), but still somehow disappointing. I can't help but feel they must have lost a bit of momentum among the general public with this episode.


Edited by Peter George Stewart

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I give it a 9. I'm saving my 10 for next week. But this was so well done and I was on the edge of my seat the entire episode. I was so happy to have an episode dedicated to the story at the Wall, so long overdue for them to get this type of focus. It was really great.


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I gave it a 9. Should've been a 10 if they ended with Stannis, only bc the finale is going to be ridicously rushed unless they do Jon being elected LC at the beginning of next season, which I don't like, if that were the case we didn't need Brienne and Pod until next yr, Jaimie and Tyrion talking about beetles, or Crasters, idk, but I absolutely LOVED Thorne in this episode, they made him into one BAMF. Of we both live you can go on hating me and I can go on wishing that wilding bitch of yours finished the job lol

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Why was everyone surprised that Stannis didn't show up? In the book he didn't show up at the end of the first battle, so at least that part was faithful to the novel.


Edited by storm.131

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Not going to lie, people giving it a 10/10 seriously infuriates me. If most people liked this empty Hollywood hunk of shit, there is no hope for Game of Thrones nor is there any hope for cinema in general. It deserves a 6 at most.


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Very solid 9, I have only given a few 9's for the entire series.

Pretty much enjoyed every bit from beginning to end. Liked how Jon learned from his fight and spit blood in the Thenns eye to get an advantage. Loved Sam dropping the F bomb at the gate, think his balls dropped finally. Really liked the giant shooting the arrow up the wall, yes it's unrealistic but it was a stunning visual with the body landing in the middle of the battle on the other side.

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There just isn't a sense of 100,000 being on the other side (even though this was just a test skirmish) - they could have done with more CGI "filler crowd" down at the forest, or perhaps some made-up scene down with Mance, showing the masses hanging back.

I don't understand this. You know Mance only sent a small force to test the wall yet you simultaneously complain that there weren't 100k of them. The point is that even a small force almost broke through and defeated the NW, so they'll need a miracle to get through it, hence Jon going to assassinate Mance. The dialogue makes it clear, a preliminary force almost wins so they're going to get smashed if someone doesn't try to take out Mance, and this will just set up the future events that obviously I won't discuss in a no spoiler thread.

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A 9 from me, though I suspect I many have liked it more if I hadn't read the novels. For once, they finally have an episode that is set solely in the one location, and though I'd have preferred they'd done this with the Red Wedding episode, which I still feel was an overhyped missed opportunity, I think they did the right thing here. The main problem with the episode for me is that it didn't surprise me. I've had more grievances and nits with this season than any other, but it's developed through the last few episodes into something truly fine, a real high water mark in the series, and I expected this to be a strong episode in keeping with that rise in quality but without the punch of the last few episodes. Some reservations about pacing aside, however, it was very well handled. I can't picture too many people going lower than an 8, because diversions from the novel (San's 'nothing' speech, Tormund injuring Allister, then being captured) were actually minor and judicious. The main change here is that Jon sees Ygritte being killed, though along with the fact we see a lot of her in this episode, this is actually for a change stronger than what was actually in the books. We won't hear any more the lovely Ygritte's sexy Yorkshire tones, and here she gets a proper send-off. Among the character omissions, though, I still think Rattleshirt's could prove to be quite problematic later: c'est la vie.

A few points of minor interest unconnected to my rating: - Ygritte's use of the word 'minge'; although it's mostly used in England, it is actually an old Scottish word, meaning 'drizzle', so apparently Westeros does have its equivalents to the cultural transactions between the old English and the Scots. Also, unrelatedly, the first chapter (for non-readers' sake) after Oberyn's death is actually a Dany chapter - I believe the one where she exiles jorah Mormont - so although the chronology in the series is not exact, they've started following it a bit more closely than in the last few seasons, I think, before.

Wasn't "Blackwater" all in KL?

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Oh yeah, it was, if I recall. I was referring to this season, though. The fact the RW didn't take up a whole episode infuriates me, even now.


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Just watched the ending again. Was not sure about it the first time, but I actually like it and here is why:


- it puts more focus on the Nightswatch, because now it does matter that they managed to hold the castle themselves. With Stannis showing up it would very likely have seemes a lot like just him saving the day and the fact that the Nightswatch really managed to stand against this first attack adds some credit to their importance.


- the viewers really have the feeling that all is lost now, because it can settle in for a week. It might have been just a little too similar to Blackwater otherwise, when it ends again with someone arriving by surprise that turns things around. Now instead the battle is pretty much over, but hope is lost and it can stick with people for a while.


- I like that the scene of Jon leaving to talk with Mance stands a little more on its own now and is not squeezed in between two spectacular battles. The scene back then when reading felt a little "Harry Potterish" to me (i hope at least some people get what scene exactly I mean) and I think ending it with him wandering of just sets up very nice tension for a big finale.


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Not going to lie, people giving it a 10/10 seriously infuriates me. If most people liked this empty Hollywood hunk of shit, there is no hope for Game of Thrones nor is there any hope for cinema in general. It deserves a 6 at most.

Maybe they liked Jon and Sam being teenagers talking about you know, sex and stuff.

But yeah 10/10 for this? Don't get me wrong the CGI was good and all but really?

Edited by The Red Melli

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Just watched the ending again. Was not sure about it the first time, but I actually like it and here is why:

- it puts more focus on the Nightswatch, because now it does matter that they managed to hold the castle themselves. With Stannis showing up it would very likely have seemes a lot like just him saving the day and the fact that the Nightswatch really managed to stand against this first attack adds some credit to their importance.

Bingo.

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Oh yeah, it was, if I recall. I was referring to this season, though. The fact the RW didn't take up a whole episode infuriates me, even now.

Do you really mean the RW? Or do you mean the PW? I could agree on the latter, but the RW really doesn't cover enough for a whole episode and the fact that it seems maybe a little bit like a "sidestory" adds a lot to it's tension in my view.

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Where the frack is my Stannis?

Why Pyp and Green are dead?

Im a purist. Its a 6.

Stannis is still on the way. He'll show up.

It was good that is why i gave it a 7. But surely you also agree that Stannis should have been in this episode.

No, I don't have to agree with that - it's going to be fine when Jon goes into the camp and we then get to see what 100,000 wildlings looks like and how fucked the NW truly are.

OH MY GOD AN OPINION THREAD WHERE PEOPLE GIVE THEIR OPINIONS! You should just stop posting.

It would be great if people gave opinions of the show and not just other peoples opinions or name calling.

Did you miss the part where Jon explains that this was a preliminary force to test the strength of Castle Black and that eventually their numbers would easily overwhelm the NW? They didn't send 100k.

Pretty much this. This was the set up. This was the fight to set up the battle. We get to see it as all holy hell, and Mance hasn't even sent in his army.

The episode was ok - I'm much more interested in the politics and intrigue, so an episode of mostly just a battle isn't as interesting to me. For what they were doing, they did fine.

Thorne was a badass - he ALMOST sounded like he was going to be nice to Snow and then dicked him.

Snow - Kit's very much coming into his own, though the Ygritte scene looked like it was a dress rehearsal and not the real thing. Course, since they haven't seen each other in forever, might be forgiven.

Sam - did an amazing job this episode, I just wish we got a little less of them so that what - may - happen later is that much more a surprise/event.

Ygritte - Rose looked wooden. Maybe that was her trying to portray showing no feelings, but it didn't come across well.

I give it a 7. Fight was fine, the giant arrow through the NW was cool, Ghost looked great for the 3 seconds he was there, but just didn't have the oomph I expect based on the source material.

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No, I don't have to agree with that - it's going to be fine when Jon goes into the camp and we then get to see what 100,000 wildlings looks like and how fucked the NW truly are.

I don't think i was talking to you. No need to reply. I know your stance fully well.

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It's interesting to see what the triggers are. People are having specific scenes or interactions get changed, mutilated or even left out and pinning it mostly on the specific episode. I think this season has been very good up to this point, but I think there has probably been 3 episodes worth of screen time that really hasn't added to the series as it stands now.



For example, Missandei & GreyWorm. I don't see any value in that romance story. The hint there being that GW may not be a eunuch (fine, it's a change from the books for what we know now) just goes against everything we've been given/shown/told. if we find out in the next book that GW isn't actually a eunuch (somehow) and there is a romance for him, cool. But right now that seems like a waste where there definitely have been things missed or cut short that should have (in my opinion) been given better time.



Less talk of crushing beetles, more talk of Oberyn/Mountain. Less Missandei, more prep at the Wall.

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They'll likely have Jon in Mance's Tent when Stannis arrives. They'll show maybe a minute or so of his soldiers riding in attacking with Stannis in the back doing his normal smirk. Mean while, I'll be laughing my ass off at the fact that this forum will once again be exploding into childish whining because "OMG, D&D hate stannis?!?"



It will be hilarious. :devil:


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They'll likely have Jon in Mance's Tent when Stannis arrives. They'll show maybe a minute or so of his soldiers riding in attacking with Stannis in the back doing his normal smirk. Mean while, I'll be laughing my ass off at the fact that this forum will once again be exploding into childish whining because "OMG, D&D hate stannis?!?"

It will be hilarious. :devil:

I will be content with watching you moaners defend D&D.

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