Khal Jhaqo will be dragon food… what a nonsense!

[IRON BANK]

I don’t think Aegon did not ride Stormcloud because the dragon was not big enough to carry him. On the contrary, I think Aegon was not old enough to be allowed to ride his dragon. Since Stormcloud was able to carry him across the Narrow Sea with a bellyful of arrows and a scorpion bolt in the neck, I think it is quite possible that he was as large as Drogon, maybe even larger than him.

Stormcloud died from his wounds. That is plural, which means he did not die only from the wound at his neck. A belly full of arrows should kill a dragon slowly IMO.

The Dothraki start shooting arrows from horseback since they are 4 years old. I think they are quite capable of shooting Drogon where they like from that close range. Even if their horses go mad, they can always jump from their horses.

The arakhs of the Dothraki can do serious damage to his wings.

It is hard to slay a dragon without using a dragon but it is possible and they did it several times. Drogon is not Balerion. He might be lethally wounded by 50 Dothraki even if he manages to kill them all. Who better knows the Dothraki and Drogon better than Dany? I don’t think she will risk a fight.

In Tpatq and the awoiaf prequel mature dragons have hard scale and arrows from far away do not penetrate the body. up close arrows, spears and scorpions can do major damage. However it is hard to do so because of the reach of dragon flame and the movement of scorpions can be to slow on approach.

[Mithras]

But we can surely agree that Dany would normally not be so stupid as to attack them, tactics and chances of winning aside ;)

:agree: :cheers:

Exactly: Dany has control of drogon, these people need to re read. Also The dragon flight will speed her story along.

In that quote, it is plainly written that Dany could not steer Drogon wherever she wanted sometimes. Whatever the enlightenment she has been through at the end of that chapter, she did not try to do anything against Drogon’s will as far as we saw. Drogon followed the scout and flew to the horses willingly because that was what he came for. So, we cannot say that she has full control over Drogon when Jhaqo arrived.

In Tpatq and the awoiaf prequel mature dragons have hard scale and arrows from far away do not penetrate the body. up close arrows, spears and scorpions can do major damage. However it is hard to do so because of the reach of dragon flame and the movement of scorpions can be to slow on approach.

Dragon flame pouring out was described as a lance or a spear. That means the effective hitting radius is small and it can only get bigger as the dragon gets bigger. The fire of the dragon also gets hotter as the dragon gets bigger. Dany’s hatchlings could not cook their own meat for a while. There is also the physical fact that a jet of flame gets cooled as it travels through the ambient air.

So, Drogon’s fire is not deadly unless one gets directly hit by the jet from close range, like the slaver in Astapor.

[jet199]

I'm a bit torn by this. I do think Dany could kill Khal Jhaqo but where is that going to get her? Dany might want to go to Vaes Dothrak but she wont want to be put in with the crones. However she is almost certainly going to meet up with the crones so it may well be that she goes with Khal Jhaqo willingly rather than staring a fight. Sort of like the willing abduction she imagines at her wedding to Hizdahr. I get from the end of her last chapter that she is waiting to see how they will react to her rather than going on the offensive.

[ForgottenKnight]

There are a lot of angry walls of text so I'm just going to say I agree with the op. I don't see a compelling story if Kahl Jhaquo falls over dead and Dany has been on a downward spiral. I think she'll be taken in chains and abused in many horrible ways before she is able to get free and take command of the khalasar or be rescued. Just my thoughts. GRRM isn't the "everything's going to be okay" kind of storyteller.

[BastardlyRock]

I have no clue what's going to happen. I had no clue when I first read it and I still have no clue now. My feelings lean towards Drogon not roasting them, but whether they take her, she takes them, if she finds some way to kill Jhaqo and reclaim the khalasar ... I don't know. :dunno:

[PatrickStormborn]

A lot of what happens in Dany's final ADwD chapter is ambiguous... I just never thought I'd see the day where we argue about the one solid conclusion we can actually draw from that chapter: Dany is found standing next to Drogon, who has not somehow flown away without Dany noticing.

[Angalin]

Mod note: discuss opinions, not people. If you can't discuss a possible scenario politely, back out of the thread and find something else to talk about.

[Natasi]

I think the ship of Dany being taken to Vaes Dothrak against her will and held there has already sailed. She escaped that fate already and I'm not sure that the text benefits from revisiting it. To me, it would be like Joffrey being resurrected as un-Joff and forcing Sansa to be betrothed to him and humiliated/beaten/abused like she was in Kings Landing and like she would have remained to be if their marriage had ever gone through. It's a bullet that Sansa has already dodged, I believe that also applies to Dany being subject to the punishment the Dosh Khaleen may inflict upon her if she was captured and brought to them. She's already avoided that so why bring it up again?

I'm sure her story won't be on the up and up from now on, and she is sure to experience lower lows and whatnot as others have argued is per Grrm's writing style; I'm just not convinced he would rehash an old threat to do it.

[Mithras]

I think the ship of Dany being taken to Vaes Dothrak against her will and held there has already sailed. She escaped that fate already and I'm not sure that the text benefits from revisiting it. To me, it would be like Joffrey being resurrected as un-Joff and forcing Sansa to be betrothed to him and humiliated/beaten/abused like she was in Kings Landing and like she would have remained to be if their marriage had ever gone through. It's a bullet that Sansa has already dodged, I believe that also applies to Dany being subject to the punishment the Dosh Khaleen may inflict upon her if she was captured and brought to them. She's already avoided that so why bring it up again?

I'm sure her story won't be on the up and up from now on, and she is sure to experience lower lows and whatnot as others have argued is per Grrm's writing style; I'm just not convinced he would rehash an old threat to do it.

Glad you posted this.

Beneath the Mother of Mountains, a line of naked crones crept from a great lake and knelt shivering before her, their grey heads bowed.

This is the vision Dany saw in HotU, which foretells that Dany will be the Stallion that Mounts the World and all will kneel before her. That will happen in VD.

“…want to wake the dragon…”

Ghosts lined the hallway, dressed in the faded raiment of kings. In their hands were swords of pale fire. They had hair of silver and hair of gold and hair of platinum white, and their eyes were opal and amethyst, tourmaline and jade. “Faster,” they cried, “faster, faster.” She raced, her feet melting the stone wherever they touched. “Faster!” the ghosts cried as one, and she screamed and threw herself forward. A great knife of pain ripped down her back, and she felt her skin tear open and smelled the stench of burning blood and saw the shadow of wings. And Daenerys Targaryen flew.

“…wake the dragon…”

The door loomed before her, the red door, so close, so close, the hall was a blur around her, the cold receding behind. And now the stone was gone and she flew across the Dothraki sea, high and higher, the green rippling beneath, and all that lived and breathed fled in terror from the shadow of her wings. She could smell home, she could see it, there, just beyond that door, green fields and great stone houses and arms to keep her warm, there. She threw open the door.

This is from Dany’s fever dreams and it foretells that she will be the Stallion that Mounts the World and all will flee before her.

This will happen in VD when Dany becomes Drogon, by which I mean she will have a full control on him similar to Bran-Summer. This is not the case yet as of the end of ADwD.

Note that being the Stallion is one of her highest points and she should climb there from a very low point. This is backed by the test because the moment before she becomes Drogon in the dream, she feels a great pain from growing her wings. I think Dany did not hit the bottom as of the end of ADwD and she will have a hard time before she finally fulfills the prophecy in VD and unites the Dothraki.

PS: I don't think The Stallion will be a good figure. I think Dany will be the equivalent of Genghis Khan in Essos. She will conquer much of Essos and leave enormous amounts of dead in her wake.

[RoamingRonin]

PS: I don't think The Stallion will be a good figure. I think Dany will be the equivalent of Genghis Khan in Essos. She will conquer much of Essos and leave enormous amounts of dead in her wake.

Good. Considering half the world is coming against her simply because she broke the slave trade. Let her litter Essos with the corpses of her enemies before she journeys to Westeros.

[Mithras]

Good. Considering half the world is coming against her simply because she broke the slave trade. Let her litter Essos with the corpses of her enemies before she journeys to Westeros.

The corpses that overflew Astapor didnot belong to her enemies.

[RoamingRonin]

The corpses that overflew Astapor did not belong to her enemies.

Her enemies will suffer for that as well.

[Lyanna<3Rhaegar]

Good. Considering half the world is coming against her simply because she broke the slave trade. Let her litter Essos with the corpses of her enemies before she journeys to Westeros.

:agree:

[House Ross]

Dany alone with no dragon vs. 51 Doths......she is raped, and raped some more. Possibly kept as a sex slave. How ironic.

Something tells me the story won't go that way, especially after his recent interview regarding the direction Dany is heading in TWoW. "And Dany has embraced her heritage as a Targaryen and embraced the Targaryen words." Binding to ones dragon has been mentioned in the novels. The Mother of Dragons binding to Drogon seems reasonable. What else does she have to do? I realize dragons are wild, if not thee wildest of beasts, but Targs had been doing it for centuries.

We wont be reading about how Drogon totally bailed on her. She stands next to Drogon, Drogon stands next to her. Accept it. Its ok.

[HexMachina]

Sorry to revive the thread, but as part of a re-read project I was looking over Barristan's chapter. Drogon had killed two hundred and fourteen people, and three times as many were burned or injured. To imagine he would be no threat to the Dothraki would contradict the damage he has shown himself to be capable of

[Mithras]

Sorry to revive the thread, but as part of a re-read project I was looking over Barristan's chapter. Drogon had killed two hundred and fourteen people, and three times as many were burned or injured. To imagine he would be no threat to the Dothraki would contradict the damage he has shown himself to be capable of

He had dreamed of it again last night: Belwas on his knees retching up bile and blood, Hizdahr urging on the dragonslayers, men and women fleeing in terror, fighting on the steps, climbing over one another, screaming and shouting. And Daenerys …

Her hair was aflame. She had the whip in her hand and she was shouting, then she was on the dragon’s back, flying. The sand that Drogon stirred as he took wing had stung Ser Barristan’s eyes, but through a veil of tears he had watched the beast fly from the pit, his great black wings slapping at the shoulders of the bronze warriors at the gates.

The rest he learned later. Beyond the gates had been a solid press of people. Maddened by the smell of dragon, horses below reared in terror, lashing out with iron-shod hooves. Food stalls and palanquins alike were overturned, men knocked down and trampled. Spears were thrown, crossbows were fired. Some struck home. The dragon twisted violently in the air, wounds smoking, the girl clinging to his back. Then he loosed the fire.

It had taken the rest of the day and most of the night for the Brazen Beasts to gather up the corpses. The final count was two hundred fourteen slain, three times as many burned or wounded. Drogon was gone from the city by then, last seen high over the Skahazadhan, flying north.

Those people were closely packed together and pressed against the gates, unable to move or run. Drogon swept over them burning as he liked. Still, much of them must have been stampeded to death by themselves. That does not give us anything about the situation with the Dothraki. If anything, the fight inside the pit might be taken similarly and there were a handful of spearmen attacking Drogon one by one.

[MoIaF]

Sorry to revive the thread, but as part of a re-read project I was looking over Barristan's chapter. Drogon had killed two hundred and fourteen people, and three times as many were burned or injured. To imagine he would be no threat to the Dothraki would contradict the damage he has shown himself to be capable of

Good point. Also, consider that Drogon is capable of controlling the force of his flames as we saw when he only burn the tokar of the Yunkai envoy when he was meeting with Dany in her tent. If he did not hit the horse with the full force of his flames then it's not surprising the horse kept on moving. Even when a human is engulfed in flames they can continue to move.

Drogon could have been merely been "playing" with his food and just extending the thrill of the catch.

[joluoto2]

Everyone knows a good meal take some time to prepare.

[PatrickStormborn]

Sorry to revive the thread, but as part of a re-read project I was looking over Barristan's chapter. Drogon had killed two hundred and fourteen people, and three times as many were burned or injured. To imagine he would be no threat to the Dothraki would contradict the damage he has shown himself to be capable of

Great point. Also, to repeat myself, none of them were on horseback, and we know that horses are terrified of the dragons (even the scout's horse reacts to Drogon despite him flying a mile away).

[HexMachina]

Great point. Also, to repeat myself, none of them were on horseback, and we know that horses are terrified of the dragons (even the scout's horse reacts to Drogon despite him flying a mile away).

I realised now that it wasn't necessarily Drogon who killed 214 people now, some were likely crushed in the chaos (like the Yunkish commander) but I still think that Drogon was responsible for a large number of those deaths and injuries. Its clear though that Drogon is incredibly dangerous